Oilers win 4-1

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

I'm just looking at it realistically, you think this would sit well with Taylor Hall?

I think it's a stupid idea just based on hockey reasons too. You can bet your ass a lot of Calgary and Vancouver fans will be pulling out champange if we ever dealt him.

It was the same thing with me when Vancouver dealt Hodgson, I was really relieved because I didn't want to deal with him for the next 10 years even though they "filled a need" in return.

That's what becoming a major issue with this organization going forward.People are becoming more concerned about keeping their friends close,and not focusing on trying to make this team more competitive.

 

[Soundwave]

That's what becoming a major issue with this organization going forward.People are becoming more concerned about keeping their friends close,and not focusing on trying to make this team more competitive.

Dumping Eberle to fill needs is not going to make the team more competitive in the long run.

It's fools gold, you will fill some needs, sure, then you'll realize you don't have enough talent to really do anything in the playoffs once you get there.

RNH/Hall/Yakupov are NOT so talented that they can just overwhelm teams on their own. The Oilers would about a middle of the pack franchise when it comes to talent.

Quite frankly RNH has under-produced far moreso than Eberle. Yakupov is nice but I wonder about his hockey IQ. Hall is prone to stretches where he has stone hands. A 1 line team centered basically around these three is not a lock for anything. None of these three guys is Crosby quality, I don't know if any three of them are even as good as Tavares (not a knock, just the truth).

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

I would need to be offered Lucic AND Hamilton.

Or Tavares.

Or Stamkos.

The asking price would be very ... verrrrry high.

Not dealing him based on some "needs" like third line freaking center and an ok d-man, no way in hell. If you can't get those types of pieces from Gagner, Hemsky, Paajarvi, Petry, EDM 1st 2013, then you're simply a bad GM.

It's just classic Oiler fan mentality, if you're not playing well you can be traded, but that's the epitome of making a decision based on emotion rather than logic. If he has 10 hot games again I would bet $1000 you would back off even the suggestion of a trade and never mention it again quietly.

Even if he were to have a rebound season, I'd still want to trade him.

 

[Soundwave]

Even if he were to have a rebound season, I'd still want to trade him.

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind a computer and have no skin in the game. When you're the actual GM and he goes on to possibly score 40 goals somewhere else, then you'd feel an awful lot of heat.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind a computer and have no skin in the game. When you're the actual GM and he goes on to possibly score 40 goals somewhere else, then you'd feel an awful lot of heat.

I know that why you trade him when his value is at its highest.I'm suggesting on trading him in a few years.



I'm just saying that he's the odd-man out as of today if we're going to fill our needs going forward.

 

[Soundwave]

I know that why you trade him when his value is at its highest.I'm suggesting on trading him in a few years.Currently,the Oilers are nowhere near ready to compete.

How do we even know this?

Did you predict the Islanders making the playoffs this year?

They could be in the playoffs a year from now fairly easily, who knows.

In terms of "needs" I don't see any that honestly couldn't be filled by trading Gagner, Paajarvi, Petry, EDM 1st 2013 first.

The core of Hall/Eberle/RNH/Yakupov/Schultz/Klefbom/Smid IMO doesn't need to be touched. What team has successfully built itself by giving away it's core/star pieces for supporting role players? Did LA give up Kopitar or Doughty or Brown to get either Carter or Richards?

Have the Islanders traded Strome, Hamilton, or even Nino to fill needs?

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

How do we even know this?

Did you predict the Islanders making the playoffs this year?

They could be in the playoffs a year from now fairly easily, who knows.

By looking at this roster?

 

[timekeep]

I would need to be offered Lucic AND Hamilton.

Or Tavares.

Or Stamkos.

The asking price would be very ... verrrrry high.

Not dealing him based on some "needs" like third line freaking center and an ok d-man, no way in hell. If you can't get those types of pieces from Gagner, Hemsky, Paajarvi, Petry, EDM 1st 2013, then you're simply a bad GM.

