Prospect Info: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc.

[Tripod]

Maybe instead of signing a winger to a PTO then contract, they should have signed a C.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Obviously they expect(ed) Patrick back fairly soon.

 

[deadhead]

Is Kase injured again? Because he has yet to play for the Phantoms.

Meanwhile Zamula is off to a ridiculous start, 7g 4-6 10 +10
To put that +10 in perspective, the next three D-men on his team have scored 3 points with +/- -2, -1, +1.
The highest +/- for a forward is +4.
So in this case that actually may be a meaningful statistic, because it's not being inflated by team play.

 

[Curufinwe]

The Phantoms have 16 forwards and 9 dmen now so if they want to rest a guy tonight, they could. As far as I know Kase is the only injured player.

Lehigh Valley Phantoms at eliteprospects.com

 

[macleish1974]

Bunnaman has been sent down to the Phantoms as per their website.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Is Kase injured again? Because he has yet to play for the Phantoms.

Meanwhile Zamula is off to a ridiculous start, 7g 4-6 10 +10
To put that +10 in perspective, the next three D-men on his team have scored 3 points with +/- -2, -1, +1.
The highest +/- for a forward is +4.
So in this case that actually may be a meaningful statistic, because it's not being inflated by team play.

I always said that I love plus/minus as an advanced stat when it suits my agenda I'm really hoping he can keep it going and blast his way onto the big club. In 2029. You GOT to love Big Z.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Bunnaman has been sent down to the Phantoms as per their website.

Phantoms gain massively powerful rabbit mojo. Flyers stuck with canine stench. Seems about right.

 

[Appleyard]

Rubtsov is extremely inexperienced:

17: 31 MHL games
18: 15 KHL/15 MHL/16 CHL/5 WJC-20
19: 68 CHL/5 WJC-20/9 other Int'l - in those 68g 20-33 53, not exactly a great PD+2 performance
20: 15 AHL games

Experience wise, he's probably 1-2 years behind his age group.
Physically, he's more than "heavy" enough for the NHL, but he really needs a lot of PT.

He is 2x ahead of Bunnaman talent wise though...

and yeh, he has had just 17 AHL games. But he has been a far better player in those 17 games than Bunnaman has managed in his 66.

Plus Rubtsovs disappointing final CHL season was still better than Bunnamans!

 

[deadhead]

He is 2x ahead of Bunnaman talent wise though...

and yeh, he has had just 17 AHL games. But he has been a far better player in those 17 games than Bunnaman has managed in his 66.

Plus Rubtsovs disappointing final CHL season was still better than Bunnamans!

Oh, there's no question that Rubtsov is more talented, but given his lack of experience, it's also reasonable that they wanted him to get more AHL experience before bringing him up.

Same with Rubtsov/Vorobyev, Vorobyev has more experience but Rubtsov is the better player.

 

[macleish1974]

Phantoms gain massively powerful rabbit mojo. Flyers stuck with canine stench. Seems about right.

Phantoms website did not say whether he would play tonight. And if he does what position would you expect him to play? Center?

I am sure he is pissed.....

 

[deadhead]

Why would Bunnaman be pissed?

He didn't have a great first year in the AHL, still made the team out of camp, got to play in 5 NHL games and collect extra salary and per diem, had a great adventure and learned what it takes to make it in the NHL.

He's only 21, it isn't like this is a career ender.

 

[Appleyard]

Oh, there's no question that Rubtsov is more talented, but given his lack of experience, it's also reasonable that they wanted him to get more AHL experience before bringing him up.

Same with Rubtsov/Vorobyev, Vorobyev has more experience but Rubtsov is the better player.

I mean, I can understand it to a degree... and Vorobyev has played well pretty much his entire time in the NHL too.

But I do think there is more chance he can jump in and be a "big" positive in the bottom six.

I like Vorobyev. But I think his approximate upside is a solid 3C.

 

[deadhead]

I mean, I can understand it to a degree... and Vorobyev has played well pretty much his entire time in the NHL too.

But I do think there is more chance he can jump in and be a "big" positive in the bottom six.

I like Vorobyev. But I think his approximate upside is a solid 3C.

Since we'd be bringing up either player to be the 4C (at least to start), their eventual upside shouldn't factor into this decision.
In fact, given Rubtsov's higher upside, they may want to keep him in the AHL where he can get more practice and game time.

 

[Appleyard]

Since we'd be bringing up either player to be the 4C (at least to start), their eventual upside shouldn't factor into this decision.
In fact, given Rubtsov's higher upside, they may want to keep him in the AHL where he can get more practice and game time.

I mean, Rubtsov is more likely to be better right now though... improve the team more, and potentially push Laughton back to wing maybe when Patrick ready (or replace Laughton at 3C if Patrick out for a while more).

 

[Tripod]

With Patrick hurt, it sort of is a good time to see what these guys can do if they are not going to call up Frost. The window of opportunity for lots of them won't be there in another 3 months assuming Patrick is healthy and Frost is recalled.

Use them to fill the gap until Frost comes up or Patrick is ready. Give Rubstov 2 games but be clear what the expectations are and that after 2 games, things will be evaluated again.

I guess it will be interesting to see if someone is "scratched" for tonight's Phantoms game with a call up to follow tomorrow. Like it Rub or Pimp are scratched for tonight, you sort of expect they get a recall. But for all we know, they are going to play Stewy....ewwwwy.

