Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread - Hungry for Change

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I've been operating under the assumption that JR has just playing this Wild West game of chicken with JJ and other teams for a long time. He's got this hubris about him that makes me think he's just trying to fleece someone else in a JJ deal like he did with Daley/Scuderi. The report was that there were multiple deals on the table involving JJ, and while I don't really believe Yohe at all, I certainly don't believe JR either. Everyone can be traded, you just have to be willing to either take a bad contract back, or part with substantial assets to move said player. Like you said, JR made a **** sandwich and his arrogance has him firmly planted in this "Well, I'm a genius so I'm going to get someone else to pay me to take a bite of this **** sandwich, I'm definitely not going to swallow my pride and pay them."

What a mess that dude is, man. Again, it could've been purely coincidental (or maybe it's what drove Botts out) but right as we were coming down the line for the second of back to backs, JR pulled this about face and got his massive ego where he was gonna do it his own way with no input from anyone else. There's just no real explanation for how things went downhill so dramatically and abruptly to me.

I’m just wondering how he can’t convince the Jets to take JJ. Their D is something awful... lost two of their best blueliners and then Buff went awol.

He should be all over that, but if they aren’t interested, that’s scary as hell because I can’t see another team this season being that desperate.

And why JR caught the short bus to Krazytown will always baffle me... I can’t recall any GM, aside from him, that suddenly went completely mental and decided that he didn’t enjoy overwhelming success and changed his team’s ultra successful identity.

It will always be the most bizarre thing I’ve ever seen a Pens GM do.

 

[Tender Rip]

Pretty quickly conversation has to move to Gud if Johnson is entirely untradeable currently.
That’d create room to maneuver and give Marino a spot and make Ruh first reserve at RD.

I would also like JR to be on permanent alert for options to move Horny. I’m sure he would be missed at some stages, but if Horny cannot be a top 6 player for us, we need to move him.

Make our bottom 6 fast and hope one of the kids step up with added opportunity. Otherwise there’ll at least be cap room to take in short term cover.

 

[KIRK]

I didn't get that at all. To me he sounded like a guy who really cares about this team and is going to step up into more of a leadership role.

If I was going to get concerned, it would be geared more towards Vanilla Media Sid's "we didn't get to our game" mantra.

That's not untrue, but he sounded very disgusted too.

 

[AllTheCharacter]

Hunwick was fine until his concussion. He outplayed Cole for long stretches

Hunwick only played 6 games before the concussion. He def wasn’t good in all of those games either. He’s an unknown without his health. Could have been bad. Could have been fine. Should have been kept in hindsight.

And why JR caught the short bus to Krazytown will always baffle me... I can’t recall any GM, aside from him, that suddenly went completely mental and decided that he didn’t enjoy overwhelming success and changed his team’s ultra successful identity.

Tom Wilson... the bullying in general and playing himself. They were getting abused and other teams were looking at the speed identity. Therefor bully and out muscle the new faster teams, but do a better job at it. It was a bad idea.

 

[KIRK]

Pretty quickly conversation has to move to Gud if Johnson is entirely untradeable currently.
That’d create room to maneuver and give Marino a spot and make Ruh first reserve at RD.

I would also like JR to be on permanent alert for options to move Horny. I’m sure he would be missed at some stages, but if Horny cannot be a top 6 player for us, we need to move him.

Make our bottom 6 fast and hope one of the kids step up with added opportunity. Otherwise there’ll at least be cap room to take in short term cover.

Honestly, we're at the point where whether or not we can move Jack Johnson, he should not under any circumstance be playing. When you look at the numbers in terms of his impact on Geno's line last night, it's inexcusable to dress a player who's effect on the team is that destructive.

EDIT: A few more like last night, and Guds can **** off too.

 

[KIRK]

I’m just wondering how he can’t convince the Jets to take JJ. Their D is something awful... lost two of their best blueliners and then Buff went awol.

He should be all over that, but if they aren’t interested, that’s scary as hell because I can’t see another team this season being that desperate.

And why JR caught the short bus to Krazytown will always baffle me... I can’t recall any GM, aside from him, that suddenly went completely mental and decided that he didn’t enjoy overwhelming success and changed his team’s ultra successful identity.

It will always be the most bizarre thing I’ve ever seen a Pens GM do.

If you're another GM, no matter how bad your D is, don't you have a few kids who can't be any worse than Johnson? The only way you move him is with a monster spiff. Has to be a 1st or equivalent. And even then I might want like 750K retention.

I swear, one day, we're going to read that his kid used that Jack Johnson contract as incontrovertible proof to have the old man committed.

 

[Tender Rip]

Honestly, we're at the point where whether or not we can move Jack Johnson, he should not under any circumstance be playing. When you look at the numbers in terms of his impact on Geno's line last night, it's inexcusable to dress a player who's effect on the team is that destructive.

EDIT: A few more like last night, and Guds can **** off too.

I’m not really disagreeing but the sample size of your numbers for game1 is just a little too small to “credit” Johnson with that much - in that particular game. In a game where you didn’t get a minus from him, others f***ed up a good deal worse, and he did capable work on the PK, I won’t agree that he was making it a lost cause.

