Player Discussion: Patrik Laine

[Eyeseeing]

It's an English figure of speech. Either / or, this and that, etc. If I'd said "needs changing", then I'd be discounting Laine's strength of character.

I remember why I rarely participate in this thread - even misinterpreted idioms are used as a provocation to argue over nothing. I've stated many times in many threads that I'd like to see the lineup tinkered with, but I'm not one to run around with my hair on fire over issues with the team so you may have missed it.



I'm sure it wasn't. This is usually how civil conversations are held.

PS: hey Laine - I love you as a player. I'll be over here in the corner quietly cheering for you!

Agree with you
He’s only 20 years old
Just starting 3rd year
Expectations here are “interesting”

 

[KingBogo]

He needs a good centre. He's a finisher. He isn't meant to do the dirty grind work. The other two on his line need to distribute the puck to him and that hasn't happened.

How do you ever manage to be an impact player in the NHL without doing any dirty work? If all you can do is sit and wait for others to set the table for you, being a PP specialist is pretty much your ceiling. Man I hope Laine becomes more than that.

 

[Aggie204]

I cannot wait until Laine pumps in a Hattie just to shut those smug posters on the main boards. It’s comical and annoying at the same time. It’s been 4 games for crying out loud.

 

[Ducky10]

He needs a good centre. He's a finisher. He isn't meant to do the dirty grind work. The other two on his line need to distribute the puck to him and that hasn't happened.

This isn't a realistic expectation for an NHL player. All great goal scorers get their noses dirty, create and score goals from tough areas. Lost in all this also is that Laine is a great playmaker, which in the NHL often happens below the Hashmarks.

Which isn't to say he won't benefit from a better playmaking C, but it can't be only one way.

 

[cbcwpg]

This isn't a realistic expectation for an NHL player. All great goal scorers get their noses dirty, create and score goals from tough areas. Lost in all this also is that Laine is a great playmaker, which in the NHL often happens below the Hashmarks.

Which isn't to say he won't benefit from a better playmaking C, but it can't be only one way.

I know the game has changed, but another Finn.. Jari Jurri, scored almost 500 goals while playing for the Oilers and I can't remember a single one of them being from the "tough areas". He got his goals because he had a great shot and he played with a great centerman.

Historically, great scoring wingers had great centermen feeding them the puck.

Hull - Mikita
Gretzky - Robitaille
Gretzky - Kurri
Bossy - Trottier
Hull - Oates
Lecavalier - St. Louis

The list goes on... If Laine is going to have a career of say 10-15 years where is consistently putting the puck in the net 40+ times a season, he can't do it on his own... The Jets need to find someone that can play center with him. Doesn't mean he can't get the dirty goals... just needs some help.

 

[Jack722]

I think the best way to develop a player is to put him in the best possible position to succeed. I don't recall very many "Ehlers just needs to learn to X" posts when he was stuck playing on a line with Thorburn a couple years ago. Everyone agreed that that was ridiculous.

Does Petan just need to learn to finish his own chances? Or do people agree that he should be paired with good players to make the best of his abilities?

Would playing Petan in a situation to which he wasn't suited be the best way to develop him as a player?

How do you ever manage to be an impact player in the NHL without doing any dirty work? If all you can do is sit and wait for others to set the table for you, being a PP specialist is pretty much your ceiling. Man I hope Laine becomes more than that.

Laine has been nothing less than an impact player through two seasons, scoring 36 goals as a rookie and then what... 44? With lower average TOI than any of the other 10 players around him.

I don't buy the implication that putting Laine with good playmakers/grinders who did more of the dirty work for him would prevent him from learning or developing those skills. Again, I think if you want a guy to get better, you put him in the best possible situation to succeed.

 

[LowLefty]

I know the game has changed, but another Finn.. Jari Jurri, scored almost 500 goals while playing for the Oilers and I can't remember a single one of them being from the "tough areas". He got his goals because he played with a great centerman.

Historically, great scoring wingers had great centermen feeding them the puck.

Hull - Mikita
Gretzky - Robitaille
Gretzky - Kurri
Bossy - Trottier
Hull - Oates
Lecavalier - St. Louis

The list goes on... If Laine is going to have a career of say 10-15 years where is consistently putting the puck in the net 40+ times a season, he can't do it on his own... The Jets need to find someone that can play center with him. Doesn't mean he can't get the dirty goals... just needs some help.

