Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread: Spinning our Rud-wheels all summer long...

[Ugene Magic]

Yeah doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. We’ll see what happens, but for some reason people are going to be shocked that GMs probably value a 26 year old goalie that’s won 2 cups.

That's what we are hoping for, and in reality, it shouldn't shock anyone if he finds success again elsewhere. Teams looking for his services have much younger cores. He's just not worth that cost for risk of failure here. Call this team stagnant if you will.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I'm with Molon. This team needs more offense. Actually, what they need is more offense from different sources. It cannot all be generated by the two superstars or the power play.

If an offensive third center does not work because of how we want to play, then how we want to play is the problem.

We've got now, on paper, maybe the best top 6 of the Sid/Geno era. In any case it's a really good, complete group. I want to see what Poulin can contribute on the 3rd line, Legare the same another season down the road. Lafferty in the lineup somewhere, hopefully for ZAR, will help. Replacing Sheary, Marleau and ZAR with Kapanen, Poulin and Lafferty will improve the offense.

Any additional offense needs to come from the back end. Letang is Letang. I expect steps forward from Pettersson, Marino, and POJ once he gets into the linup. Schultz was plain bad, but there's no guarantee the replacement is any better.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Unless the Avs go on a run and they're the highest bidder, I'd definitely be looking to get this done soon. Agreed.

Put the pressure on teams to make a decision.

I hope the AVs lose in game 7 and get real reactionary about having to play their 3rd string goalie in an elimination game (though he has won 2 straight). Empty the clip for Murray.

Would you guys do:

PIT: Compher, Zadorov, Francouz(cap dump)
COL: Murray, McCann

We get our 3C and our 3rd pairing D, done and done. Zadorov isn't a great fit for JJ, but I think he might be great with Pettersson or POJ, and I hope both are playing over JJ next season by mid season.

 

[wheelz87]

It sucks like... I don’t even know what I want in a trade for Murray. No matter what, I feel we will lose the deal and it will be underwhelming. Larsson? Pool party? Woof. Draft picks? I mean.. I guess. A guy like Compher might be alright.. but then Horny is gone? Any forward we bring in will further block Poulin... A 3C or top defensemen would be great I guess, obviously.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

We've got now, on paper, maybe the best top 6 of the Sid/Geno era. In any case it's a really good, complete group. I want to see what Poulin can contribute on the 3rd line, Legare the same another season down the road. Lafferty in the lineup somewhere, hopefully for ZAR, will help. Replacing Sheary, Marleau and ZAR with Kapanen, Poulin and Lafferty will improve the offense.

Any additional offense needs to come from the back end. Letang is Letang. I expect steps forward from Pettersson, Marino, and POJ once he gets into the linup. Schultz was plain bad, but there's no guarantee the replacement is any better.

If you could guarantee me that Poulin would be in the lineup regularly in 2020-21, and that Legare and Joseph would follow in 2021-22, great. Put me down. I highly doubt this team, with its warped win-now attitude, will go in that direction. But even if you are right and we both get what we want, I would STILL want a better offensive third center than Bjugstad, McCann, Blueger, whatever.

When we had Staal, we did not have this issue. When Phil Kessel and Nick Bonino were on our third line, we did not have this issue. We won Cups.

And back then, Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin were a heck of a lot younger, healthier and better overall.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If you could guarantee me that Poulin would be in the lineup regularly in 2020-21, and that Legare and Joseph would follow in 2021-22, great. Put me down. I highly doubt this team, with its warped win-now attitude, will go in that direction. But even if you are right and we both get what we want, I would STILL want a better offensive third center than Bjugstad, McCann, Blueger, whatever.

When we had Staal, we did not have this issue. When Phil Kessel and Nick Bonino were on our third line, we did not have this issue. We won Cups.

And back then, Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin were a heck of a lot younger, healthier and better overall.

How is trying to maximize the remaining years of Crosby and Malkin a "warped win-now attitude"?

The idea that this team should rebuild with so few years left of Crosby and Malkin makes no sense to me. Do you want to piss away the rest of their careers? Because that's how you do it.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I hope the AVs lose in game 7 and get real reactionary about having to play their 3rd string goalie in an elimination game (though he has won 2 straight). Empty the clip for Murray.

Would you guys do:

PIT: Compher, Zadorov, Francouz(cap dump)
COL: Murray, McCann

We get our 3C and our 3rd pairing D, done and done. Zadorov isn't a great fit for JJ, but I think he might be great with Pettersson or POJ, and I hope both are playing over JJ next season by mid season.

Zadorov is a left defenseman. Plays with Ian Cole a lot, but as we all know Cole can play both sides. Not sure Zadorov would be a fit as the Schultz replacement.

That said, I'd love to have Zadorov.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Zadorov is a left defenseman. Plays with Ian Cole a lot, but as we all know Cole can play both sides. Not sure Zadorov would be a fit as the Schultz replacement.

