Proposal: Parayko for ROR

[BlueDream]

Can someone explain to me what this obsession with Parayko is exactly? Dude has been sheltered consistently & isn't that special.

He’s not really sheltered at all. We just have Pietrangelo ahead of him... that’s not the same thing at all.

As for why people like him, he’s a very good skater for someone who is 6’6, is very good defensively, has a hard shot and can put up 35-40 points. Why would people not want a top pairing defenseman like that? I must have forgotten how many available defensemen there are that are better than Parayko (and he’s not even available)...

 

[tsujimoto74]

So if eichel is the 1c that makes ror the second best center on the team even though he could play 1c he is dubbed the 2 c. So since petro is better than parayko he is the #1rhd which makes parayko the second best Dan on our team the #2rhd even though he has show with 23+ mins a night and heading worlds teams with the #1rhd position that he can play the #1rhd role.

So long story short the only reason. They are the #1s of their position is because there is already someone there better than them playing that spot. Rather keep parayko and develop Thomas.

Not really a strong analogy considering Buffalo actually relies on ROR more than Eichel. No question Eichel is by far the superior offensive talent, but O'Reilly plays more and (much, much) harder minutes, and still produces offense to boot. Parayko doesn't play more than Pietrangelo, and he's certainly not tasked with playing tougher minutes than Pietro. ROR does, in fact, play 1C minutes, and he plays them well. Parayko has never played 1D minutes, and plenty of promising young defenseman who look like they have the ability to jump up to that role never do.

 

[Colt55]

Not really a strong analogy considering Buffalo actually relies on ROR more than Eichel. No question Eichel is by far the superior offensive talent, but O'Reilly plays more and (much, much) harder minutes, and still produces offense to boot. Parayko doesn't play more than Pietrangelo, and he's certainly not tasked with playing tougher minutes than Pietro. ROR does, in fact, play 1C minutes, and he plays them well. Parayko has never played 1D minutes, and plenty of promising young defenseman who look like they have the ability to jump up to that role never do.

Oh but he has played the 1d minutes. If you read my post you would know. But it's cool your not getting him

 

[Dbrownss]

Can someone explain to me what this obsession with Parayko is exactly? Dude has been sheltered consistently & isn't that special.

Same obsession with Ryan O'Crylie

 

[stl76]

Only if somebody at the Sabres were in love with Dunn's projection. I'm not the guy who'd know.

If it's not a polished player like Parayko, I think the Sabres have to have the sense that they're getting back multiple pieces are going to be strengths in their top 6/4 in a couple years time. Get younger and get a future top 6 W and a top 4 D, that could work.

But everybody's got a future top 4 D and top 6 W to sell you if you buy the home crowd's scouting report, so I'm not gonna comment on the specific player here, just because I'm not qualified.

Fair enough. That's a completely reasonable position and I appreciate your candor.

Frankly, It's refreshing to see someone maturely and reasonably admit their own lack of knowledge on a subject. Too many keyboard experts on HF in general and the trade board in particular lately IMO.

Change Barbashev to Kyrou and you might have something if Botterill is looking for a futures based return.

Ehhhh, that's a pretty huge ask. Not saying Kyrou is off limits for a player of ROR's quality...but Kyrou + Dunn is an enormous ask.

You're talking about a 21 year old cost controlled dman on an ELC coming off an excellent rookie season in which he proved he belongs in the top 4...with legit top pairing upside. That alone is worth it's weight in gold. Kyrou is a league wide top 15-20 affiliated prospect coming off an OHL MVP season.

I fully understand ROR's value, but would want to good piece added onto the Buffalo side. Maybe a swap of picks, Blues 2019 3rd for sabres 2018 2nd? Not sure even that would be enough.

Berglund is interesting, I have serious concerns about Fabbri's injury situation (you'd have to elaborate there), Barbashev, Sobotka, Blais, Foley and Sanford don't appear to meet the speedy LW'er for line 1 or 2 scenario that are ready to step in immediately.

So, based on early analysis, Berglund would be my only interest.

Berglund could be added in place of Sobotka. The issue is he has a modified NTC (I think 20 team no trade list?) which would make a deal a bit more difficult. Personally, I would have no issue adding him to the deal tho.

The Fabbri injury situation is pretty well documented. Prior to injury he was a lock to be our #2 LW behind Schwartz with an outside shot of transitioning to C eventually once he got comfortable playing in the NHL. Speedy player with 2 seperate ACL tears on the same knee later, it remains to be seen if he can return to form. FWIW I am pretty confident he can still be an impact player in the future, but it's obviously a risk.

Of the players you listed, Barbashev is the closest to NHL ready currently IMO. I'm not going to write out an elaborate sales pitch if you're simply not interested, but I think his floor is 3rd line LW/C, with a decent chance of #2 LW if he can find consistency and develop his offensive side. He is a very good skater, might not blow the doors off, but above average NHL speed/skating.

 

[is the answer jesus]

Fair enough. That's a completely reasonable position and I appreciate your candor.

Frankly, It's refreshing to see someone maturely and reasonably admit their own lack of knowledge on a subject. Too many keyboard experts on HF in general and the trade board in particular lately IMO.


