Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread - Marc my words, they'll get him signed

[The Old Master]

By Siberian tundra do you mean Milwaukee?

close enough.

 

[Deport Ogie]

Between the soft trade rumors pissing Geno off and also peeving Sid to the point he felt like he had to insert himself into the discussion and talk to FO directly (which he certainly is not rumored to do often), in a weird sort of way JR may have strengthened the resolve of his two stars. I look forward to the mid-year press conference when he claims it was his plan all along.

 

[Riptide]

Some gossip from Haase's piece from yesterday's skate

- Simon focused on his shot in the off-season
- Malkin looked quick
- In the second skates, Bjorkqvist was in a regular sweater (but Almari in non-contract as injured in challenge)
- AJ's put on muscle (maybe)

From the article. LOL.

 

[Peat]

Between the soft trade rumors pissing Geno off and also peeving Sid to the point he felt like he had to insert himself into the discussion and talk to FO directly (which he certainly is not rumored to do often), in a weird sort of way JR may have strengthened the resolve of his two stars. I look forward to the mid-year press conference when he claims it was his plan all along.

Tbf, his public utterances have been aimed at lighting a fire under the team for about the last year. I feel like the question has been more about whether it's been a good plan, rather than whether it's been his plan.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Some gossip from Haase's piece from yesterday's skate

- Simon focused on his shot in the off-season
- Malkin looked quick
- In the second skates, Bjorkqvist was in a regular sweater (but Almari in non-contract as injured in challenge)
- AJ's put on muscle (maybe)

I very much appreciate Haase's work.

 

[Peat]

I very much appreciate Haase's work.

Wurd. I'm reluctant to big up anything attached to DK given all I've heard of him but there's no doubting that Haase has produced more solid info on what's going on with the Pens, particularly the prospects, than just about every other beat writer this year just gone. Doesn't get the big reveals, but gets a lot of small stuff.

 

[Peat]

Schultz saying today in The Athletic that he wants to stay with the Pens for a long time.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Schultz saying today in The Athletic that he wants to stay with the Pens for a long time.

If he's willing to extend for what he's making now or less and doesn't suck this year, I'm all for it. However, I'm expecting him to want $6.5-$7 million a year, and I'd genuinely rather have Gudbranson on the 2nd pair over paying him that much.

With how good Marino looked and with Addison poised for a big season in the WHL, I'm not exactly super interested in signing Schultz long term.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I really, really want to return the sentiment but the last season or so has given me pause in regards to Schultz. And yeah... like Empo said... dude is gonna want paid and I just don't know how far that money spent really gets this defense. Schultz is an offensive defenseman... he's not a puck mover, as weird as that might sound. This defense needs a true puck mover, or two.

Plus yeah... suddenly having some really interesting options in the prospect pool changes things a little, too.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I'd sign Schultz as I'd rather have him on the team than not. Prospects are prospects and aren't sure things. Just be sure not to give Schultz a stupid NTC in the deal in case the prospects do turn out how we'd like them to.

This also depends on how Gudbranson continues to play here.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If you can move Johnson after this season and replace him with a Cole type of defenseman, or if JJ reverts back into his 2016-2017 form (he was actually solid analytically that year), would this defense be worse than what the 2016 cup team defense was:

Dumoulin-Letang
Pettersson-Gudbranson
Johnson/Cole-Marino

Even after the Scuderi for Daley trade, the defense on that 2016 team was usually something like this:

Maatta-Letang
Dumoulin-Daley
Cole-Lovejoy

A lot on whether to re-sign Schultz depends on how Marino and Gudbranson look this year. If you think that Marino can be a 2015-2016 Dumoulin for you (immediately jump into the NHL and be a reliable defenseman) and Gudbranson can be a solid #4/5 DFD for you, I don't think you re-sign Schultz.

 

[Peat]

The prospect pool does change things but I do think its probably wise to see that as something that affects the top 4 the season after next, not next season. At which point you need players to play until they're ready and I don't particularly see the need to shy away from players with term lasting beyond the reasonable hope.

I'll wait and see on how Schultz looks before commenting further, but he's always gelled well with Malkin to me and I think we're going to need someone who possesses something of his skillset there.

Most interesting question at this point though is how much his desire to stay here will be reflected in his contract demand though. Maybe he's talking for the hell of it, but he's got to know this team probably can't match the best offers he'll get.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

IMO yes... that defense is worse than 16.

Daley alone tips the scales. Cole was a little uneven at points that year but still more than competent in his role. As much as everyone bitched about Lovejoy (including myself) he was extremely steady and not prone to big hills and valleys like Guds, Johnson (OK... all valleys, there) and likely young guys like Marino and even MP would be.

The team needs an established puck mover. They never replaced Daley and it continues to show.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

If you think that Marino can be a 2015-2016 Dumoulin for you (immediately jump into the NHL and be a reliable defenseman) and Gudbranson can be a solid #4/5 DFD for you, I don't think you re-sign Schultz.

Hm? Dumoulin spent about 3 seasons in WBS.

 

[Riptide]

If he's willing to extend for what he's making now or less and doesn't suck this year, I'm all for it. However, I'm expecting him to want $6.5-$7 million a year, and I'd genuinely rather have Gudbranson on the 2nd pair over paying him that much.

With how good Marino looked and with Addison poised for a big season in the WHL, I'm not exactly super interested in signing Schultz long term.