 

[deadhead]

I mean, Rubtsov is more likely to be better right now though... improve the team more, and potentially push Laughton back to wing maybe when Patrick ready (or replace Laughton at 3C if Patrick out for a while more).

Yes, but what would be better for Rubtsov's development?
I don't think there is ever a "right" answer, it's a judgement call, but I'd understand why they'd want Rubtsov to play 20-30 AHL games before calling him up.
I think they'd rather "yo-yo" Vorobyev than mess with Rubtsov's development.
Whereas they don't want to bring up Farabee, Frost or Rubtsov unless they're ready to play them consistently the rest of the season.

 

[captainpaxil]

If we're looking at a 2 game eval id probably go with pimp. Ruby was really bad at faceoffs in preseason and frost just moved to another friggen country let alone going up a level in competition. Give them some to work on things.

I like raffl alot but hes not a center

 

[Appleyard]

Yes, but what would be better for Rubtsov's development?
I don't think there is ever a "right" answer, it's a judgement call, but I'd understand why they'd want Rubtsov to play 20-30 AHL games before calling him up.
I think they'd rather "yo-yo" Vorobyev than mess with Rubtsov's development.
Whereas they don't want to bring up Farabee, Frost or Rubtsov unless they're ready to play them consistently the rest of the season.

I do as well...

but it did not hurt Carter to play ~half his rookie year on the 4th line.

Look at the St. Louis cup winning team and how many rookies, 2nd year pros etc playing sub-12 a night.

Each case is different. But really how many players can we point to being "ruined" by being in NHL too soon, yo-yoing etc? There probably are some... but there are also players where teams wasted a year or so of their primes (and ELC/RFA years) in a minor league. (Leafs with Andreas Johnsson certainly did... Tyler Johnson, Marchessault, Montour, Tatar, Palmieri too, and a few other guys who while not top 6/4 would have certainly been good 3rd liners for the half season etc were not called up)

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Phantoms website did not say whether he would play tonight. And if he does what position would you expect him to play? Center?

I am sure he is pissed.....

View attachment 266007

Nah, he's OK. He's the most team-first person on this or any other planet. He'll be thinking of how he can use his massive abilities to counteract all the trash UpChuck put on that roster.

 

[Curufinwe]

Don't assume Patrick will be healthy. This week, next week, next month.... just don't.

 

[Tripod]

Don't assume Patrick will be healthy. This week, next week, next month.... just don't.

That why we need Frost to move up sometime too. Then if Patrick comes back it's a bonus.

 

[TheKingPin]

Why not just see what Frost looks like given the lineup hole. Are they afraid of losing a game 6-3?

 

[Striiker]

If they think Frost is worse defensively than the crap we have in the bottom 6 right now...

 

[landsbergfan]

I do as well...

but it did not hurt Carter to play ~half his rookie year on the 4th line.

Look at the St. Louis cup winning team and how many rookies, 2nd year pros etc playing sub-12 a night.

Each case is different. But really how many players can we point to being "ruined" by being in NHL too soon, yo-yoing etc? There probably are some... but there are also players where teams wasted a year or so of their primes (and ELC/RFA years) in a minor league. (Leafs with Andreas Johnsson certainly did... Tyler Johnson, Marchessault, Montour, Tatar, Palmieri too, and a few other guys who while not top 6/4 would have certainly been good 3rd liners for the half season etc were not called up)

I think you have to look no further than Sean Couturier, who according to the narrative had his offensive development stunted by playing such hard defensive minutes as a "prospect" I think he turned out alright

 

[deadhead]

I do as well...

but it did not hurt Carter to play ~half his rookie year on the 4th line.

Look at the St. Louis cup winning team and how many rookies, 2nd year pros etc playing sub-12 a night.

Each case is different. But really how many players can we point to being "ruined" by being in NHL too soon, yo-yoing etc? There probably are some... but there are also players where teams wasted a year or so of their primes (and ELC/RFA years) in a minor league. (Leafs with Andreas Johnsson certainly did... Tyler Johnson, Marchessault, Montour, Tatar, Palmieri too, and a few other guys who while not top 6/4 would have certainly been good 3rd liners for the half season etc were not called up)

"Wasting a year is a matter of conjecture."

Did Giroux waste half a season in the AHL, or did he prime himself for a successful debut?

Tyler Johnson was an extremely undersized player who was meh in the CHL until his overage season. So it was reasonable to want to see him do it again in the AHL after a very good first season.

Marchessault was another undersized guy who didn't break out until his overage CHL season. He spent 4 seasons in the AHL, but his rookie year, 45g 3-8 11 ES, so it wasn't like he was an instant success.

Montour spent a year and a half in the AHL before coming up at 22 years old, 27g 2-3 5 ES, that's marginal 4th line production.

Tatar spent 3 years in the AHL after coming over at 20 years old, 18g 3-3 6 ES, next season 73g 17-16 33

Palmieri spent 2 1/2 years in the AHL from 19-21, then 42g 8-10 18, next season 71g 14-17 31.

Palmieri is probably the only one with a good case of being "buried," he probably should have been in the NHL after 2 AHL seasons.
Teams tend to have a pretty good feel for when a player is ready.