Prospect Info: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc.
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Tripod
I hate this team
Well of course they include Hart and Lindblom, look at the dates. But those are the only 2 who graduated, and we are about to add 10 more kids into that pool in less than 2 months.
We absolutely lack elite prospects. They usually come from the top 5 in the draft and as of now, we have not gotten that payout from Patrick. If we do, it changes everything. We 100% need Patrick or Frost to hit their potential.
Post draft, we will likely be in the 5-10 range of top prospects still assuming we keep #11.
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tictactoe
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- Jan 15, 2017
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Maybe Homer could reverse engineer JVR trade?
Probably too late for that.. Peter Chiarelli is long gone.
Tripod
I hate this team
tictactoe
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Tripod
I hate this team
Four of those guys had major injuries and we must have 6 or 7 guys already on the team younger than Morin.
deadhead
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- Feb 26, 2014
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Yeah, we can ignore Ersson, Ustimenko, Zamula, Laczynski, Bunnaman, Kalynuk, Cates, Kase, Hogberg, St Ivany, Wylie 'cause if you're not a 1t or 2nd rd pick you have no shot at the NHL. Just ask Lindblom or Ghost.
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
We got Bob Hagg. We’re alright. Gordon was just holding that beast back.
That’s not the argument being made. How old are you btw? You’re quite surly.
TheKingPin
Registered User
That statement is of course true. But a lot of those guys had MAJOR injury issues. If 2 of them turnout better than it would appear while healthy then you’ve got something very strong. I would think JOB, Ruby, and Allison all fall in that. JOB was never supposed to have a good past year. He could easily start to put it together. Ruby looked good before the injury. It still remains a numbers game.
Then you have this years pick at 11 and the rest of the draft.
deadhead
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I'm a grouchy old man, I earned my grey hairs.
Tripod
I hate this team
To clarify, there was a point to that post. It was to show that we still have a good prospect pool, DESPITE having those 1st and 2nd rounders as underwhelming. Then add in that we HAVE graduated Hart, Sanheim, Provy, Ghost, Hagg(yup), TK, Patrick and Lindblom.
It's good, but if we had more of our top picks make it, it could have been even better. And with 10 more possible picks coming this year, the depth will hopefully continue. But we could be graduating Frost and Myers...possibly Farabee. So we need to top end talent to be replaced in our prospect pool.
It's good, but if we had more of our top picks make it, it could have been even better. And with 10 more possible picks coming this year, the depth will hopefully continue. But we could be graduating Frost and Myers...possibly Farabee. So we need to top end talent to be replaced in our prospect pool.
TheKingPin
Registered User
Let’s say farabee does not make the team. Myers does. Frost does. Who is our top prospect after this draft? Farabee or the new guy provided no reach pick?
It’s wasted assets. Any of those late round guys you listed have the trade value of a 1st round pick? When the Flyers try to make moves this summer, do you think any GMs are looking at any of those guys as a cornerstone in the deal?
Whiffing on 1st round picks, and even 2nd round picks in today’s NHL, has serious repercussions on trade market. For a team stuck between rebuilding and competing, that has bad consequences.
deadhead
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1st rd picks don't have the value of 1st rd picks once drafted, they tend to drop in value until they either dominate juniors or the AHL.
Meanwhile, someone like Zamula performed as well in the CHL as many of the defensemen drafted in the first two rounds of that draft.
No one is valuing Ersson based on his draft position, same with Cates after his WJC-20 performance.
What matters a couple years after you're drafted is how you've been playing, what people project at 18 is less important than how you play at 20.
Meanwhile, someone like Zamula performed as well in the CHL as many of the defensemen drafted in the first two rounds of that draft.
No one is valuing Ersson based on his draft position, same with Cates after his WJC-20 performance.
What matters a couple years after you're drafted is how you've been playing, what people project at 18 is less important than how you play at 20.
Foggy14
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- Sep 13, 2017
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Aren't "graduates" on ELC's the whole purpose of the exercise?
Agree that, given the much improved pool of prospects, we can afford to change the mix a bit to target more higher risk, higher reward prospects.
#skillspaybills
So what you are saying is they are more valuable if you draft a good prospect. So when you whiffed on some high picks, like it looks like Hextall has, it hurts.
Zamula is a great example. He had a great year but do you think he is worth as much as Miller, Sandin or even a guy like Bode Wilde in trade right now? Unless there is a disastrous draft plus 1 season, like OBrien had, guys with pedigree retain their value. Rubtsov probably had good value until his disastrous draft plus 2 year. Maybe Buffalo jumps at a deal with Rubtsov instead of Tage Thompson without that crap season.
When high picks have disastrous years, which has been the case for some flyers picks for a variety of reasons, it’s devalues the assets used to acquire them. Regardless of how crazy deep you think the Flyers system is because of late round steals, at the moment the only prospects with significant worth that the Flyers have to trade are Farabee, Frost, and Ratcliffe. Add the 11th overall and some of that is what is potentially gone this offseason as they frantically try to make upgrades. When two of those things are gone this offseason, will you still be saying the underperformance of O’Brien and Rubtsov are no big deal?
deadhead
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When bad seasons are due to injury (unless the player was obviously injury prone before the draft) that's bad luck.
And if the injury(s) aren't career threatening, patience is counseled.
What gives you the sense that Fletcher is "frantically" trying to make upgrades?
When you can add Frost and Farabee to your team, what's the urgency in making trades - maybe you haven't seen 19 year old Thomas stand out for St Louis, or Maker for Colorado?
#41 this year and a protected 1st next year are valuable assets, and the depth of the organization makes them expendable.
