peak Jagr vs McDavid now

[Thenameless]

Edit - this will hurt his all time status with some posters though. He could be known as a guy who barely won 6 art ross because his competition was weak and his peak wasnt even great

If he "barely" wins 6 Art Ross Trophies, I'm saving him a seat at my all-time table. As it stands now, even with such a short career, I have McDavid making my Top 100 all-time (easily).

 

[Nadal On Clay]

I'm pretty sure he played sick for all of November last season which also happened to be statistically his worst month so we'll see what he does this year.

Sick of that Edmonton team surrounding him..

 

[North Cole]

If he "barely" wins 6 Art Ross Trophies, I'm saving him a seat at my all-time table. As it stands now, even with such a short career, I have McDavid making my Top 100 all-time (easily).

But you know it will happen...

"Didnt have any Conn Smythe.."
"Didnt win a cup"
"Didnt have sufficient competition like Crosby/Ov/Malkin, so he won his Art Ross for free"

There's a number of ways to spin it to demean the achievements, Ovechkin went through it with 6 rockets and no cup. Now when people talk about Ov vs Crosby they bring up the gold medals

 

[C4R105]

Another question - who would benefited more, McDavid in dead puck era because of slow D-men and slower game in general, or Jagr under less obstructions ?

 

[tony d]

Peak Jagr for me.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

But you know it will happen...

"Didnt have any Conn Smythe.."
"Didnt win a cup"
"Didnt have sufficient competition like Crosby/Ov/Malkin, so he won his Art Ross for free"

There's a number of ways to spin it to demean the achievements, Ovechkin went through it with 6 rockets and no cup. Now when people talk about Ov vs Crosby they bring up the gold medals

Thats quite the hyperbole.

 

[North Cole]

Thats quite the hyperbole.

Not really. Never specified how many people, just that some do.

If I said everyone says this, then yes. Some people do act like the gold medals separate them. Personally, I think people should save the international acoldaes for the HOF discussions.

If you'd like me to edit in the "some" I can.

 

[Thenameless]

But you know it will happen...

"Didnt have any Conn Smythe.."
"Didnt win a cup"
"Didnt have sufficient competition like Crosby/Ov/Malkin, so he won his Art Ross for free"

There's a number of ways to spin it to demean the achievements, Ovechkin went through it with 6 rockets and no cup. Now when people talk about Ov vs Crosby they bring up the gold medals

For sure. The choker label is a hard one to shake - happened to Yzerman, happened to Ovechkin, and to this day haunts guys like Thornton and Marcel Dionne. If he can't win in Edmonton, he may have to go Cup chasing late in his career like Bourque did.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Not really. Never specified how many people, just that some do.

If I said everyone says this, then yes. Some people do act like the gold medals separate them. Personally, I think people should save the international acoldaes for the HOF discussions.

If you'd like me to edit in the "some" I can.

Nobody who is knowledgeable brings up this kind of argument.

That’s as dumb as saying Ovechkin is better than Crosby because he has more career pts.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

And that is relevant how?

Crosby still co King

 

[North Cole]

For sure. The choker label is a hard one to shake - happened to Yzerman, happened to Ovechkin, and to this day haunts guys like Thornton and Marcel Dionne. If he can't win in Edmonton, he may have to go Cup chasing late in his career like Bourque did.

Yep, and I wouldnt blame him.

Nobody who is knowledgeable brings up this kind of argument.

That’s as dumb as saying Ovechkin is better than Crosby because he has more career pts.

Hey, I dont disagree with you. It's just that, not everyone who comments is necessarily informed about a topic, and that's not a slam against posters, I'm sure for many people posting here is just a hobby/fun. There's plenty of hockey related things I dont know about; but some people still use those arguments.

 

[authentic]

Another question - who would benefited more, McDavid in dead puck era because of slow D-men and slower game in general, or Jagr under less obstructions ?

Probably Jagr because McDavid would almost definitely be injured more.

 

[Regal]

Another question - who would benefited more, McDavid in dead puck era because of slow D-men and slower game in general, or Jagr under less obstructions ?

I don't think either benefit. Jagr probably is less affected assuming he never bulks up like he did. He was pretty fast in his youth but gained size through the DPE to deal with the clutch and grab. I don't think McDavid benefits any from the DPE. The red line and trap clogged the neutral zone and made speed less of a weapon than it is today.

 

[C4R105]

I don't think either benefit. Jagr probably is less affected assuming he never bulks up like he did. He was pretty fast in his youth but gained size through the DPE to deal with the clutch and grab. I don't think McDavid benefits any from the DPE. The red line and trap clogged the neutral zone and made speed less of a weapon than it is today.

good reasoning. To be honest, I can hardly imagine Jagr ever lose the puck legally under todays rules.