In any event, trading Gud makes it easier cap-wise to leave Johnson on the bench or even waiving him.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I’m just wondering how he can’t convince the Jets to take JJ. Their D is something awful... lost two of their best blueliners and then Buff went awol.

He should be all over that, but if they aren’t interested, that’s scary as hell because I can’t see another team this season being that desperate.

And why JR caught the short bus to Krazytown will always baffle me... I can’t recall any GM, aside from him, that suddenly went completely mental and decided that he didn’t enjoy overwhelming success and changed his team’s ultra successful identity.

It will always be the most bizarre thing I’ve ever seen a Pens GM do.

Something 100% snapped in his lizard brain when Tom Wilson ran Sheary two playoff series in a row. He just saw red and said "f*** it".

 

[Pens x]

This team is riddled with awful contracts. JR has been absolutely terrible at signing free agents since July 2017. You just can’t keep signing such dreadful contracts year after year with a salary cap. All of our issues are self-inflicted. How the ownership group views JR and Sully as anything remotely close to competent is baffling.

This entire team needs a dramatic change, and it should start with a new GM and new coach.

We are entering year 3 since we won the cup, let’s not waste anymore time.

 

[KIRK]

I’m not really disagreeing but the sample size of your numbers for game1 is just a little too small to “credit” Johnson with that much - in that particular game. In a game where you didn’t get a minus from him, others ****ed up a good deal worse, and he did capable work on the PK, I won’t agree that he was making it a lost cause.

In any event, trading Gud makes it easier cap-wise to leave Johnson on the bench or even waiving him.

It happened all last year too. BUT, the excuse for some was 'well, Geno played badly' and 'Phil didn't work' and 'Schultz was just back from injury'.

Well, last night, you had Geno re-energized, no Phil (Galchenyuk wasn't great but certainly was more engaged 200 feet than Phil last year), and Schultz has looked good since day 1 of camp . . . and it was still the same crap numbers with Johnson.

He's not the ONLY problem with this team, but Sullivan (a) playing him and (b) playing him so much with Malkin only serves to help the other team limit Malkin's chances.

Last night wasn't a 1 game sample. Last night was the final confirmation of something that's been a trend for a year.

EDIT: Leaving Johnson on the bench has nothing to do with trading Guds. You could send Johnson to WBS tomorrow, buying 1M in the process, and have the cap space to keep Riikola up.

 

[KIRK]

This team is riddled with awful contracts. JR has been absolutely terrible at signing free agents since July 2017. You just can’t keep signing such dreadful contracts year after year with a salary cap. All of our issues are self-inflicted. How the ownership group views JR and Sully as anything remotely close to competent is baffling.

This entire team needs a dramatic change, and it should start with a new GM and new coach.

We are entering year 3 since we won the cup, let’s not waste anymore time.

Spoiler: Spoiler

They'll waste more time

 

[Tender Rip]

The only way you move him is with a monster spiff. Has to be a 1st or equivalent. And even then I might want like 750K retention.

Has there ever been a known case of a player getting injured in training because management made someone do it?
Jack needs his money, we need him on LTIR.
I’m a horrible human being maybe, but a broken ankle seems a minor thing... or one could be more creative and find a less mobility restricting way...

 

[Allie Kitsune]

Has there ever been a known case of a player getting injured in training because management made someone do it?
Jack needs his money, we need him on LTIR.
I’m a horrible human being maybe, but a broken ankle seems a minor thing... or one could be more creative and find a less mobility restricting way...

I don't think this org is gonna call Tonya Harding any time soon.

 

[Tender Rip]

Last night wasn't a 1 game sample. Last night was the final confirmation of something that's been a trend for a year.

EDIT: Leaving Johnson on the bench has nothing to do with trading Guds. You could send Johnson to WBS tomorrow, buying 1M in the process, and have the cap space to keep Riikola up.

Well, you know my thoughts on Geno and previous comments on his relative lack of help from the blue line well enough that we largely agree. I am just not going to talk about final confirmation after a game where he was nothing near as atrocious as he can be - and where he wasn’t even the worst.

As for the cap, yes I know it’s possible right now... but having significant cap flexibility could create opportunities also when it comes to getting rid of JJ (taking in another bad contract albeit more movable) and JJ being sent down means another contract will be coming up.
It won’t be a million saved, it’ll be less than 500k if it’s a league minimum salary. With that I’d rather have JJ be the guy riding pine and use him as an emergency body until something is worked out.

 

[Tender Rip]

I don't think this org is gonna call Tonya Harding any time soon.

I can feel you judging me....

 

[ColePens]

There were tons of players who were available for cheap for the Pens that they didn't even bother with. I always wondered why we never went to Florida about Marchessault. Then I think Haula was traded for pretty much nothing. But we overpay for UFA guys and then have to give good players away to get rid of them. Like... what the f***?

 

[Pancakes]

It happened all last year too. BUT, the excuse for some was 'well, Geno played badly' and 'Phil didn't work' and 'Schultz was just back from injury'.