And the Flyers will have tremendous depth in LHV next season, which means if a few have good seasons, they become trade bait OR candidates for promotion (instead of trading for a worn down veteran).
And if the injury(s) aren't career threatening, patience is counseled.
What gives you the sense that Fletcher is "frantically" trying to make upgrades?
When you can add Frost and Farabee to your team, what's the urgency in making trades - maybe you haven't seen 19 year old Thomas stand out for St Louis, or Maker for Colorado?
#41 this year and a protected 1st next year are valuable assets, and the depth of the organization makes them expendable.
And the Flyers will have tremendous depth in LHV next season, which means if a few have good seasons, they become trade bait OR candidates for promotion (instead of trading for a worn down veteran).
VladDrag
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- Feb 6, 2018
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Top prospect outside of the NHL is what I am assuming you mean.
Depends on who we select, but likely Farabee, at least at the time of the draft. Maybe that changes next year.
Every body on here now seems to put Ratcliffe right behind Farabee and Frost and i'm sorry but i don't . He had in his draft plus 2 year 50 goals and 32 assists in 65 games playing on a stacked line and stacked team . Twarynski had 45 goals and 27 assists in 68 games playing on a fairly strong Kelowna team . No , i think he ranks miles ahead of Twarynski , just using it as comparison .
Now i do think he is good prospect but to me he is not close to Frost or Farabee and is in a pool with Rubtsov , Allison , Laczynski ,Kase and Hogberg and i have Zamula behind all of these guys . The injuries are not near the factor to me at all . I remember watching Patrick grow up playing and he must have spent 50 percent of the time on the injury front from age 13 and up but was still picked 2nd overall . Injury time for the most part might slightly slow a prospects development but to think it vastly derailed from his end development is wrong .
Rubtsov has been slowed by injuries yes and i was quite concerned with his Q preformances stats wise but still liked a lot about his game . Going to LV actually helped his game cause his style of game translates to the pro game so his end development is still on track . The hype on HF boards is less cause hype is what are you doing for me right now not what you can do long term .
Allison is another player slowed by injuries but is in no way dropped off development path . His 1.36 ppg in the toughest conference in college hockey before his injury was ahead of Frosts production according to NHLe . He is now a wait and see prospect but the talent has not disappeared we will just have to wait and see if he can regain it and by the way Hextall and Fletcher have been aggressivly trying to sign him means they still see the player that they thought he was when he was drafted
Laczynski has put up very respectable numbers and seems to be driving the play a lot but seems to be more of a play maker than a finisher . But like Rubtsov , plays a well rounded game . He was slowed by injuries for total point production but had good ppg numbers in a fairly strong conference playing a good strength of schedule number . I do not consider him a top nine guy but a good fourth line responsible guy who can chip in here and there .
As far as the two Euro's Kase and Hogberg all i have to go by is Mr Appleyards assessment of them , their production in the good leagues they play in and Kase's good preformance in the AHL pre injury .
Zamula is a player that has shown good improvement over the year but is going to have to show me that he can put on same pounds and some strength and not have it slow him on mobility . He is bigger and ranger than most players he is playing against so that is a huge advantage to him right now just like Ratcliffe but the higher the competition you play against the more that advantage disappears . Good prospect just need to see him at levels higher than junior to make a more accurate assessment . Time will tell .
All this being said there are prospects we have that could break out later and pass all the guys i have mentioned cause development end product is years away for most and i don't have a crystal ball .
JMO and you are welcome to have a different one .
Now i do think he is good prospect but to me he is not close to Frost or Farabee and is in a pool with Rubtsov , Allison , Laczynski ,Kase and Hogberg and i have Zamula behind all of these guys . The injuries are not near the factor to me at all . I remember watching Patrick grow up playing and he must have spent 50 percent of the time on the injury front from age 13 and up but was still picked 2nd overall . Injury time for the most part might slightly slow a prospects development but to think it vastly derailed from his end development is wrong .
Rubtsov has been slowed by injuries yes and i was quite concerned with his Q preformances stats wise but still liked a lot about his game . Going to LV actually helped his game cause his style of game translates to the pro game so his end development is still on track . The hype on HF boards is less cause hype is what are you doing for me right now not what you can do long term .
Allison is another player slowed by injuries but is in no way dropped off development path . His 1.36 ppg in the toughest conference in college hockey before his injury was ahead of Frosts production according to NHLe . He is now a wait and see prospect but the talent has not disappeared we will just have to wait and see if he can regain it and by the way Hextall and Fletcher have been aggressivly trying to sign him means they still see the player that they thought he was when he was drafted
Laczynski has put up very respectable numbers and seems to be driving the play a lot but seems to be more of a play maker than a finisher . But like Rubtsov , plays a well rounded game . He was slowed by injuries for total point production but had good ppg numbers in a fairly strong conference playing a good strength of schedule number . I do not consider him a top nine guy but a good fourth line responsible guy who can chip in here and there .
As far as the two Euro's Kase and Hogberg all i have to go by is Mr Appleyards assessment of them , their production in the good leagues they play in and Kase's good preformance in the AHL pre injury .
Zamula is a player that has shown good improvement over the year but is going to have to show me that he can put on same pounds and some strength and not have it slow him on mobility . He is bigger and ranger than most players he is playing against so that is a huge advantage to him right now just like Ratcliffe but the higher the competition you play against the more that advantage disappears . Good prospect just need to see him at levels higher than junior to make a more accurate assessment . Time will tell .
All this being said there are prospects we have that could break out later and pass all the guys i have mentioned cause development end product is years away for most and i don't have a crystal ball .
JMO and you are welcome to have a different one .
FLYguy3911
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flyershockey
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deadhead
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