Golf: PGA TOUR 2024 FedExCup Season

[Say Hey Kid]

After disastrous start, Anthony Kim settles down in second round back as a pro

Anthony Kim's second round couldn't have started much worse, but he salvaged the day with steady play.

sports.yahoo.com

Thomas Detry has brutal 6-putt meltdown, ends up dead last at Cognizant Classic

It was a true meltdown that average golfers everywhere had no issue relating to.

sports.yahoo.com

@Filthy Dangles has never 3 putted in his life.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Anthony Kim isn’t really a pro golfer. It is what it is. It’s only newsworthy at this point to pile on him for being so bad. I almost hate wasting my time talking about it and probably won’t after this event ends.

He’d probably finish last or close to last in like every high level pro event he’d play. Maybe he can compete a little more competitively on the Canadian Tour or Latin American Tour or Sunshine Tour. He simply can’t compete anymore with the best in the world after so many years out of the game.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

After disastrous start, Anthony Kim settles down in second round back as a pro

Anthony Kim's second round couldn't have started much worse, but he salvaged the day with steady play.

sports.yahoo.com

Thomas Detry has brutal 6-putt meltdown, ends up dead last at Cognizant Classic

It was a true meltdown that average golfers everywhere had no issue relating to.

sports.yahoo.com

@Filthy Dangles has never 3 putted in his life.

Not once…I pick up after I miss the first two

 

[Say Hey Kid]

LIV Golf just earned its highest TV rating yet. But it's not that simple

On one hand, LIV Golf's first event of 2024 was a big improvement. On the other, it showed a glaring gap between LIV and its competition.

golf.com

432K?

 

[Say Hey Kid]

My problem with the PGA Tour is that the top players show up to 22 events and the other 22 events are boring. I wish there was a way to even it out more.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

My problem with the PGA Tour is that the top players show up to 22 events and the other 22 events are boring. I wish there was a way to even it out more.

I agree. I don't care that much about these signature events. It doesn't make any difference to me whether 18 of the top 20 or 13 of the top 20 are playing Riviera or Bay Hill. I'll watch it if I have time and players I am interested in watching are in contention. That's it. The latter part probably isn't going to make as much of a difference as most state. I mean, look at this year. We have a bunch of nobodies winning these tournaments. You can't really control when Mathieu Pavon is going to outplay literally everyone. That's part of golf. Most events on the PGA Tour aren't going to be won by mules, but mules are going to win some of them, and sometimes thats majors (Harman and Clark did so last year, even if they are slightly above mule status).

 

[PanthersPens62]

Paul Azinger doesn't hold back about his breakup with NBC (and suggests who should replace him)

Was it still too soon for Azinger to talk on this topic? It was not.

golfweek.usatoday.com

Great read! Say what you want about 'Zinger but he makes great points here. I find the PGA Tour completely unwatchable now unless its a signature event & NBC's coverage is now a shell of it's once former great self. It's bland, vanilla etc. etc.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

Pro golf is just a sad, sad state of affairs at this point.

LIV is a disgraceful product, and the PGA has been neutered to the point that it has lost its punch week to week.

There are 4 golf tournaments that matter to watch now, just so sad to see. They need to get these tours back together ASAP.

Oh ya, and the Anthony Kim nonsense showcases the exact sideshow that LIV is. He is guaranteed starts for the rest of the year making huge money despite the fact that he isn't even close to a tour calibre golfer at this point. And they wonder why they can't get world ranking points.

 

[daver]

Pro golf is just a sad, sad state of affairs at this point.

LIV is a disgraceful product, and the PGA has been neutered to the point that it has lost its punch week to week.

There are 4 golf tournaments that matter to watch now, just so sad to see. They need to get these tours back together ASAP.

Oh ya, and the Anthony Kim nonsense showcases the exact sideshow that LIV is. He is guaranteed starts for the rest of the year making huge money despite the fact that he isn't even close to a tour calibre golfer at this point. And they wonder why they can't get world ranking points.

"Pro" anything is destined to be a sad, sad state of affairs. It relies on people having nothing better to do than watch other people get paid for doing "nothing better to do". In ten years, we are going to see players doing ads for Vegas Escort services and legalized cocaine.

That broad commentary aside, why would anyone expect golf to be in a position to "right the ship" when the pro golf market has been capsized by a something that goes almost infinitely beyond a "loss leader".

I am likely the average golf fan; I will make an effort to watch at least three of the four majors while watching a fair amount of the other tournaments while channel surfing. I don't see a lot of difference between the best non-Major events from year's past perhaps other than the leaderboard can look the same due to a couple of Top 10/20 caliber players playing on LIV.