That said, I'd love to have Zadorov.

I was under the impression that Zadorov, despite being left handed, plays the right a lot.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

How is trying to maximize the remaining years of Crosby and Malkin a "warped win-now attitude"?

The idea that this team should rebuild with so few years left of Crosby and Malkin makes no sense to me. Do you want to piss away the rest of their careers? Because that's how you do it.

News flash...we are already pissing away the rest of their careers...and also the early years of the likes of Jarry, Marino, Poulin, Pettersson, Joseph, Maniscalco, Legare et al.

You are delusional if you think Rutherford can fix this to the point where they can get back to the finals.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I was under the impression that Zadorov, despite being left handed, plays the right a lot.

I don't know. I do know that Cole plays a lot on the right side, and Girard can easily play both as well.

 

[Gurglesons]

Zadorov is horrible.

 

[pensfan71]

Zadorov is horrible.

Lmfao big facts, imagining him and JJ on this team makes my whole body convulse

 

[Empoleon8771]

News flash...we are already pissing away the rest of their careers...and also the early years of the likes of Jarry, Marino, Poulin, Pettersson, Joseph, Maniscalco, Legare et al.

You are delusional if you think Rutherford can fix this to the point where they can get back to the finals.

And you're delusional to think that this team somehow won't be absolutely atrocious after Crosby, Malkin and Letang leave. There is 0 way that Rutherford can "build for the future" to replace that much.

If you want to be a fan of a rebuilding team, I'd recommend the Senators. Because the Penguins trying to retool while Crosby and Malkin are in their mid 30s is grade A stupid.

 

[DesertPenguin]

It sucks like... I don’t even know what I want in a trade for Murray. No matter what, I feel we will lose the deal and it will be underwhelming. Larsson? Pool party? Woof. Draft picks? I mean.. I guess. A guy like Compher might be alright.. but then Horny is gone? Any forward we bring in will further block Poulin... A 3C or top defensemen would be great I guess, obviously.

Compher plays a lot of C, takes draws as a right hander. I'd pencil him in at 3C and move McCann. Horny is probably gone next year though to make room for Marino.

 

[66-30-33]

And you're delusional to think that this team somehow won't be absolutely atrocious after Crosby, Malkin and Letang leave. There is 0 way that Rutherford can "build for the future" to replace that much.

If you want to be a fan of a rebuilding team, I'd recommend the Senators. Because the Penguins trying to retool while Crosby and Malkin are in their mid 30s is grade A stupid.

Crosbys final few seasons he will be a part of this rebuild, don't see him retiring until he's at least 40.

 

[Peat]

I'm with Molon. This team needs more offense. Actually, what they need is more offense from different sources. It cannot all be generated by the two superstars or the power play.

If an offensive third center does not work because of how we want to play, then how we want to play is the problem.

Are there any teams in the NHL who succeed with three centres better in the offensive zone than they are in the attacking zone?

 

[SEALBound]

They've tried that. For the past few seasons guys have moved up and down the lineup (sans Sid/Geno) with little to no success. Our top wingers are frankly not good enough to carry a line by themselves - they typically rely on Sid/Geno (though that's not to say they're ONLY good because of them). A line with McCann, Hornqvist/whomever is solid on paper. After 3 seasons of feeling good about the roster and balance - it's time to call a spade a spade. This team has 2 offensive lines, 1 invisible line that they can't decide be defensive or offensive, and an above average defensive fourth line that might get a goal every 15 games in the regular season and maybe once or twice in an entire playoff.

My comment earlier was relating to the fact that this team need another creative C - not a hodgepodge of McCann/Bjugstad (vomit), Blueger etc with thoughts and prayers that it works. Our top 2 guys are still above average come playoffs and elite in the regular season - but are both susceptible to extreme defensive measures that we've seen over the past 3-5 seasons dating back to Guy Boucher. They're only getting slower and will only have a harder and harder time scoring/creating. So either we stick with that, then go defensive on the 3/4 lines and hope to win 2-1 hockey games (to which a coach like Boucher would be the best possible option) - or we go after more offense (even at the expense of individual defense)

Agreed. I think also you can make that 3rd line more offensive if you select the correct LW (under the assumption that McCann is 3C and Horny is RW). If you can get a playmaking LW, that line could be good. I talked earlier in the other thread about how it's tough to build a line around Hornqvist when he's not a guy worth building a line around. Its about finding that right mix and right now I don't think we have the right mix to make a good 3rd line but I also don't think JR is done building...not by a long shot. I think he will look to make a third line that works and then a top 9 line up where you can mix and match. I wouldn't object to promoting Tanev to a 3rd line role and trying to match some skill and playmaking abilities with the LW and C. Perhaps Poulin-Tierney/Compher-Tanev? Something like that. Then make a strictly defensive line of XXXX-Bleuger-Hornqvist.

Unless there is retention that is pretty bad. we can't afford a 7 million dollar MAF. And Horny has much more value than that.

