...
We are proud of the work we have done, and especially proud that we have been able to keep professional hockey in Arizona with the new AHL franchise in Tucson."
Would it be better if that timeframe is too long for the Coyottes to take losses, to relocate to LV and grant a frest expansion franchise to Phx in 5 years?
I'm starting to think we may be the crazy ones because we're all so deep into the hole.
More truthfully, "we continuously failed to comply with the terms of our agreement with the City of Glendale, and then refused to renegotiate a fair lease agreement that would have kept us in Glendale for the long term."
Which they likely won't own. Why would Foley work with an independent team when he could pick up the team for $5MM and have control over his players in development? It's why I wonder why they're on the Tucson thing if that's the plan. Put the AHL team up with ASU once that happens or in some other arena in Phoenix.
I'm starting to think we may be the crazy ones because we're all so deep into the hole.
If the Coyotes leave Arizona, that's it for the NHL in Arizona. Period. End of story. My grandkids will be having kids before they'd even think of coming back here.
You think?
Even more truthfully: "We had the gravy train and futzed it away by being borderline malfeasant and introducing a completely unnecessary conflict of interest that killed our sweetheart deal and, therefore, we're playing the victim card to deflect attention from our complete idiocy."
Agreed. Foley would sooner purchase his own AHL team than have to deal with the IceClowns separately. Wouldn't any of us do the same?
*cough* much wisdom in that statement, I feel
The weird thing is that there's a lot of wisdom going the other way and pointing to the sale/relocation.
So for me it's impossible to be satisfied with the iron-clad conclusions others have come to.
I've been pitching this story to a lot of people in the media (well, two people in the media) because I want to see the reaction to a Phoenix-Vegas move right now in today's atmosphere. I can't get anyone to touch it with a 10 foot pole. I'm starting to think we may be the crazy ones because we're all so deep into the hole.
We just dont know...Like Aliens... inter dimensional? Inter-stellar? Is it us, we ourselves coming back from the future? Are we the Aliens on planet earth?...
There are a lot of assumptions going that way based on a healthy brew of data points mixed with preconceived notions.
I used to be religious but am not anymore. One of the reasons why is when I started questioning my church's validity, one of the leaders told me, "First thing you have to do is accept the unchangeable truth that this is God's church. That is irrefutable fact."
I get that feeling a lot around these megathreads, in that a lot of folks around here drive their stake into the ground by saying that it is an incontrovertible fact that the Coyotes cannot survive in Arizona. Then, like dogs on a chain, they dash out to make their opinions known, but always orbiting that anchor to which their chain is tied.
I much prefer the scientific method, in that you proceed with the intent of proving your thesis wrong rather than trying to find supporting evidence that it is right, and only by eliminating all other possibilities do you come to a final conclusion.
So you're right, there is a lot of data indicating that a relocation is possible; however, there is also some data indicating that the team is not going to move this season that hasn't been eliminated from consideration. So for me it's impossible to be satisfied with the iron-clad conclusions others have come to.
For me, it's all about the business. By all accounts they were a marginal business when everything was going right, and were losing a hefty sum even with the Glendale subsidy. How does an ownership group that needed a loan secured against a public subsidy and an $85 million line of credit now manage financially for a few years in a makeshift lease arrangement? They insisted on an out clause for a reason. Unless they've found investors willing to put huge sums into the franchise with a very uncertain future in terms of arena, I just don't see how they sustain the business. They are so far behind financially already.
Perhaps I am missing something here. Mayor of Phoneix can see a multi-sport arena facilty in the future. This facility would include the Suns, Coyotes and some other teams.
If Tony was dancing down the arena path of dreams with other entities ready to make an arena announcement within days should he not have informed the fine politicians at the city of Phoenix that he already has plans or is this Lebeesur's promised arena announcement?
Craig Harris saying the Coyotes are open to sharing an arena with the Suns gives me this odd feeling that Tony does not have any other arena plans. If he did wouldn't the Coyotes be saying that it is great that the City of Phoenix is open to a multi sport facility in the future and we are honoured that they would want to partner with us but we have our own arena plans to be announced shortly.
I am getting a feeling that Tony doesn't have an arena announcement forthcoming unless I am completely missing something.