I could care less if viewership is going down or the mindset that pro golf TV ratings are relevant in a discussion about "growing the game".

 

[daver]

LIV Golf just earned its highest TV rating yet. But it's not that simple

On one hand, LIV Golf's first event of 2024 was a big improvement. On the other, it showed a glaring gap between LIV and its competition.

golf.com

432K?

LIV's "golf" is closer to Kim Jon Un winning the North Korea Open with a World Record smashing winning score of 55 under than it is to a PGA event's golf.

The only thing it is missing is Vegas showgirls carrying the big scorecards behind the players and chugging a beer when someone makes a birdie.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

"Pro" anything is destined to be a sad, sad state of affairs. It relies on people having nothing better to do than watch other people get paid for doing "nothing better to do". In ten years, we are going to see players doing ads for Vegas Escort services and legalized cocaine.

That broad commentary aside, why would anyone expect golf to be in a position to "right the ship" when the pro golf market has been capsized by a something that goes almost infinitely beyond a "loss leader".

I am likely the average golf fan; I will make an effort to watch at least three of the four majors while watching a fair amount of the other tournaments while channel surfing. I don't see a lot of difference between the best non-Major events from year's past perhaps other than the leaderboard can look the same due to a couple of Top 10/20 caliber players playing on LIV.

I could care less if viewership is going down or the mindset that pro golf TV ratings are relevant in a discussion about "growing the game".

I don't really agree with any of this, but I am definitely more than an average fan of golf.

I enjoy watching the best players play each other. Whether that's at the Players, API, Memorial, Genesis etc. or the majors. If everyone is out there and the field is really good I love watching. The problem is, the tour has maybe 50% of the best players. We're running into the issue of what does winning really mean? Winning on LIV means f*** all, 54 players and half probably have 0 chance at the start of the week. Winning on the PGA means something, but now that half the best guys aren't there it's just watered down.

They need to get these two tours together ASAP. Losing Jon Rahm was a huge blow to the PGA, even Hatton was a certified top 20ish player. Meronk another good player. Niemann is showing that he is a huge talent, they're getting young guys like Chacarra and Suratt.

If the product wasn't such garbage they actually have a pretty damn good roster of players now.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

LIV will not pursue Official World Golf Ranking points

LIV Golf has dropped its appeal to the OWGR for points, narrowing the pathways for LIV players into golf's majors.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don't really agree with any of this, but I am definitely more than an average fan of golf.

I enjoy watching the best players play each other. Whether that's at the Players, API, Memorial, Genesis etc. or the majors. If everyone is out there and the field is really good I love watching. The problem is, the tour has maybe 50% of the best players. We're running into the issue of what does winning really mean? Winning on LIV means f*** all, 54 players and half probably have 0 chance at the start of the week. Winning on the PGA means something, but now that half the best guys aren't there it's just watered down.

They need to get these two tours together ASAP. Losing Jon Rahm was a huge blow to the PGA, even Hatton was a certified top 20ish player. Meronk another good player. Niemann is showing that he is a huge talent, they're getting young guys like Chacarra and Suratt.

If the product wasn't such garbage they actually have a pretty damn good roster of players now.

I wouldn’t put it at 50% unless the number of good players you are referring to is like 10 and LIV has Phil, Rahm, DJ, Bryson, and Koepka as half of them.

It’s like 1/3. You mention Meronk. He’s a fine player, but his career high ranking is 39, he’s never won a major, never won on the PGA Tour, and he didn’t make the Ryder Cup team because they thought he wasn’t good enough despite all his Euro tour success.

And some of those interesting players like Mickelson, Stenson, Poulter, Westwood, Casey, Garcia are towards the end of their careers.

I would say LIV has like 10 relevant golfers at a time (Rahm, Koepka, Bryson, DJ, Niemann, Reed, Hatton, Smith), and then pick or choose your choice of two okay players like Gooch, Varner, Kokrak, Pereira, Ancer, Meronk who can get hot and win. There are at least double that not on LIV who are just as relevant. JT is ranked 23 in the world and of the top 22 only two are LIV, so there are 20 non-LIV ranked higher than someone who unquestionably is a star.

And LIV only has like 4 of the better younger players (Wolff, Puig, Chacarria, Surratt). There are probably double or triple committed to the PGA Tour (or the feeder tours) or amateurs who’ve not made a decision.

I agree though that it has been a terrible start to the season, and they really need a big name to win the next event for some positive momentum.

 

[daver]

I don't really agree with any of this, but I am definitely more than an average fan of golf.