Ehhhh, that's a pretty huge ask. Not saying Kyrou is off limits for a player of ROR's quality...but Kyrou + Dunn is an enormous ask.

You're talking about a 21 year old cost controlled dman on an ELC coming off an excellent rookie season in which he proved he belongs in the top 4...with legit top pairing upside. That alone is worth it's weight in gold. Kyrou is a league wide top 15-20 affiliated prospect coming off an OHL MVP season.

I fully understand ROR's value, but would want to good piece added onto the Buffalo side. Maybe a swap of picks, Blues 2019 3rd for sabres 2018 2nd? Not sure even that would be enough.


Berglund could be added in place of Sobotka. The issue is he has a modified NTC (I think 20 team no trade list?) which would make a deal a bit more difficult. Personally, I would have no issue adding him to the deal tho.

The Fabbri injury situation is pretty well documented. Prior to injury he was a lock to be our #2 LW behind Schwartz with an outside shot of transitioning to C eventually once he got comfortable playing in the NHL. Speedy player with 2 seperate ACL tears on the same knee later, it remains to be seen if he can return to form. FWIW I am pretty confident he can still be an impact player in the future, but it's obviously a risk.

Of the players you listed, Barbashev is the closest to NHL ready currently IMO. I'm not going to write out an elaborate sales pitch if you're simply not interested, but I think his floor is 3rd line LW/C, with a decent chance of #2 LW if he can find consistency and develop his offensive side. He is a very good skater, might not blow the doors off, but above average NHL speed/skating.

First line centers don't come cheap. I like Dunn a lot, but it's very hard to project what a young guy becomes. Right now he looks like a 2nd pairing guy with upside for more, but if he doesn't get there, what did Buffalo trade a guaranteed in his prime 1st line center for? A 2nd pairing d-man, a guy in Barbashev who tops out as a middle 6 winger, a vet placeholder in Sobotka, and a pick that's at best a coinflip to even make the NHL? That's awful. There needs to be at least one more high end asset in that deal to mitigate the risk for Buffalo or we can circle back to Parayko. If that doesn't interest STL I'm very happy to keep ROR.

 

[Dbrownss]

Blues wont be looking to move Dunn or Parayko. Doesn't make sense, as they dont have a replacement for either. Its a futures package Stl is looking to move. If ROR isnt available for that, then I doubt there's a deal to be made

 

[Gabrielor]

Blues wont be looking to move Dunn or Parayko. Doesn't make sense, as they dont have a replacement for either. Its a futures package Stl is looking to move. If ROR isnt available for that, then I doubt there's a deal to be made

There’s probably a futures deal available, but Thomas is in it.

 

[Dbrownss]

There’s probably a futures deal available, but Thomas is in it.

That's a negative on that. If these are the prices for ROR, he wont be on the Blues. Armstrong has been adamant about not moving his top prospects. I doubt all of them are untouchable, but Thomas isnt moving anywhere other then to Stl

 

[Colt55]

There’s probably a futures deal available, but Thomas is in it.

Your joking right,
Robert thomas is our best center prospect in decades. He is not forsale. He will be in NHL this year and will be be a Blues for a Long time. Thomas just isnt for sale.

 

[Colt55]

That's a negative on that. If these are the prices for ROR, he wont be on the Blues. Armstrong has been adamant about not moving his top prospects. I doubt all of them are untouchable, but Thomas isnt moving anywhere other then to Stl

Cant wait for prospects camp to start up here in a few weeks.

 

[Beerz]

Your joking right,
Robert thomas is our best center prospect in decades. He is not forsale. He will be in NHL this year and will be be a Blues for a Long time. Thomas just isnt for sale.

Nobody is for sale in St Louis.

Sounds like you don't want ROR ... so why are you in the thread?

 

[stl76]

First line centers don't come cheap. I like Dunn a lot, but it's very hard to project what a young guy becomes. Right now he looks like a 2nd pairing guy with upside for more, but if he doesn't get there, what did Buffalo trade a guaranteed in his prime 1st line center for? A 2nd pairing d-man, a guy in Barbashev who tops out as a middle 6 winger, a vet placeholder in Sobotka, and a pick that's at best a coinflip to even make the NHL? That's awful. There needs to be at least one more high end asset in that deal to mitigate the risk for Buffalo or we can circle back to Parayko. If that doesn't interest STL I'm very happy to keep ROR.

If I had a dollar for every time I've written something similar to "nobody expects a player like ROR to come cheap," I could retire tomorrow. Please spare me the "I'll just take my ball and go home if the deal isn't massively in my favor" bullshit. It's not constructive or conducive to a meaningful discussion.

Go look at what Duchene and Turris returned, there are recent comparable transactions with which it is possible to establish a market value for ROR. The package I proposed is similar in value to what Duchene returned (maybe slightly less), and without a doubt greater than what Turris returned. The contract situations MIGHT make ROR slightly more valuable (depending on if you think 7.5 is an overpay), but the Duchene trade was also widely seen as an overpay by Ottawa and Turris was immediately signed to a long contract. Nashville doesn't pay what they did for Turris without believing they can re-sign him long term.