It's just classic Oiler fan mentality, if you're not playing well you can be traded, but that's the epitome of making a decision based on emotion rather than logic. If he has 10 hot games again I would bet $1000 you would back off even the suggestion of a trade and never mention it again quietly.

Your returns are little high for Eberle, maybe a trade could be started with the pieces from Boston. But common on you're not being serious asking for Tavares or Stamkos for Eberle. But you aren't far off from those guys. Nobody wants third liners for Eberle, get off of that argument already.

 

[Soundwave]

By looking at this roster?

They could have made the playoffs this year quite honestly if RNH didn't have the worst sophomore slump imaginable.

I don't see the point in needlessly tampering with the core group.

Once again, what big roster moves did the Islanders make? Nada. They just basically added Visnovsky for 20 games and left the rest of the core group the same.

Sometimes being patient helps. If they pick Monahan in the draft, then how many "holes" are really even left in the long term? You have basically your top six set for the next 10 years and you have trade bait in Gagner/MPS/future 1sts to dangle for defensive support. If you can't do anything as a GM with that, you're a freaking moron quite honestly (lets hope Mac T isn't). It's all there on a silver platter.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

They could have made the playoffs this year quite honestly if RNH didn't have the worst sophomore slump imaginable.

I don't see the point in needlessly tampering with the core group.

Once again, what big roster moves did the Islanders make? Nada. They just basically added Visnovsky for 20 games and left the rest of the core group the same.

Sometimes being patient helps. If they pick Monahan in the draft, then how many "holes" are really even left in the long term?

If we get Sean Monahan.

-A Top-six Power Forward
-3rd line centerman that can win faceoffs since Horcoff will be long gone when we're ready to compete
-A Bottom-six Power Forward
-A Top pairing Defenseman
-A Bottom-four shutdown Defenseman

 

[timekeep]

How do we even know this?

Did you predict the Islanders making the playoffs this year?

They could be in the playoffs a year from now fairly easily, who knows.

In terms of "needs" I don't see any that honestly couldn't be filled by trading Gagner, Paajarvi, Petry, EDM 1st 2013 first.

The core of Hall/Eberle/RNH/Yakupov/Schultz/Klefbom/Smid IMO doesn't need to be touched. What team has successfully built itself by giving away it's core/star pieces for supporting role players? Did LA give up Kopitar or Doughty or Brown to get either Carter or Richards?

Have the Islanders traded Strome, Hamilton, or even Nino to fill needs?

Kings gave up Schenn and Simmonds + for Richards and J. Johnson for Carter. They had lots of assets through good drafting too and made the upgrades. But as I'm sure you will agree that there was some value given up for those two.

Regarding the Isles, that is probably going to be their next step, though do have some higher picks on d.

 

[Soundwave]

If we get Sean Monahan.I see 3 holes


-A Top-six Power Forward
-3rd line centerman that can win faceoffs since Horcoff will be long gone when we're ready to compete
-A Bottom-six Power Forward
-A Top pairing Defenseman
-A Bottom-four shutdown Defenseman

Power Forward - Most teams really don't have this player. I've heard Taylor Hall described as such, same with Monahan.

3rd Line Centerman - This is on the GM to find this piece, but Monahan from what I've read basically does all the things people want from this player (automatic in the dot, big, 2-way center).

Top Pairing D - Schultz, Klefbom, Smid, Petry. You still have Gagner to dangle for another top 4 d-man at some point in the long run.

Bottom 4 D-Man - Again, a position the GM should be able to find on their own.

Smart teams do not gift away their top end talent to fill these kinds of needs when they have other disposal parts.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

It wasn't that long ago that Don Cherry said that teams are not scared to play us.

 

[Soundwave]

Kings gave up Schenn and Simmonds + for Richards and J. Johnson for Carter. They had lots of assets through good drafting too and made the upgrades. But as I'm sure you will agree that there was some value given up for those two.

Regarding the Isles, that is probably going to be their next step, though do have some higher picks on d.

I think the Islanders are smart, they didn't panic and throw away players like Strome and Hamilton for silly short term moves, so now long term, they really don't need to add a lot.