Well, last night, you had Geno re-energized, no Phil (Galchenyuk wasn't great but certainly was more engaged 200 feet than Phil last year), and Schultz has looked good since day 1 of camp . . . and it was still the same crap numbers with Johnson.

He's not the ONLY problem with this team, but Sullivan (a) playing him and (b) playing him so much with Malkin only serves to help the other team limit Malkin's chances.

Last night wasn't a 1 game sample. Last night was the final confirmation of something that's been a trend for a year.

EDIT: Leaving Johnson on the bench has nothing to do with trading Guds. You could send Johnson to WBS tomorrow, buying 1M in the process, and have the cap space to keep Riikola up.

Yeah I just think we're in a situation where other teams are getting better and we're getting older year to year. We can't expect Sid and Geno to carry absolute crap any more. They're not 24. And so, we need to maximize what we have. That means not actively shooting ourselves in the foot by playing bad players. Even if we did play Marino and Riikola that might not resolve all the issues but it sure as hell would go a much longer way towards maximizing the talent on this roster.

I also think there's a butterfly effect with playing the right players also. Remember what happened when Sullivan took over and what players we plugged in at that point? We put in young and unproven guys like Rust, Kuhnhackl, Scott Wilson, and Sheary. We put in guys like Justin Schultz, and Trevor Daley.

Apart from Daley none of them put up huge offensive numbers, but we were a completely different team when we plugged those guys in because they did so much more to help us play the right type of hockey with their speed and youth.

Riikola and Marino might not come in and put up gaudy numbers, but you'd have to think their skating and puckmoving abilities would be a welcome boon for our forward group. And if they both come in and fail at improving that, then so what? We know what we're getting with JJ and Gudbranson. At least Marino and Riikola might improve things.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

I’m just wondering how he can’t convince the Jets to take JJ. Their D is something awful... lost two of their best blueliners and then Buff went awol.

He should be all over that, but if they aren’t interested, that’s scary as hell because I can’t see another team this season being that desperate.

And why JR caught the short bus to Krazytown will always baffle me... I can’t recall any GM, aside from him, that suddenly went completely mental and decided that he didn’t enjoy overwhelming success and changed his team’s ultra successful identity.

It will always be the most bizarre thing I’ve ever seen a Pens GM do.

This is why I suspected that the pro scouting needed an overhaul. It could have been JR himself or someone else in the org, but to me it seems like he was repeatedly given bad information on players he was looking at. Hunwick and JJ stick out. He also was talking about how physical Grant was when we picked him up, which is weird. Pearson didn't fit the identity either and seemed like an odd guy for the team to target. Niemi. You know JR doesn't have time to watch a lot of these guys. Someone had to be talking them up.

Or he could have just lost his mind.

 

[Dangles78]

**** it, if it takes a 1st to trade Johnson then I do it at this point. The prospect pool hasn't been this deep in a long time.

 

[Pens x]

This is why I suspected that the pro scouting needed an overhaul. It could have been JR himself or someone else in the org, but to me it seems like he was repeatedly given bad information on players he was looking at. Hunwick and JJ stick out. He also was talking about how physical Grant was when we picked him up, which is weird. Pearson didn't fit the identity either and seemed like an odd guy for the team to target. Niemi. You know JR doesn't have time to watch a lot of these guys. Someone had to be talking them up.

Or he could have just lost his mind.

I think he lost his mind 2 years ago

 

[JRS91]

I get that Kahun didn't play well, but why on earth do they think Simon is the answer?

Put Kahun with Crosby and Guentzel, leave Simon on the fourth line. Simon's a decent player but he shouldn't be anywhere near the top-six, barring major injuries.

 

[Turin]

I get that Kahun didn't play well, but why on earth do they think Simon is the answer?

Put Kahun with Crosby and Guentzel, leave Simon on the fourth line. Simon's a decent player but he shouldn't be anywhere near the top-six, barring major injuries.

Because Simon has excellent results in spurts and Sid likes playing with him.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

This is why I suspected that the pro scouting needed an overhaul. It could have been JR himself or someone else in the org, but to me it seems like he was repeatedly given bad information on players he was looking at. Hunwick and JJ stick out. He also was talking about how physical Grant was when we picked him up, which is weird. Pearson didn't fit the identity either and seemed like an odd guy for the team to target. Niemi. You know JR doesn't have time to watch a lot of these guys. Someone had to be talking them up.

Or he could have just lost his mind.

Wasn't Guerin in charge of pro scouting? Or did he mangle some other role in the organization?

 

[deakka]

**** it, if it takes a 1st to trade Johnson then I do it at this point. The prospect pool hasn't been this deep in a long time.

Judging by the first game I would label our 1st untouchable. With how stale we looked and how much better metro has become.. well. It might be our first lottery pick in forever

 

[Tender Rip]

Judging by the first game I would label our 1st untouchable. With how stale we looked and how much better metro has become.. well. It might be our first lottery pick in forever

Yeah, we gotta show that we genuinely have something worth sacrificing for before considering such a step.