I think the 5.25 from Horny and the 3.25 from Johnson was supposed to cover the $7mil from MAF and whoever the 3C is (we do have room). But point well taken. Wasn't advocating, just contributing to discussion with the Madden rumor.

Saw that Ryan Wilson suggested Puljujarvi for Murray. Even as a joke, no....

For a guy that is a hard line stat whore, he makes terrible trade proposals.

I was arguing with someone else about Murray vs Holtby, and after looking at their numbers, I'm shocked for how similar of numbers they have put up since Murray broke into the NHL. They're almost identical in both the regular season and playoffs, with Murray being at a .914 regular season save% and a .921 playoff save% while Holtby is at a .913 regular season save% and a .921 playoff save%.

I'm not really sure why some fans seem to think Murray is washed up and teams would rather sign Holtby over trading for Murray. Holtby and Murray are basically equal at this point, but Holtby is like 5 years older and likely more expensive.

I tell people this too in that the biggest value Murray has over literally all of the available goalies, is that he's 4-5 years younger. For emerging teams, that could be huge. He fits very well with several young cores. GMs will indeed see value in that.

Horny,McCann for Bonino,Järnkrok,2nd
Murray for Timmons,2nd
2nd,2nd,johnson,bjustgad for tierney,brown

guentzel - crosby - rust
zucker - malkin - kap
tierney - bonino - brown
jarnkrok - tb - tanev


Granlund cheap 1 year deal until Poulin can push down zucker to the third line next year. Find a RD for our third pairing.

You're getting good at these!

I hope the AVs lose in game 7 and get real reactionary about having to play their 3rd string goalie in an elimination game (though he has won 2 straight). Empty the clip for Murray.

Would you guys do:

PIT: Compher, Zadorov, Francouz(cap dump)
COL: Murray, McCann

We get our 3C and our 3rd pairing D, done and done. Zadorov isn't a great fit for JJ, but I think he might be great with Pettersson or POJ, and I hope both are playing over JJ next season by mid season.

It makes me apprehensive and I'm on the fence which means it's probably fair. My bias wants it to be a blowout win for us but in reality, that rarely happens.

Zadorov is horrible.

Except when you watch him play but don't let that get in the way of your pre-determined agenda.

 

[pistolpete11]

They don't need an offensive 3C, per se, but they need somebody that drive offense on the third line because it ain't gonna be Hornqvist, McCann, Simon, etc. Those guys are all varying degrees of good complimentary pieces, but you need someone that's good with the puck on their stick.

Not to keep harping on it, but this is why trading Kahun was so stupid.

 

[66-30-33]

They don't need an offensive 3C, per se, but they need somebody that drive offense on the third line because it ain't gonna be Hornqvist, McCann, Simon, etc. Those guys are all varying degrees of good complimentary pieces, but you need someone that's good with the puck on their stick.

Not to keep harping on it, but this is why trading Kahun was so stupid.

Kahun was not liked by Sullivan, he will be a decent player but not on a Sullivan coached team.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Kahun was not liked by Sullivan, he will be a decent player but not on a Sullivan coached team.

This, plus they didn't have the money to pay Kahun anyway, so a 3rd line with Kahun and McCann on it was never going to happen anyway.

 

[DesertPenguin]

They don't need an offensive 3C, per se, but they need somebody that drive offense on the third line because it ain't gonna be Hornqvist, McCann, Simon, etc. Those guys are all varying degrees of good complimentary pieces, but you need someone that's good with the puck on their stick.

Not to keep harping on it, but this is why trading Kahun was so stupid.

Poulin

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yohe on Madden right now talking about MAF. He claims that the Penguins would look at a Fleury-Jarry tandem if Fleury became available, and that Fleury would probably be the 1A and Jarry would be the 1B.

F*cking YIKES.

Also news on Murray. Yohe has heard from a number of people that a lot of teams are interested in Murray. Toronto, Colorado, Edmonton and Calgary are listed as "very interested".

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yohe on Madden right now talking about MAF. He claims that the Penguins would look at a Fleury-Jarry tandem if Fleury became available, and that Fleury would probably be the 1A and Jarry would be the 1B.

F*cking YIKES.

Here's to hoping that's just Madden gurgling into the void. But with this team lately who knows.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Here's to hoping that's just Madden gurgling into the void. But with this team lately who knows.

That was Yohe, not Madden. That's my concern. It's more legitimate than Madden saying it.

 

[mpp9]

Yohe on Madden right now talking about MAF. He claims that the Penguins would look at a Fleury-Jarry tandem if Fleury became available, and that Fleury would probably be the 1A and Jarry would be the 1B.

F*cking YIKES.

Also news on Murray. Yohe has heard from a number of people that a lot of teams are interested in Murray. Toronto, Colorado, Edmonton and Calgary are listed as "very interested".

I'll take Fleury coming back if we can land an impact player for Murray.