They have a lot of the pieces that will come on board in the future just by virtue of drafting and actually hanging onto those picks.

I bet they had a lot of "WE GOTTA TRADE STROME!!! TAVARES NEEDS HAAAAELP NAOW!" the last couple of years.

 

[Soundwave]

It wasn't that long ago that Don Cherry said that teams are not scared to play us.

Yeah he suggested we find 3rd/4th line goons/ruffians like the Leafs have.

Again, has nothing to do with Eberle, if you're trading Eberle to get pieces like that, you are incompetent as a GM. Plain and simple.

 

[Replacement*]

I've got to be honest... I find your view on Eberle, after years of your defense of Gagner a little bit... confusing.

Gagner has perennially been an abysmal defensive hockey player. Soft, one dimensional and one of the most consistently inconsistent players we have had. But you defend him to a fault. Jordan Eberle on the other hand is a one trick pony who will never be complete?

Eberle's season last year was by a large margin significantly better than anything Gagner has ever done in his career. And even this season, where Eberle is having an off year and Gagner is having a career year, Eberle is only 4 points behind him and when you look at advanced statistics has been a better 5v5 hockey player. Yes he has played with better linemates, but he has also been matched up against much tougher opposition.

You are blind to a player here. I'm not sure if it is Eberle or Gagner. Likely a bit of both.

Gagner has ALWAYS been willing to improve his game and looking for every way to be a better player. I simply don't see that in Eberle. Frankly I was disgusted in Eberles one dimensional play down on the farm and now here. Were it not for playing with Hall and RNH Eberle would be getting eaten alive. Easiest player to play against in this topsix.
Gagners getting better and growing aspects of his game, assignments on pk and is versatile and does whatever is asked. Eberle, on the contrary, is heard to complain that "it sucks that I'm not playing on the top line" Maybe I'm reading in too much but I'm starting to have major concerns with Eberles sense of team concept.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

Yeah he suggested we find 3rd/4th line goons/ruffians like the Leafs have.

Again, has nothing to do with Eberle, if you're trading Eberle to get pieces like that, you are incompetent as a GM. Plain and simple.

Ok,well,I'm not suggesting that,so lets get that out of the way.

 

[timekeep]

I think the Islanders are smart, they didn't panic and throw away players like Strome and Hamilton for silly short term moves, so now long term, they really don't need to add a lot.

They have a lot of the pieces that will come on board in the future just by virtue of drafting and actually hanging onto those picks.

I bet they had a lot of "WE GOTTA TRADE STROME!!! TAVARES NEEDS HAAAAELP NAOW!" the last couple of years.

Well, there is no way that they would half the return that Eberle would get so it is not a fair comparison. Viz has been huge for them and so has Nabakov. They have changed the attitude and culture there too.

 

[Soundwave]

Well, there is no way that they would half the return that Eberle would get so it is not a fair comparison. Viz has been huge for them and so has Nabakov. They have changed the attitude and culture there too.

I always laugh at these types of comments. They changed what exactly? They have 95% of the exact same roster.

They're just winning games. Plain and simple.

And most of that IMO comes from the fact that they were patient with their group and now Tavares is taken that next step in his game.

We are a year behind them in the development curve as we drafted Hall the year afterwards. It's certainly not out of the question we take a similar step next year with a few tweaks (as in minor ones).

 

[Replacement*]

Going to the CJ show tonight, hope it's good.

Margo was in top form after having a serious cold earlier in the tour that was giving her some problems singing. But last night was spot on, she hit all the notes and then some. Band gave a very spirited musical performance and really got into material.

First set was from the Nomad series, second set was the older more familiar catalog. But not to get the wrong idea, they're newer stuff is quite good, just not in vogue, but very good. You'll find yourself buying the newer stuff which is really a large point in touring today. These guys deserve to get more present recognition. Consummate musicians.

 

[Replacement*]

The way some of you are throwing him under the bus this season is even more disgusting, shameful even. Where were all you geniuses last season when Eberle was doing great? Probably busy praising him like just about every other Oiler fan.

