Confirmed with Link: PENS/STARS TRADE: Brenden Morrow, 2013 3rd<--> Joe Morrow, 2013 5th + contract talk

[Richard]

This is a pretty terrible deal; honestly has anyone in this thread consistently watched Dallas this year? Morrow is terrible, absolutely terrible. He never was a strong skater, average at best in his prime, but now is dreadful. Guerin was a much better skater when we acquired him.

Everyone talking about resigning him already, just wait until you watch his slow ass behing the play consistently. He is a player that shoulda cost you a 2nd or 3rd and if Boston was willing to significantly overpay LET THEM.

Don't see what value, on the ice, this deal adds for the Penguins.

Intangibles? Sure. But how effective can your leadership be if you cant play anymore. Morrow can't play-he's done.

 

[mpp9]

Ryan Whitney -> Chris Kunitz and Eric Tangradi
Alex Goligoski -> James Neal and Matt Niskanen
Joe Morrow, 5th -> Brenden Morrow, 3rd

Pens management has a solid history of maximizing our depth on the blueline via trades and I think they've earned a little leeway here.

I'm going to miss Joe Morrow like the rest of you but quit acting like Shero deserves to lose his job over this trade...the team is in the middle of a 12 game winning streak and first in the East. RS has probably done some things right along the way as well.

Yep. It is what it is at this point. I would expect Shero and his scouts have a better idea of what Morrow can bring here than any of us.

I find it hard to believe he's any slower than Malone and Geno worked just fine with him. He doesn't need speed on his line to be effective. He needs a guy who can win board battles and open up space by going to the net. That's Morrow's game. Give it a chance.

 

[chethejet]

It is a sellers market, but Dallas is in the playoff hunt and trades it's leader and captain. Sellers always know more than the buyer and in this case Shero overvalued B Morrow. Moreover many are suggesting the Pens extend this guy after the season. Could it be he is a beat up 34 year old player who started breaking down two years ago. Shero is selling us a bill of goods because he and Bylsma are rightfully concerned about the playoffs and fallout of a first round exit. It is not about trading for B Morrow, it is about the cost. This trade will not give Crosby and winger, this trade just pushes Bennett into next years plans. Can't wait for Letang to return so Bylsma can scratch Despres again.

 

[Sypher04]

After seeing what the hell a 20-30 point B Morrow cost the last thing I want to see Shero do is pursue Iginla. If he were to have overspent on an old past his prime rental I wouldve rather it of been Iginla but that ship has sailed and we blew our wad on a 3rd liner.

Some reports have pegged the asking price at 2 prospects and a pick.

I'd offer Dumoulin, Kuhnhackl and our 1st. Is it a lot? Yes, but Iginla signed for the playoffs and a few more years going forward (at a reasonable price) would be huge for us. We have pretty good prospect depth, moreso on the backend. Going forward, we'd have to hold onto our picks though and re-stock the cupboards. You gotta give to get and Iginla fills a role for us.

 

[thecore]

No, but supposing we do go after Iginla and it takes a few more prospects, you suddenly have exactly nothing to give up when a trade for a YOUNG forward potentially becomes available.

B. Morrow was worth a second rounder at best, or MAYBE a first. If it took a prospect for a player like Morrow, you say no and you look elsewhere. You don't make a trade for the sake of making it.

Morrow was a mid-late first, and the Stars gave us an early 3rd in exchange for a late 5th. So clearly, what we gave up for B. Morrow is equivalent to somewhere between a 1st and 2nd round pick. Shero's value is not that far off from yours. It's just that you probably think much more of Joe Morrow than he does.

 

[Richard]

It is a sellers market, but Dallas is in the playoff hunt and trades it's leader and captain. Sellers always know more than the buyer and in this case Shero overvalued B Morrow. Moreover many are suggesting the Pens extend this guy after the season. Could it be he is a beat up 34 year old player who started breaking down two years ago. Shero is selling us a bill of goods because he and Bylsma are rightfully concerned about the playoffs and fallout of a first round exit. It is not about trading for B Morrow, it is about the cost. This trade will not give Crosby and winger, this trade just pushes Bennett into next years plans. Can't wait for Letang to return so Bylsma can scratch Despres again.

Ya, I'm really starting to question management. They seem to be very concerned over the potential fallout of another first-round collapse. Morrow is NOT the player we should have traded any blue chip parts for. The guy is a has been and is done. I'd have been more satisfied with Jagr or Whitney, because both still have wheels and the hands.

Morrow is literally as slow as Eric Tangradi, if not slower.

 

[Sypher04]

It is a sellers market, but Dallas is in the playoff hunt and trades it's leader and captain. Sellers always know more than the buyer and in this case Shero overvalued B Morrow. Moreover many are suggesting the Pens extend this guy after the season. Could it be he is a beat up 34 year old player who started breaking down two years ago. Shero is selling us a bill of goods because he and Bylsma are rightfully concerned about the playoffs and fallout of a first round exit. It is not about trading for B Morrow, it is about the cost. This trade will not give Crosby and winger, this trade just pushes Bennett into next years plans. Can't wait for Letang to return so Bylsma can scratch Despres again.