For me it would really depend on the money and term. 6.5m+? Yeah I'd pass. 5-6m and only for 5 years? Yeah I'd probably have to do it. If Marino and Addison are ready sooner then expected (realistically both are more likely Gudbranson replacements then Schultz in the next 2-3 years), then great - that's a good situation to have and one that's much easier to deal with.

 

[Beauner]

They never replaced Daley and it continues to show.

The unfortunate part is I don't know who is out there that we could realisitally acquire that would fill that hole.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The unfortunate part is I don't know who is out there that we could realisitally acquire that would fill that hole.

It's true that I certainly don't have the answers there and those types of players aren't exactly common. But to my eyes it sure seems like that's been the missing ingredient on the back end for the last couple of seasons.

Well... that and the other thing. With the other guy. You know... whatshisname?

 

[Empoleon8771]

IMO yes... that defense is worse than 16.

Daley alone tips the scales. Cole was a little uneven at points that year but still more than competent in his role. As much as everyone *****ed about Lovejoy (including myself) he was extremely steady and not prone to big hills and valleys like Guds, Johnson (OK... all valleys, there) and likely young guys like Marino and even MP would be.

The team needs an established puck mover. They never replaced Daley and it continues to show.

I think you don't make that your defense if Gudbranson shows valleys, though. You'd only run with that defense if Gudbranson can be what Lovejoy was, a steady and reliable fringe 2nd/3rd pair guy. I also don't think you're applying the same standards to the 2016 defense as you're applying to that hypothetical 2020 defense. Cole in 2016 was still a young and inconsistent bottom pair guy. Dumoulin was a rookie that year. That year was the first year where Maatta became insanely inconsistent from year to year. That 2016 defense worked, but I don't agree that a hypothetical 2020 defense has issues that the 2016 defense didn't have outside of the puck moving ability that Daley had.

Hm? Dumoulin spent about 3 seasons in WBS.

Yeah but 2015-2016 was his first NHL season. My analogy was saying that Marino can jump into the NHL as seamlessly as Dumoulin did.

 

[Riptide]

A lot on whether to re-sign Schultz depends on how Marino and Gudbranson look this year. If you think that Marino can be a 2015-2016 Dumoulin for you (immediately jump into the NHL and be a reliable defenseman) and Gudbranson can be a solid #4/5 DFD for you, I don't think you re-sign Schultz.

A) Dumoulin didn't "immediately jump into the NHL". He played 19 games the 2 previous seasons (where other than the POs he largely looked out of place) and spent 3 years in the AHL after coming out of college. He wasn't an impact player (15/16) until his 7th season post draft.
B) Marino other than being an RD will likely never be able to replace what Schultz does. And not signing JS because of Marino just screams setting him and the team up for failure. Especially for a team that's desperate for PMD who can transition the puck.

 

[Peat]

The unfortunate part is I don't know who is out there that we could realisitally acquire that would fill that hole.

I could be out to lunch, but TJ Brodie looks the most like for like guy out there and his contract is expiring.

Prepare to eat a lot of money to get him though.

If you can move Johnson after this season and replace him with a Cole type of defenseman, or if JJ reverts back into his 2016-2017 form (he was actually solid analytically that year), would this defense be worse than what the 2016 cup team defense was:

Dumoulin-Letang
Pettersson-Gudbranson
Johnson/Cole-Marino

Even after the Scuderi for Daley trade, the defense on that 2016 team was usually something like this:

Maatta-Letang
Dumoulin-Daley
Cole-Lovejoy

A lot on whether to re-sign Schultz depends on how Marino and Gudbranson look this year. If you think that Marino can be a 2015-2016 Dumoulin for you (immediately jump into the NHL and be a reliable defenseman) and Gudbranson can be a solid #4/5 DFD for you, I don't think you re-sign Schultz.

Pettersson would have to take a solid step forwards in terms of driving play offensively, Gudzilla would have to sustain his end of season levels all season, and Marino would have to develop very quickly to his offensive ceiling for me to feel comfortable with that. I'm not sure something that involves three best case scenarios on player development is going to come true.

 

[Andy99]

For me it would really depend on the money and term. 6.5m+? Yeah I'd pass. 5-6m and only for 5 years? Yeah I'd probably have to do it. If Marino and Addison are ready sooner then expected (realistically both are more likely Gudbranson replacements then Schultz in the next 2-3 years), then great - that's a good situation to have and one that's much easier to deal with.

Yeah, I’d re-sign Schultz in a heartbeat if we could get him for a similar price for another 3-4 years...other than that, no thanks and Im saying that as someone who likes him a lot as a player when he’s on his game...

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

That 2016 defense worked, but I don't agree that a hypothetical 2020 defense has issues that the 2016 defense didn't have outside of the puck moving ability that Daley had.

Yeah but that's a pretty big difference. I'm still shocked to this day that Chicago sent him packing for f***ing Scuderi. He wasn't really working out there but my god.

The rest is pretty even but a guy like Daley really goes so, so far in making a system like Sullivan's tick. A defenseman who can skate the puck out of danger and eat up the NZ is so crucial. Hell... just ask Geno! Ha.

 

[Giant Yankee Pens]

I have a questions about Pettersson. Is he able to attend training camp without a signed contract? He's reportedly skating with the team now, but is he able to continue without a deal?

 

[wej20]

I have a questions about Pettersson. Is he able to attend training camp without a signed contract? He's reportedly skating with the team now, but is he able to continue without a deal?

I assume he'd have to sign a PTO.

 

[JackFr]

I have a questions about Pettersson. Is he able to attend training camp without a signed contract? He's reportedly skating with the team now, but is he able to continue without a deal?

They hold his rights so he can be in training camp.