Value of: Patrick Kane & Duncan Keith

[Lockin17]

P.Kane full salary for Jeff Skinner, Kyle Okposo, Dylan Cozens, Casey Mittelstad,, 1st 2021 and 1st 2022

that's a crazy offer , not sure Buff will like that

 

[Unbiased Fan]

that's a crazy offer , not sure Buff will like that

They get out of Skinner and that’s essential to the future success of the Sabres.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

that's a crazy offer , not sure Buff will like that

It doesn't work cap wise, and it would actually work better for the Hawks if Buffalo retained half on Skinner and the Hawks retained half on Kane. It's a good basis for a deal though. It would have to be both Kane and Keith in that deal for it to work cap wise and the Hawks would need one more piece. The attractiveness and why it costs so much is that the Sabres get out of half of Skinner's deal and they dump Okposo as well.

 

[CraigsList]

It’s kind of difficult to estimate value but Kane retained down to the 5.25-6.5M range has to get a HAUL. That’s dirt cheap for the caliber of player he still is, three years remaining at that price, proven clutch player with tons of playoff experience. A contender could fit 5.5M into their salary structure by including a cap dump going back, so which genuine contenders would benefit the most from a better than point per game, play driving winger and playoff stud?

The Hawks retaining half of Kane’s salary for 2.5 seasons is absurd. They better be getting compensated a first round pick for every year of that duration and then some if that’s the case.

 

[Mrfenn92]

that's a crazy offer , not sure Buff will like that

Hawks aren’t taking skinner for 7 years at $9 million of cap

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Hawks aren’t taking skinner for 7 years at $9 million of cap

Yeah that's the issue. I'd take him if the Sabres retained 50%.

 

[Mrfenn92]

Yeah that's the issue. I'd take him if the Sabres retained 50%.

Hawks still aren’t taking him. Also the Sabres aren’t retaining for that long

 

[bobholly39]

The only way Kane or Keith go anywhere is if they want to.
I truly believe that Kane and Toews(if he is healthy enough to continue his career) never want to play anywhere else. I do not believe that Kane would waive his NMC and I think he's going to want to re-sign with the Hawks for a lesser amount at the end of his deal. There is a rumor that he's eternally grateful for the Hawks sticking by him through all of his immature antics early in his career. The cabbie incident, the drunken partying, a whole bunch of other things. They stood by him when he was falsely accused of sexual assault, when public pressure was at the point that they suggested he should be traded in the aftermath, even though the allegations were proven false. At the time, because of his past behavior, There was a large segment of fans that did not believe he was innocent. Kane took off as a player afterward, even though his teammates best years were behind them.

Kane and his gf are starting a family now, and I think he truly believes Chicago is his home. The only way he goes anywhere else is if the Hawks don't want him, and that's a hard thing to do to a franchise legend like Kane, especially with the franchise history. If Rocky Wirtz wants to show that he's not like his father, he should respect Kane's wishes. #88 has earned that right. He should leave the Hawks on his terms. The Hawks have a long history of mistreating franchise legends, so it's imperative that they handle Kane differently. What's tough is the timing of this rebuild. Balancing keeping Kane around and building the next winner is going to be hard. The salary cap complicates things, but the Hawks should try their best to keep Kane around as long as he wants to be here.....I hope they don't have to make the tough decision to allow Kane to leave against his wishes.

To the bolded - I'm starting to think that's not as meaningful as we think it would be. Both of them - Toews especially - seemed upset with some of the rebuilding moves the gm pulled this off season. Brodeur was never going to leave NJ. Lundqvist never going to leave NYR. Chara Boston, Thornton San Jose....things change even if we don't expect it.

Hawks are far enough removed from playoff success in 2021 that I think you'd be surprised. I'm not saying Toews/Kane are necessarily going to ask for a trade tomorrow - but they're probably less prone to thinking "no - i'm not leaving Chicago no matter what, it's the only team i'll play for" than you expect. If an opportunity presented itself to play in a new city that they felt was attractive - I think they'd heavily consider it.

 

[CraigsList]

Yeah that's the issue. I'd take him if the Sabres retained 50%.

That’s a good way to bone the Sabres.

why would they want to pay a total of 31.5m in 7 years to a guy that’s not even on their team anymore? They’re better off buying him out after he earns his next bonus.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

That’s a good way to bone the Sabres.

why would they want to pay a total of 31.5m in 7 years to a guy that’s not even on their team anymore? They’re better off buying him out after he earns his next bonus.

Because it's better than paying the entire thing?
Then they're stuck with him.
Okposo's contract is shorter term, so I'd take that back but hard pass on Skinner without 50% retention.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

That’s a good way to bone the Sabres.

why would they want to pay a total of 31.5m in 7 years to a guy that’s not even on their team anymore? They’re better off buying him out after he earns his next bonus.

BTW Mangiapane's name roughly translates to "breadeater" Literally it's eat bread, but as a surname it's breadeater.

 

[Drake1588]

In something of an anomaly, it's always seemed to me that all seven of Backstrom, Crosby, Kane, Kopitar, Malkin, Ovechkin, and Toews will finish out their NHL careers in the cities where they started. I don't think that generation's stars are going to bounce around at the tail ends of their careers.

 

[gach]

What are the Hawks’ biggest need?