Kinda melodramatic, no? Depres has played 24 games and has average almost 15 minutes per game as a rookie. It's not like he isn't getting his chance, with or without Letang.

 

[Sypher04]

Ya, I'm really starting to question management. They seem to be very concerned over the potential fallout of another first-round collapse. Morrow is NOT the player we should have traded any blue chip parts for. The guy is a has been and is done. I'd have been more satisfied with Jagr or Whitney, because both still have wheels and the hands.

Morrow is literally as slow as Eric Tangradi, if not slower.

Morrow's game really has nothing to do with speed. And also, it's not like Pittsburgh was the only team in line to give up a significant piece to acquire this guy. Odds are they know something we don't.

Morrow brings an element to the Malkin line that is sorely missing and Bennett just doesn't provide, as much as I like him.

 

[IHWR]

Ya, I'm really starting to question management.

Good for you.

 

[The Tang]

Ryan Whitney -> Chris Kunitz and Eric Tangradi
Alex Goligoski -> James Neal and Matt Niskanen
Joe Morrow, 5th -> Brenden Morrow, 3rd

Pens management has a solid history of maximizing our depth on the blueline via trades and I think they've earned a little leeway here.

I'm going to miss Joe Morrow like the rest of you but quit acting like Shero deserves to lose his job over this trade...the team is in the middle of a 12 game winning streak and first in the East. RS has probably done some things right along the way as well.

The difference is the Kunitz and Neal deals were for long term gain also and none of Neal, Niskanen or Kunitz were in a serious delcine.

I get all the grit and leadership arguments, but is there truly no other available player out there that doesn't also bring those and and not cost this much?

 

[Sypher04]

If Shero felt compelled enough to pull the trigger, my guess would be no.

I'm reserving judgement personally until I see Morrow play as a Penguin.

 

[ThatGuy]

So, Morrow should be ready to play vs Montreal right?

 

[Captain Hook]

I don't think the Pens see Morrow's age as a bad thing. He's exactly the type of veteran, experienced, leader/captain that they were targeting. I think they valued that more than a young kid that could be a long-term solution despite the fact that a lot of the team's fans may disagree with it.

 

[Richard]

Morrow's game really has nothing to do with speed. And also, it's not like Pittsburgh was the only team in line to give up a significant piece to acquire this guy. Odds are they know something we don't.

Morrow brings an element to the Malkin line that is sorely missing and Bennett just doesn't provide, as much as I like him.

And how well did nonquality skaters do in the past in the Penguins system? I seem to recall Poni working out well...........

I've watched probably 20 dallas games with Morrow playing, he just doesn't have it anymore. Why give up a blue chip prospect for a 3/4 line tweener? That makes ZERO sense.

I hope we win the cup and Morrow scores 8 timely goals and makes all of these veteran plays. The truth is, hes gonna get run out there by Dan because he is a veteran and hes going to contribute as much as Sykora did. Virtually nothing.

 

[MrBurghundy]

I really don't have a problem with us getting B. Morrow, but I really have a problem with the price that was paid.

At this point it doesn't matter though. It is what it is. I just hope B. Morrow doesn't **** the bed, because things could get ugly for Shero.

 

[wgknestrick]

They key part of the "impact" of this deal is who Morrow displaces on the roster.

If it is Glass, then obviously it really helps the Pens.

If it is TK, DJ, or Bennett, then it is close to a sideways (or maybe backwards) move.

The Pens have to replace their worst roster player with Morrow to maximize the impact of trading for him. If they send Bennett back down (worst case), the Pens are just not a better team. I know it seems obvious to most of us, but we all know how "well" (sarcasm) the Pens manage their roster and play their best players. The "right" decision is to move, waive, or scratch Glass to allow Morrow to play. Sadly, I know this is very unlikely to happen.


Glass - pretty helpful
Adams - helpful
Vitale - less helpful
DJ - close to sideways, but still improvement
TK - sideways (assuming TK gets back to near his past level of play)
Bennett - lose

 

[MrBurghundy]

Yeah if Bennett or DJ are out of the lineup, I'll be more than pissed. Those two are really playing well in their own end, and have been a big part of the team defenses success.

 

[The Old Master]

maybe we could hurry up and flip him to the bees, i would rather have what they were offering.

 

[Richard]

Unless Shero knows that Morrow (prospect) is going to be a dud, this is most assuredly a fireable offense. This is Zhitnik for Cobourn all over again. I didn't think we were that desperate......

 

[Power2ThePenguins]

I honestly don't see the point. Going to a lot of WBS games this year, I agree that J. Morrow had his issues and had yet to live up to all the hype surrounding him.