There are a lot of assumptions going that way based on a healthy brew of data points mixed with preconceived notions.
I used to be religious but am not anymore. One of the reasons why is when I started questioning my church's validity, one of the leaders told me, "First thing you have to do is accept the unchangeable truth that this is God's church. That is irrefutable fact."
I get that feeling a lot around these megathreads, in that a lot of folks around here drive their stake into the ground by saying that it is an incontrovertible fact that the Coyotes cannot survive in Arizona. Then, like dogs on a chain, they dash out to make their opinions known, but always orbiting that anchor to which their chain is tied.
I much prefer the scientific method, in that you proceed with the intent of proving your thesis wrong rather than trying to find supporting evidence that it is right, and only by eliminating all other possibilities do you come to a final conclusion.
So you're right, there is a lot of data indicating that a relocation is possible; however, there is also some data indicating that the team is not going to move this season that hasn't been eliminated from consideration. So for me it's impossible to be satisfied with the iron-clad conclusions others have come to.
For me, it's all about the business. By all accounts they were a marginal business when everything was going right, and were losing a hefty sum even with the Glendale subsidy. How does an ownership group that needed a loan secured against a public subsidy and an $85 million line of credit now manage financially for a few years in a makeshift lease arrangement? They insisted on an out clause for a reason. Unless they've found investors willing to put huge sums into the franchise with a very uncertain future in terms of arena, I just don't see how they sustain the business. They are so far behind financially already.
I love the Alien guy from History Channel.
What is the wisdom for the opposite view other than the fact that nothing has happened?
More truthfully, "we continuously failed to comply with the terms of our agreement with the City of Glendale, and then refused to renegotiate a fair lease agreement that would have kept us in Glendale for the long term."
I love the Alien guy from History Channel.
Yup. LeBlank said he'd have an arena announcent in two weeks with shovels in the ground in 9-12 months. That doesn't seem to be the Phoenix option, so what else will he announce? "We've got an arena plan that will begin construction in several months, but we're open to ditching that plan if we can work something out with the Sun's in Phoenix."
Say hello to Lakehead Yale Sports Holdings. The group looking to bring a professional or major junior hockey team to Thunder Bay is trying to get people used to calling them Lakehead Yale Sports Holdings. CEO Anthony Leblanc says that has been the official name for about a year after Ice Edge Holdings was disbanded.
IceCaps leaving Newfoundland for Thunder Bay
Foley’s group has entertained discussions with potential municipalities to locate a minor-league affiliate. One possibility is Reno, Nev., according to Foley, where tax benefits could help land a team. Another option is the Central Valley in California. Foley said the priority is to ensure players “can get up and down quickly.”
Now here is a prime example of projecting "opinion" and "probabilities" as "truth" based solely upon one side.
But then there's really nothing wrong with that, as long as one can keep it all in perspective
I love that meme....
Phoenix CXIV: The Aliens Have Landed
I was specifically critiquing LeBlanc's public statements about how and why the GRA became non-viable as an arena option for the Coyotes. Perhaps you didn't like the rhetorical flourish, but I don't think there's anything non-factual about what I conveyed.
There is ample evidence that IA was non-compliant with the lease.
There is ample evidence that Glendale was interested in renegotiating the lease agreement and that IA refused, choosing instead to threaten a $200 million lawsuit against Glendale.
I won't bother to go back and produce the evidence, but I'm sure you know where to find it.
If you prefer LeBlanc's version of the events, that's your prerogative. I don't think that qualifies as a more objective viewpoint, though.
"This is cheap political gamesmanship," LeBlanc said. "They have no case."
He also affirmed NHL commissioner Gary Bettman's comments during Game 4 of the Stanley Cup Final. "I'm really not concerned about the Coyotes," Bettman admitted. "If I lived in Glendale, I would be concerned about my government."
LeBlanc said the whole situation is a threat to try and get the team to renegotiate the existing deal, and one that came out of the blue, at that.
LeBlanc said the Coyotes and their lawyers will fight the decision tooth and nail, and that he expects the court to uphold the original lease agreement, which is barely two years old. He added that there's no way the club will enter into a new, renegotiated deal with the city, but said there's no real contingency plan should a judge rule that Glendale has the right to terminate the lease.