News Article: Pittsburgh Magazine Roundtable Part II & III: Systems, Meltdowns and the Locker-Room

[titaniumexpose]

That Rossi quote re:#47 is classic trolling. It's annoying. Does anybody really know how the organization feels about him? The Pens' D seems soft without him imo.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I agree with Rossi that the Pens live or die with Sid and Geno.

But, somehow, in your warped mind, you extrapolate THAT to imply complete agreement about everything with Rossi.

WTF do you think, they live and die with Gladams?

Holy ****. Capp is right . . . gotta go convulse now.

I didn't say that. I said that when you agree with Rossi, you should probably re-think your position. Seems to me like a great rule of thumb for anybody, but suit yourself.

I'm still not sure what you're infuriated about though. Or why you think our scoring wingers are closer to our line-up in '09 than '08, something which you've said before to support your "build around Sid and Geno at all costs" argument. I have a hard time processing that idea.

a lot of people were saying that the penguins bottom six is among the worst in league, and now more than half-way through the season they've played exactly as expected-- awful.

now the penguins can either play an exorbitant price for bottom six players at the deadline or just have the worst bottom six in the playoffs.

either way this was a stupid strategy and should have been addressed earlier.

I'm sure he really wanted to let Cooke go and sign D'Agostini. He should've just waved his magic wand for more cap space.

I keep hearing this, but going into this year everyone that has an opinion worth anything should know this was going to be a SUPER lean year.

Cap went waaay down. I could have told you the bottom 6 was going to be lean the day after they signed the CBA. They'll be able to restock after this year.

Mm-hmm.

 

[MrBurghundy]

That Rossi quote re:#47 is classic trolling. It's annoying. Does anybody really know how the organization feels about him? The Pens' D seems soft without him imo.

I doubt he really knows, but it's pretty obvious with how they've used him the past couple of years. One can make a pretty educated guess from it.

 

[Shrimper]

Pouliot, Despres and a 1st for Wheeler. If that was the asking price then I'd go elsewhere.

 

[WVP]

I'd do it. Trading for any long term winger is going to hurt a lot, but that kind of trade is not something this team can't take on. They have plenty of defensive prospects, and Bennett is just being replaced by what we all hope Bennett can become, oh and the guy is 6'5" (I don't care how much of that he uses). Like I said in another thread, rip the band-aid off and get it over with. We'll be better for it right now during Crosby's and Malkin's prime.

I do agree but that bandaid is gonna hurt.

FORWARDS
Chris Kunitz ($3.850m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Blake Wheeler ($5.600m)
Nikolai Kulemin ($2.800m) / Evgeni Malkin ($9.500m) / James Neal ($5.000m)
Jayson Megna ($0.900m) / Brandon Sutter ($3.000m) / Pascal Dupuis ($3.750m)
Harry Zolnierczyk ($0.605m) / Joe Vitale ($0.750m) / Craig Adams ($0.700m)
Brian Gibbons ($0.605m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Rob Scuderi ($3.375m) / Kris Letang ($7.250m)
Simon Despres ($0.951m) / Paul Martin ($5.000m)
Olli Maatta ($0.894m) / Robert Bortuzzo ($0.600m)
Brian Dumoulin ($0.832m) /

GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Jeff Zatkoff ($0.600m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,261,333; BONUSES: $68,333
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $838,667

DB can play his "top 4 defenseman" in the top 4. Bottom 6 is a touch thin, though much better with Dupuis on L3.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Pouliot, Despres and a 1st for Wheeler. If that was the asking price then I'd go elsewhere.

That's probably what it's going to be anywhere else too. That's what it costs to get a young impact winger signed for a long term deal.

 

[Shrimper]

I think wires have been crossed. Was it Despres or Bennett?

 

[WVP]

Another positive: trading for Wheeler would have to mean Orpik is gone.

 

[WVP]

I think wires have been crossed. Was it Despres or Bennett?

Rossi said DP, BB and 1st.

 

[MrBurghundy]

I think wires have been crossed. Was it Despres or Bennett?

Well it was Rossi to start with, but it was Bennett, Pouliot, and a 1st.

 

[Shrimper]

Oh, DP, Bennett and a 1st. That is still a big price. I'd probably not do that still.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Oh, DP, Bennett and a 1st. That is still a big price. I'd probably not do that still.

Like I said, that's going to be the price most likely anywhere you go. Maybe Bennett isn't a part of it, but at some point you've gotta just take that chance. We all hope Bennett can become what Wheeler is now, so you have to factor that in.

 

[cygnus47]

Bennett is the one thing keeping our top 6 affordable next year. If he goes for a more expensive option, Bylsma will be losing some of his pet veteran D, i.e. not happening.

 

[JTG]

I like some things Wheeler does, but in general, I've never been a huge fan of him. I think he's average defensively, he's soft for his size, he has a tendency to coast, and has been wildly inconsistent over the course of his career, along with putting up sub-par goal totals. So yeah...I said it.

 

[mpp9]

I like some things Wheeler does, but in general, I've never been a huge fan of him. I think he's average defensively, he's soft for his size, he has a tendency to coast, and has been wildly inconsistent over the course of his career, along with putting up sub-par goal totals. So yeah...I said it.