Hockey players

 

[Djp]

Reality check needed

Chicago will not get in a trade

1 a top 3 team prospect/young player under 23
2. A recent top 10 pick who is under 23
3.1sts traded will be lottery protected

kane’s cap hit means retention needed or cap hit coming back. Nobody has the space to take his salary and is a playoff likely team.

Keith is older and he is not a top oair Dman on a playoff team. I’m not saying he sucks but reality check is needed.

In terms of return

Keith at 50% would get a playoff team 1st, a non playoff team 2nd thst coukd become a 1st + decent but not top 5 prospect + current young secondary roster player. No irliwer retention the young roster players turns into a higher cost player to balance out salary

for Kane the return could be a decent player making $4M+ + 1st, 2nd, 2 good prospects + cap dump going back or retention. The quality sending back coukd affect the other stuff.

 

[Mrfenn92]

Reality check needed

Chicago will not get in a trade

1 a top 3 team prospect/young player under 23
2. A recent top 10 pick who is under 23
3.1sts traded will be lottery protected

kane’s cap hit means retention needed or cap hit coming back. Nobody has the space to take his salary and is a playoff likely team.

Keith is older and he is not a top oair Dman on a playoff team. I’m not saying he sucks but reality check is needed.

In terms of return

Keith at 50% would get a playoff team 1st, a non playoff team 2nd thst coukd become a 1st + decent but not top 5 prospect + current young secondary roster player. No irliwer retention the young roster players turns into a higher cost player to balance out salary

for Kane the return could be a decent player making $4M+ + 1st, 2nd, 2 good prospects + cap dump going back or retention. The quality sending back coukd affect the other stuff.

In this thread the only reality check needed is the hawks taking back skinner in any deal

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

In this thread the only reality check needed is the hawks taking back skinner in any deal

Eh, yeah....the more I think about it, that's one of the worst contracts in hockey. It's way too damn long, even at 50%.

 

[Djp]

In this thread the only reality check needed is the hawks taking back skinner in any deal

WTF. I never mentioned that name.

 

[SotasicA]

The Hawks needed to trade Kane two years ago, when they first finished last in the division in 2017-18, and Kane was still in his prime. His value would have been through the roof.

Now he's on the wrong side of 30 and won't net an equal franchise player anymore.

Keith's value isn't worth trading him. Keeping him and Toews makes more sense, for leadership etc. But Kane could have netted them a nice haul.

 

[ColbyChaos]

Mittelstadt + Quinn + Jokiharju + Skinner + 1st + 2nd

lol

 

[ColbyChaos]

that's a crazy offer , not sure Buff will like that

Buff wont like it? Chicago gets a 9 million cap penalty basically with Skinner for 6 more years

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Reality check needed

Chicago will not get in a trade

1 a top 3 team prospect/young player under 23
2. A recent top 10 pick who is under 23
3.1sts traded will be lottery protected

kane’s cap hit means retention needed or cap hit coming back. Nobody has the space to take his salary and is a playoff likely team.

Keith is older and he is not a top oair Dman on a playoff team. I’m not saying he sucks but reality check is needed.

In terms of return

Keith at 50% would get a playoff team 1st, a non playoff team 2nd thst coukd become a 1st + decent but not top 5 prospect + current young secondary roster player. No irliwer retention the young roster players turns into a higher cost player to balance out salary

for Kane the return could be a decent player making $4M+ + 1st, 2nd, 2 good prospects + cap dump going back or retention. The quality sending back coukd affect the other stuff.

Then he's not worth trading.

 

[CallMeShaft]

I'm not going to comment too much on proposals, but will say that if Toews is looking like he's done playing (I certainly hope he isn't), I could see both guys asking to be moved.

If the Hawks got Toews (along with Dach) back next season, as well as a goalie and a top 5 pick, this team can start turning it around relatively soon. But without Toews, it's a much bigger challenge to go back to at least flirting with a playoff spot in 2022. So without him, Kane and Keith have to be somewhat aware they aren't going to play important games for awhile unless they get moved elsewhere.

Not to mention the locker room, from all accounts, feels different without Toews there. Not gonna go digging up Kane's comments from training camp, but he did make mentions that it feels different without #19, and it didn't sound like he was saying things improved in there.

If Toews looks like he'll return, they'll stick around. If, come the trade deadline, there isn't any positive signs of him returning; I think it becomes likelier than not that at least one of Kane/Keith is placed on the market.

 

[Rick C137]

The Hawks needed to trade Kane two years ago, when they first finished last in the division in 2017-18, and Kane was still in his prime. His value would have been through the roof.

Now he's on the wrong side of 30 and won't net an equal franchise player anymore.

Keith's value isn't worth trading him. Keeping him and Toews makes more sense, for leadership etc. But Kane could have netted them a nice haul.

The year before that season the hawks finished 1st place in the west. You are out of your f***ing mind if you think it was at all realistic a team was gonna trade it’s Conn Smythe/3x cup winning franchise player (who’s still in his 20s) after 1 bad season. I’m sure this worked great for your nhl 18 team where you can completely ignore the business aspect of team building.

 

[Jabba11]

Patrick Kane would look amazing in a Habs jersey. Won't ever happen though. My favorite player..such a clutch player and still is. Deserves another ring.

 

[Pitter Patter]

P.Kane full salary for Jeff Skinner, Kyle Okposo, Dylan Cozens, Casey Mittelstad,, 1st 2021 and 1st 2022

For taking on Skinner and Okposo, you haven’t even moved the needle into the positive yet,
I have less made an interesting offer.