But why did the Pens need to do this? We don't need "veteran leadership" anymore. Crosby is now plenty experienced as a captain. We have other vets such as Neal, Dupuis, Kunitz, etc. The team has won 12 in a row and is basically healthy. We're tops in the conference and heavy Cup favorites. Why mess with that?

I hope that B. Morrow's production proves me wrong that this was pointless, but I am not a fan.

 

[dr robbie]

I was pretty indifferent on this trade, but man, the Stars think they've robbed us blind which really worries me (I read their thread)

 

[Darth Vitale]

I haven't seen a single thing yet from anyone here who watches WC games or from Dallas fans, that addresses Morrow's speed / skating. It's a legitimate question.

I've seen a couple games and he looked a little slow but by the sounds of others who watch him a lot, it's maybe worse than we suspect. I'd like to think he'd make a decent Kennedy replacement for a year next season if he's willing to take a pay cut, but maybe even that's not true as the only thing Kennedy does consistently well is skate.

As for the leadership stuff yah it helps but that intangible crap is highly overrated at Morrow's age. Matters a lot more when a player is in his prime.

This deal feels in some ways like the Ponikorovsky trade to me. The guy has certain qualities you like and you hope he improves the team, but there's not much to suggest he's going to make a big impact if you look at the reality of the situation.

To me it boils down to this: we gave up a very valuable prospect for a guy who might not even have another full season left in him. That is always a bad idea, no matter how risky / iffy prospects can be. All trades should be made with future impact in mind as well as current impact. This feels like a trade where future impact was not considered even though I know Shero values Joe Morrow as well / that he's not dumb.

Last but not least, using the scary aspects of this trade as "proof" that "Shero bad", is Full Rossi. Nonsense about not having back-up plans and not signing their favorite pet FA last summer, "Strait debacle" etc. GMAFB already. I sincerely hope the people who try to "connect the dots" in situations like this aren't lawyers; you'd land an innocent person in prison no doubt. We can do without the hyperbole, even in criticizing. This is not a firable offense by any means. A chink in the armor for sure, and worthy of criticism IMO (I've always backed Shero), but let's not get carried away before game 1.

 

[Sypher04]

Morrow can bring the grinding, physicality, and netfront presence to the Malkin line that it is missing without Chris Kunitz there with Neal and Malkin. None of the wingers in that spot this season (Tangradi, Boychuk, Bennett and Kennedy) have been able to play that role they need. I think calling it a sideways move at this point is maybe jumping the gun.

 

[Guins71]

I love all these Lazyboy Recliner GM's who are acting like they know exactly how Morrow is going to fit in and play with this team. Listen, GM's do make bad trades, but I am going to trust Ray Shero's judgement and scouts over a few of you who are sitting on their lazyboy recliners watching NHL Center Ice and looking at Stat Lines posing as wannabe scouts. Did I like giving up Joe Morrow? Heck no. I wish it was for Tyler Kennedy and a 3rd round pick, but don't sit and tell me that you know exactly how he will fit in.

 

[IcedCapp]

Morrow can bring the grinding, physicality, and netfront presence to the Malkin line that it is missing without Chris Kunitz there with Neal and Malkin. None of the wingers in that spot this season (Tangradi, Boychuk, Bennett and Kennedy) have been able to play that role they need. I think calling it a sideways move at this point is maybe jumping the gun.

Totally disagree. Bennett was bringing a TON to the Malkin line: defensive responsibility, grit along the boards, winning puck battles, and someone who has the vision and creativity and IQ to mesh with Malkin. On top of that, Malkin seemed to trust him more than any other player used on that wing. Bennett's presence turned that line from a -7 to a +... Even with Malkin out of the lineup. His impact has been enormous.

I love all these Lazyboy Recliner GM's who are acting like they know exactly how Morrow is going to fit in and play with this team. Listen, GM's do make bad trades, but I am going to trust Ray Shero's judgement and scouts over a few of you who are sitting on their lazyboy recliners watching NHL Center Ice and looking at Stat Lines posing as wannabe scouts. Did I like giving up Joe Morrow? Heck no. I wish it was for Tyler Kennedy and a 3rd round pick, but don't sit and tell me that you know exactly how he will fit in.

Yea, it's all about being lazyboy recliner GMs (why can't we just say armchair? It's less work. Wait, you used Lazyboy recliners twice. Do you work for them? Holy cow that's a lot of typing)

No Pens fan who has watched Morrow play this year wanted him. No Stars fan wanted him. The Stars didn't want him, and he was their captain. But yea, the scouts like what they saw. Why didn't Dallas' scouts like what they had? Hmmm.

Edit: all of us "negative lazyboy recliner GMs" who aren't rah-rah-ree over this move WANT IT TO WORK. We want the Penguins to win the Cup. We certainly hope that Morrow comes to the Pens and remembers how to hit and skate and do all the stuff that made him such a highly-touted player. I hope it happens. I really do. Nothing would make me happier than to be eating a table full of crow about this.