Not sure the games played the same way today - for example, the roaring 70's / 80's were very much a wide open game where the emphasis was on offense, straight up and down the ice, long shifts and every thing was off the rush - perpetual cycle, board work and grind were not a big part of the game other than a few 4th lines that did I nice job of chasing the better players around the rink hoping to tire them out before they had a chance to score.

 

[LowLefty]

I think the best way to develop a player is to put him in the best possible position to succeed. I don't recall very many "Ehlers just needs to learn to X" posts when he was stuck playing on a line with Thorburn a couple years ago. Everyone agreed that that was ridiculous.

Does Petan just need to learn to finish his own chances? Or do people agree that he should be paired with good players to make the best of his abilities?

Would playing Petan in a situation to which he wasn't suited be the best way to develop him as a player?



Laine has been nothing less than an impact player through two seasons, scoring 36 goals as a rookie and then what... 44? With lower average TOI than any of the other 10 players around him.

I don't buy the implication that putting Laine with good playmakers/grinders who did more of the dirty work for him would prevent him from learning or developing those skills. Again, I think if you want a guy to get better, you put him in the best possible situation to succeed.

Who do you have in mind - Scheif?
TBH, I don't think Sheif is interested in that role

 

[YWGinYYZ]

Not saying that it would be about cap management, but taking Laine off PP 1 would be too obvious.

So it's very subtle sandbagging then?

Sorry: I just don't buy it. People are obviously free to believe what they want, but it's really, really stretching things to assume that they'd want to screw with one of their best assets. Easier to keep him happy and deal with cap issues later through other means. The Jets are already a cap team, so the only thing this would help them with is balancing the roster, not cost savings. Just don't see this as being realistic.

 

[Ducky10]

I know the game has changed, but another Finn.. Jari Jurri, scored almost 500 goals while playing for the Oilers and I can't remember a single one of them being from the "tough areas". He got his goals because he had a great shot and he played with a great centerman.

Historically, great scoring wingers had great centermen feeding them the puck.

Hull - Mikita
Gretzky - Robitaille
Gretzky - Kurri
Bossy - Trottier
Hull - Oates
Lecavalier - St. Louis

The list goes on... If Laine is going to have a career of say 10-15 years where is consistently putting the puck in the net 40+ times a season, he can't do it on his own... The Jets need to find someone that can play center with him. Doesn't mean he can't get the dirty goals... just needs some help.

The point is it works both ways and yes the game has changed dramatically from the days of Kurri-Gretzky. Also great example using the greatest hockey player to ever live, plus I realy doubt you remember all 500 goals.

I'd also offer Bossy scored plenty of goals from tough areas, so not sure that's a very good example. Hull was a one dimensional player which I hope Laine is able to be much better than.

I wasn't even born when Hull played with Mikita but I know he was a tough sob, so I really doubt he was afraid to head to some tough areas.

Additionally, I also said Laine would benefit from having a better playmaking C, but to suggest that is all he needs is foolish.

 

[Ducky10]

Not sure the games played the same way today - for example, the roaring 70's / 80's were very much a wide open game where the emphasis was on offense, straight up and down the ice, long shifts and every thing was off the rush - perpetual cycle, board work and grind were not a big part of the game other than a few 4th lines that did I nice job of chasing the better players around the rink hoping to tire them out before they had a chance to score.

And don't forget if that didn't work, just hacking, slashing and generally beating the living shit out of them.

 

[tntkid]

Why not trade Trouba for Nylander.
Trouba is basically gone at the end of the season for nothing anyway.

Put Nylander with Ehlers and Laine.

 

[ffh]

Why not trade Trouba for Nylander.
Trouba is basically gone at the end of the season for nothing anyway.

Put Nylander with Ehlers and Laine.

I would rather have given trouba 8 mill than Nylander. Either way neither of them could play Centre.

 

[Peggy]

This isn't a realistic expectation for an NHL player. All great goal scorers get their noses dirty, create and score goals from tough areas. Lost in all this also is that Laine is a great playmaker, which in the NHL often happens below the Hashmarks.

Which isn't to say he won't benefit from a better playmaking C, but it can't be only one way.