So what would Buffalo return for a "guaranteed in his prime 1st line center?" Well, about the going market rate. 3 high quality young cost controlled pieces and a quality veteran signed for 2 more years at a position of need. Circle back to Parayko all you want, it isn't happening.

 

[Colt55]

Nobody is for sale in St Louis.

Sounds like you don't want ROR ... so why are you in the thread?

Your guy just asked for the OHL playoff MVP 1c best prospect blues have for ROR. Rated top #17 in march before is crazy break out during the playoffs.

Also Kyrou, Parayko, Dunn are off the table as well. They fill positions of need. I like ROR but not at these prices.

 

[stl76]

There’s probably a futures deal available, but Thomas is in it.

Did Kyle Turris or Matt Duchene return a prospect as good as Robert Thomas?

 

[Beerz]

Your guy just asked for the OHL playoff MVP 1c best prospect blues have for ROR. Rated top #17 in march before is crazy break out during the playoffs.

Also Kyrou, Parayko, Dunn are off the table as well. They fill positions of need. I like ROR but not at these prices.

You're asking for a proven 1C and don't want to give up any valuable assets... You're in a dream world kid.

 

[Gabrielor]

Your guy just asked for the OHL playoff MVP 1c best prospect blues have for ROR. Rated top #17 in march before is crazy break out during the playoffs.

Also Kyrou, Parayko, Dunn are off the table as well. They fill positions of need. I like ROR but not at these prices.

The futures question was asked, and I replied. I’m fine with keeping OReilly. This appears to be the 500th “I want to poach OReilly from the Sabres because they finished 31st” thread.

 

[haseoke39]

Your guy just asked for the OHL playoff MVP 1c best prospect blues have for ROR. Rated top #17 in march before is crazy break out during the playoffs.

Also Kyrou, Parayko, Dunn are off the table as well. They fill positions of need. I like ROR but not at these prices.

Then the blues don't need him. Every move for a core player is going to sacrifice something of need.

 

[Dbrownss]

Then the blues don't need him. Every move for a core player is going to sacrifice something of need.

Not necessarily, Blues got their 1c withou sacrificing a core asset

 

[Chubbinz]

Did Kyle Turris or Matt Duchene return a prospect as good as Robert Thomas?

Years of control matters and ROR has 5 remaining years. Neither of those two did.


Thomas is a completely reasonable ask.

 

[Dbrownss]

Years of control matters and ROR has 5 remaining years. Neither of those two did.


Thomas is a completely reasonable ask.

If Thomas was years off, maybe. He'll be in the NHL next year. I dont see him on the table for anyone who's rumored to be available

 

[haseoke39]

Not necessarily, Blues got their 1c withou sacrificing a core asset

I cant speak for the schenn deal, but either way, it sounds like there's nothing on the table that helps Buffalo more than just holding ROR. The untouchables list is too long. You'll go bid on Tavares or Thornton, seems like.

 

[TK 421]

That cost controlled 5 years of ROR is very valuable especially with the cap going up. He eats Dzone starts for breakfast, wins tons of draws and puts up very respectable #'s on a low scoring team despite his defense heavy usage. This is a very valuable player and I don't see why Botteril would have motivation to move him. I understand the ask being both high and restricted to things Buffalo actually needs and not the collection of futures that Doug Armstrong would be offering from the Blues. Too bad because he would be a great add here in STL, basically a younger, better Stastny.

 

[StreetHawk]

Not really a strong analogy considering Buffalo actually relies on ROR more than Eichel. No question Eichel is by far the superior offensive talent, but O'Reilly plays more and (much, much) harder minutes, and still produces offense to boot. Parayko doesn't play more than Pietrangelo, and he's certainly not tasked with playing tougher minutes than Pietro. ROR does, in fact, play 1C minutes, and he plays them well. Parayko has never played 1D minutes, and plenty of promising young defenseman who look like they have the ability to jump up to that role never do.

Kind of like henrik sedin and kesler back in the Canucks hay day. Kesler would get more ice time because he played in all situations, including 2 man advantages and PK.

For buffalo, if they add mittlestadt to their C rotation they have a strong 1-2 punch offensively. Keeping ROR at C basically means they run 3 C given the quality of heir top 3.

Value wise, it’s not a bad swap.

 

[stl76]

Years of control matters and ROR has 5 remaining years. Neither of those two did.


Thomas is a completely reasonable ask.

Turris was immediately signed to a 6 year extension, Nashville doesn't make that deal if they're not +90% sure they can secure years of team control. Turris is a lesser player than ROR, but he also cost quite a bit less than the futures package like I proposed.

Duchene trade was a rather large overpay. Comparable player in terms of what he brings on the ice IMO (better offensively than ROR but worse defensively...both great on the dot). Duchene still had basically 2 years left on his deal when he was traded tho, that's less than ROR'5, but still quite a bit of team control and I'm certain at the time Ottawa was planning to re-sign him.

Neither team acquiring Duchene/Turris gave up a prospect anywhere near Thomas in value. Girard was probably the best piece, and both Thomas and Dunn are worth more now than he was at the time IMO.