I enjoy watching the best players play each other. Whether that's at the Players, API, Memorial, Genesis etc. or the majors. If everyone is out there and the field is really good I love watching. The problem is, the tour has maybe 50% of the best players. We're running into the issue of what does winning really mean? Winning on LIV means f*** all, 54 players and half probably have 0 chance at the start of the week. Winning on the PGA means something, but now that half the best guys aren't there it's just watered down.

They need to get these two tours together ASAP. Losing Jon Rahm was a huge blow to the PGA, even Hatton was a certified top 20ish player. Meronk another good player. Niemann is showing that he is a huge talent, they're getting young guys like Chacarra and Suratt.

If the product wasn't such garbage they actually have a pretty damn good roster of players now.

You seem to be accepting that the LIV tour represents a natural growth of professional sports/professional golf like the founding of the PGA Tour was in the '60s. It doesn't. It represents whatever you want to call an outside entity throwing seemingly unlimited cash at players and presenting a product that is complete shit. Let's call it a Shatshow.

Perhaps the PGA Tour needed to make adjustments but giving any credit to the LIV Tour for forcing them makes no sense. Any entity with 2 billion dollars to waste can influence the market of a lot of things.

How do the tours get "together"? Does the PGA allow shorts, a shotgun start, a shortened event and background music? f*** the players who left. f*** Jon Rahm. They took easy money and crossed the line where the sport element of "pro sports" is rendered meaningless.

I think pro sports in general is getting closer to where the sport element is being rendered meaningless especially with the unlimited entry of gambling into the everyday workings of the sport. It is getting closer to the WWE or whatever wrestling is called; where the bottomline is more important than the "sport".

I would rather watch players sweat out their livelihoods and all the emotion that goes That's sports. Or more accurately, that's "pro" sports; sports is still playing for the love of the game and competition with no significant financial incentive.

I would rather watch the PGA tour as it than watch multi-millionares play with not a care in the world.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

You seem to be accepting that the LIV tour represents a natural growth of professional sports/professional golf like the founding of the PGA Tour was in the '60s. It doesn't. It represents whatever you want to call an outside entity throwing seemingly unlimited cash at players and presenting a product that is complete shit. Let's call it a Shatshow.

Perhaps the PGA Tour needed to make adjustments but giving any credit to the LIV Tour for forcing them makes no sense. Any entity with 2 billion dollars to waste can influence the market of a lot of things.

How do the tours get "together"? Does the PGA allow shorts, a shotgun start, a shortened event and background music? f*** the players who left. f*** Jon Rahm. They took easy money and crossed the line where the sport element of "pro sports" is rendered meaningless.

I think pro sports in general is getting closer to where the sport element is being rendered meaningless especially with the unlimited entry of gambling into the everyday workings of the sport. It is getting closer to the WWE or whatever wrestling is called; where the bottomline is more important than the "sport".

I would rather watch players sweat out their livelihoods and all the emotion that goes That's sports. Or more accurately, that's "pro" sports; sports is still playing for the love of the game and competition with no significant financial incentive.

I would rather watch the PGA tour as it than watch multi-millionares play with not a care in the world.

I think you are misunderstanding me because I absolutely do not think that. LIV is untethered from reality, it is a vanity project of the Saudi government. There is no world where golfers should be making the amount of money they are. Their revenue does not even come close to supporting this and at some point everyone is in for a rude awakening.

I would just rather watch a product that is the best players playing against each other to win meaningful tournaments on historic courses. That is why I watch golf. Sure the Mathew Pavon and Jake Knapp stories are interesting enough but it gets boring after a while. Most people watch to see Jon Rahm and Scottie going head to head, or DJ, Koepka, Bryson, Rory in contention.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

I wouldn’t put it at 50% unless the number of good players you are referring to is like 10 and LIV has Phil, Rahm, DJ, Bryson, and Koepka as half of them.

It’s like 1/3. You mention Meronk. He’s a fine player, but his career high ranking is 39, he’s never won a major, never won on the PGA Tour, and he didn’t make the Ryder Cup team because they thought he wasn’t good enough despite all his Euro tour success.

And some of those interesting players like Mickelson, Stenson, Poulter, Westwood, Casey, Garcia are towards the end of their careers.

I would say LIV has like 10 relevant golfers at a time (Rahm, Koepka, Bryson, DJ, Niemann, Reed, Hatton, Smith), and then pick or choose your choice of two okay players like Gooch, Varner, Kokrak, Pereira, Ancer, Meronk who can get hot and win. There are at least double that not on LIV who are just as relevant. JT is ranked 23 in the world and of the top 22 only two are LIV, so there are 20 non-LIV ranked higher than someone who unquestionably is a star.