The issue isn't just Laine
I don't even think he's an issue tbh. He's young and learning still

It's balancing the lines out thays the problem right now
Putting your 2 best players on one line isn't going to work anymore on this team
Not when your 2c has regressed the way he has

 

[tntkid]

I would rather have given trouba 8 mill than Nylander. Either way neither of them could play Centre.

I doubt Trouba re signs with us after this season and we will lose him for nothing when another team picks him up just like Stastny.

Lets get some return value for him and someone who can play with Laine.

 

[Ducky10]

The issue isn't just Laine
I don't even think he's an issue tbh. He's young and learning still

It's balancing the lines out thays the problem right now
Putting your 2 best players on one line isn't going to work anymore on this team
Not when your 2c has regressed the way he has

Don't disagree at all, but both apply.

 

[Festinator]

Tbh I think a Wheeler would help Laine more than a Scheifele. A playmaking power-foward, rather than a shooting center.

I feel like you could go:

Laine-Little-Wheeler
Connor-Scheifele-Ehlers

And things would still be very good. Maybe i'm getting desperate though, but I'd like to see it tried. Wheeler lifts the level of Little while also having Laine to feed in the slot.

 

[Pacholeafs]

Exactly.
Matthews is not a good playmaker, he is a sniping center who scores goals. Period.
And he has Marner on his wing. Marner is a great playmaker and smarter than Matthews.

Just imagine Laine with Aho on his line. LW or C, doesn‘t matter, Aho is so smart, he can play any role.

what? Matthews plays with Kappanen and Marleau

 

[Tommigun]

The point is it works both ways and yes the game has changed dramatically from the days of Kurri-Gretzky. Also great example using the greatest hockey player to ever live, plus I realy doubt you remember all 500 goals.

I'd also offer Bossy scored plenty of goals from tough areas, so not sure that's a very good example. Hull was a one dimensional player which I hope Laine is able to be much better than.

I wasn't even born when Hull played with Mikita but I know he was a tough sob, so I really doubt he was afraid to head to some tough areas.

Additionally, I also said Laine would benefit from having a better playmaking C, but to suggest that is all he needs is foolish.

But it IS all he needs. He doesn’t have anything to prove with scoring 80 in his first two seasons, and he’s getting better organically without having to take a stint at 4th line to learn to grind. Did you see how he fared with Stastny and Copp at center? Stastny’s gone so try Copp there again. Oh, and he also needs ice time, like half of the team does.

 

[Peggy]

Don't disagree at all, but both apply.

Does it seem like laine isn't improving?

 

[Peggy]

Tbh I think a Wheeler would help Laine more than a Scheifele. A playmaking power-foward, rather than a shooting center.

I feel like you could go:

Laine-Little-Wheeler
Connor-Scheifele-Ehlers

And things would still be very good. Maybe i'm getting desperate though, but I'd like to see it tried. Wheeler lifts the level of Little while also having Laine to feed in the slot.

Either or
Do both of them
Laine little wheeler
Connor scheifele ehlers

Perreault Scheifele laine
Connor little wheeler

I like either of those better than what Maurice is using right now

Maybe Maurice is using these lines to show/tell Chevy something

 

[ffh]

Either or
Do both of them
Laine little wheeler
Connor scheifele ehlers

Perreault Scheifele laine
Connor little Connor

I like either of those better than what Maurice is using right now

Maybe Maurice is using these lines to show/tell Chevy something

connor little connor ?

 

[PhilJets]

Jarri Kurri

Brett Hull

I see similarity with Laine.

 

[Peggy]

connor little connor ?

Connor little wheeler*

 

[Farmboy Patty]

How do you ever manage to be an impact player in the NHL without doing any dirty work? If all you can do is sit and wait for others to set the table for you, being a PP specialist is pretty much your ceiling. Man I hope Laine becomes more than that.

Saying that Laine isn't supposed to do the dirty work is not the same as saying that he shouldn't do ANY dirty work. It's almost like people in this forum misinterpret things by purpose and go to the extremes when replying to posts like this.

Laine is an elite sniper and would be most effective with an elite playmaker, and could score more goals then the second lines wingers combined. That C on rhe Jets team is Scheifele.

For some reason he is not being used that way, and that makes some Jets and Laine fans wonder what the reason for that is.