If the coaching staff and GM like his potential, I'd be willing to take the risk. He's been a consistent 60+ pt guy for three seasons now. If he's inconsistent while putting up those numbers, he could really take off here if he hits another gear.

 

[Til the End of Time]

i really fear the writing is on the wall with regards to despres-- that they are going to dump for an underwhelming return.

but i am worried hes a goner.

 

[MrBurghundy]

If the coaching staff and GM like his potential, I'd be willing to take the risk. He's been a consistent 60+ pt guy for three seasons now. If he's inconsistent while putting up those numbers, he could really take off here if he hits another gear.

Yeah, and he's never played with a Crosby or Malkin before.

 

[mpp9]

Yeah, and he's never played with a Crosby or Malkin before.

He can skate, control the puck in the corners, set his center up and give us another RHS option. He's locked up longterm as well.

I mean, I think we'd be getting pretty ****ing picky if we passed up on him if a basis for a deal is there.

 

[domaug*]

i really fear the writing is on the wall with regards to despres-- that they are going to dump for an underwhelming return.

but i am worried hes a goner.

i would rather them get fired if they do their job poorly than for something bad to happen to them personally. that is a rotten attitude to have over a damn sports team.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Oh, DP, Bennett and a 1st. That is still a big price. I'd probably not do that still.

That's a lot of ELC quality right there.

I'm opposed to moving Bennett for anything. He's everything we need if he can just get healthy and stay that way for a stretch.

Pouliot I'd move as part of a package for a scoring winger, even knowing how well he played at the WJC and how great he'd be for our PP.

 

[zidell*]

You are exaggerating. Here is a roster for next year without Despres (I'm assuming the worst and he is dumped for a rental):


CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Beau Bennett ($0.900m) / Evgeni Malkin ($9.500m) / James Neal ($5.000m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.850m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) /
Jayson Megna ($0.874m) / Brandon Sutter ($3.500m) / Pascal Dupuis ($3.750m)
Zach Sill ($0.600m) / Joe Vitale ($0.700m) / Craig Adams ($0.700m)
Harry Zolnierczyk ($0.605m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Rob Scuderi ($3.375m) / Kris Letang ($7.250m)
Olli Maatta ($0.894m) / Paul Martin ($5.000m)
Robert Bortuzzo ($0.600m) / Matt Niskanen ($4.000m)
Brian Dumoulin ($0.832m) /
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Jeff Zatkoff ($0.600m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,229,958; BONUSES: $68,333
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $4,870,042

That assumes we keep Niskanen for 4mil (not what I want to do but could see Ray doing it) and Sutter at 3.5 (he could get 4+ I suppose but his numbers haven't been particularly strong). IF you keep Duper with Sid, then that gives you about 4mil to fill out the 3rd line or 4mil for Sid's winger. Certainly not ideal, but not terrible.

Now if they let Niskanen walk, and assuming we don't trade Despres (which is my preference), that would give us 6mil+ for Sid's winger.

This is pure fantasy. First, you don't know what the cap will be. The Candian dollar going down the drain will reduce and increase. Second, ou can't spend to the cap. Every team leave $500-750k spare change. Third, Orpik isn't going anywhere. Fourth, you've got the roster filled out with 4 minimum wage nobodies at forward. They might have a couple million to spare, but it won't be enough to buy much of anything.

 

[MrBurghundy]

He can skate, control the puck in the corners, set his center up and give us another RHS option. He's locked up longterm as well.

I mean, I think we'd be getting pretty ****ing picky if we passed up on him if a basis for a deal is there.

I agree. He really is exactly what we're looking for. $5.6M until 2019 for a guy that's scored at a 60 point pace for the last few seasons, with the ability to increase that playing with the 2 best players in the world where he's not one of the main focuses on a line? Most of the goals he scores too are right in front of the net.

Yeah sign me up.

 

[mpp9]

That's a lot of ELC quality right there.

I'm opposed to moving Bennett for anything. He's everything we need if he can just get healthy and stay that way for a stretch.

Pouliot I'd move as part of a package for a scoring winger, even knowing how well he played at the WJC and how great he'd be for our PP.

I wouldn't move Beau b/c I doubt his trade value exceeds what he can bring this year and moving forward.

But I'm not gonna be angry if he has to be part of a package to land a proven top line talent.

 

[Fogel]

The cap going to 71M has been widely reported from the latest GM meetings so why would you question it?

 

[JTG]

This is pure fantasy. First, you don't know what the cap will be. The Candian dollar going down the drain will reduce and increase. Second, ou can't spend to the cap. Every team leave $500-750k spare change. Third, Orpik isn't going anywhere. Fourth, you've got the roster filled out with 4 minimum wage nobodies at forward. They might have a couple million to spare, but it won't be enough to buy much of anything.

The cap will be around 71 million. Shero has routinely left around 200k, if that going into a season. You don't have to leave 500k, certainly not 750k going into the season. And those minimum wage nobodies are fine. They are actually better than what we have playing right now at much more money.