And LIV only has like 4 of the better younger players (Wolff, Puig, Chacarria, Surratt). There are probably double or triple committed to the PGA Tour (or the feeder tours) or amateurs who’ve not made a decision.

I agree though that it has been a terrible start to the season, and they really need a big name to win the next event for some positive momentum.

You are right that it's probably closer to a 3rd than half, but the PGA is just so watered down right now. Rahm, Koepka, Bryson, Cam Smith, DJ, Niemann, Hatton are all top 20ish players. Mickelson, Reed, Wolff etc. aren't that calibre but are at least very interesting.

There's just no way for professional golf to support two tours at this level. The revenue isn't there, at some point the Saudi's will need to see a return for their ridiculous investment and everything is going to crumble.

I just want to watch all the best golfers play together.

 

[daver]

You are right that it's probably closer to a 3rd than half, but the PGA is just so watered down right now. Rahm, Koepka, Bryson, Cam Smith, DJ, Niemann, Hatton are all top 20ish players. Mickelson, Reed, Wolff etc. aren't that calibre but are at least very interesting.

There's just no way for professional golf to support two tours at this level. The revenue isn't there, at some point the Saudi's will need to see a return for their ridiculous investment and everything is going to crumble.

I just want to watch all the best golfers play together.

The revenue was never there. That's the whole point. It's never been about LIV tapping into the potential huge revenues the PGA was missing out on.

The best thing you can do is keep turning into the PGA if you ever want to see all the best players there are again or the quality stay as high.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

The revenue was never there. That's the whole point. It's never been about LIV tapping into the potential huge revenues the PGA was missing out on.

The best thing you can do is keep turning into the PGA if you ever want to see all the best players there are again or the quality stay as high.

Of course not, I have never implied it was.

It is out of our hands at this point. The framework agreement is the best hope we have for the two tours coming together under one umbrella.

 

[daver]

Of course not, I have never implied it was.

It is out of our hands at this point. The framework agreement is the best hope we have for the two tours coming together under one umbrella.

I have no interest in seeing players with zero motivation to win regular PGA tour events. Before LIV that concept only applied to Tiger and Rory; both of whom had reached a plateau very few ever reach (maybe just Jack) where the majors are the only tournaments that matter to them.

The LIV players choose to be whores and should be treated as such.

 

[daver]

An interesting angle to consider:

Why would the PGA want to merge with a golf tour that, according to TV ratings, has very little appeal to the public?

That makes zero business sense. Noone is buying the LIV product. What value does it bring now that one could argue that it wasn't individual players that people wanted to watch play golf; it was more about watching freakishly good golfers "compete". Only four or five names are arguably missing from being potentially being in contention in any given week. For everyone of them, there are ten players who can be just as good in any given week.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

Tiger Woods takes on new, more powerful role in PGA Tour hierarchy

As the PGA Tour presses forward with outside investment, Tiger Woods will have a significant say in its direction.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[Dr John Carlson]

AK shot -5 in the final round this week in Hong Kong, beating out Kokrak, Swafford, and Phil on the event.

All three of those dudes need to be sent in for bonesawing.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Scheffler should win in a runaway at Bay Hill

Currently has a 3 footer for a 5 stroke lead

Well deserved, a big win on a tough track in a loaded field.

Might be getting hot at the right time with Players and Augusta coming up

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

This is exactly what we were talking about earlier in this thread.

Scottie has an above average putting week, wins by 5 or 6 in a designated event.

Tee to green he is untouchable, if he can get the putter figured out with the mallet he could have a crazy year.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

This is exactly what we were talking about earlier in this thread.

Scottie has an above average putting week, wins by 5 or 6 in a designated event.

Tee to green he is untouchable, if he can get the putter figured out with the mallet he could have a crazy year.

The reason it's flawed is that if if you apply the logic of fixing one part of your game to like 5-10 others they would also win a lot more.

I know the line of thinking that putting is random and all that, but it really isn't. Scottie didn't randomly putt better this week. He putted better using a different style of putter. Putting is hard. He's not good at it. This week was different. Maybe the new putter will change that.

I know it's like an impossible standard to hit, but Scottie needs to win like 5+ times a year to dispel this reputation that he doesn't win at the level of some of his strokes gained numbers. He's the best player in the world right now. No one really doubts that he can run into a few hot putting weeks per year. The reputation though is that he leads in SG TTG like every week and only wins a few times a year, so to turn that SG reputation into tangible results he needs to win more often.