I lost respect for Eberle when he started *****ing about not being on the first line. Its a team sport. High time he learned that. That was classless saying it sucks to be on another line. If that was my team mate he'd be hearing about that one.

 

[Soundwave]

I lost respect for Eberle when he started *****ing about not being on the first line. Its a team sport. High time he learned that. That was classless saying it sucks to be on another line. If that was my team mate he'd be hearing about that one.

All the Oiler kids are good kids, the comment wasn't nearly as bad as you're making it out to be. The kid has said nothing but all the right things in 3 years here and you're picking up on one mild comment.

Attitude isn't the problem, they're kids playing against grown men without much in the way of sheltering and there's going to be growing pains and frustration now and again.

That's all there is to it.

 

[CupofOil]

Last season, we didn't expect to have a first overall pick and draft Yakupov, another RW, and most likely a better RW than Eberle will be. I was expecting a Dman getting drafted and the need for Eberle would be much greater than now. But when you draft BPA rather than for need, you have eventually trade someone to address the needs. Eberle, we all like him, is going to get the best return other than the #1s.

Allot of people are thinking emotionally rather than logically.

Who replaces Eberle on RW?
This team isn't in a position to fill a massive hole by creating a massive hole. Trading Eberle weakens the top 6 considerably. This is a player who has succeeded at a very high level at every level and has that special ability to show up in the big moments, that's an inherent special ability that he has plus he loves playing here so no, i'm not thinking emotionally, i'm thinking rationally.

I'm frustrated by the trade Eberle talk because this fanbase is so incredibly reactionary to any slump by young players. There's even some trade RNH talk starting up, it's beyond ridiculous.
Everybody seems to think that Eberle has maxed out already (some Gagner fans think that too which i find incredibly hypocritical).
Dealing him simply because he's slumping and has some value is ridiculous.
He's a part of the core that is still in its infancy stage, they are all growing together and are just starting to develop on and off ice chemistry with each other, that's very valuable for a young team.

I also don't get how the new shiny toy Yakupov makes Eberle expendable. That's like saying that RNH made Gagner expendable after his rookie season. Yakupov hasn't proven nearly enough to have all this pressure placed on him so early in his career.

My point is that you build around players like Hall, RNH, Eberle, Yakupov and Schultz, not deal them.
Sure, if a team offers a legit #1D for Eberle who is signed long term then you probably have to make that deal but that's not realistic so any deal of Eberle is a losing deal.

A top 6 of The big 4, a 2 way center and a big, physical winger is plenty good enough to compete for Cups. If you take Eberle out of that equation, i'm not so sure. He's not easily replacable.

 

[Soundwave]

Who replaces Eberle on RW?
This team isn't in a position to fill a massive hole by creating a massive hole. Trading Eberle weakens the top 6 considerably. This is a player who has succeeded at a very high level at every level and has that special ability to show up in the big moments, that's an inherent special ability that he has plus he loves playing here so no, i'm not thinking emotionally, i'm thinking rationally.

I'm frustrated by the trade Eberle talk because this fanbase is so incredibly reactionary to any slump by young players. There's even some trade RNH talk starting up, it's beyond ridiculous.
Everybody seems to think that Eberle has maxed out already (some Gagner fans think that too which i find incredibly hypocritical).
Dealing him simply because he's slumping and has some value is ridiculous.
He's a part of the core that is still in its infancy stage, they are all growing together and are just starting to develop on and off ice chemistry with each other, that's very valuable for a young team.

I also don't get how the new shiny toy Yakupov makes Eberle expendable. That's like saying that RNH made Gagner expendable after his rookie season. Yakupov hasn't proven nearly enough to have all this pressure placed on him so early in his career.

My point is that you build around players like Hall, RNH, Eberle, Yakupov and Schultz, not deal them.
A top 6 of The big 4, a 2 way center and a big, physical winger is plenty good enough to compete for Cups. If you take Eberle out of that equation, i'm not so sure. He's not easily replacable.

Pretty much. I remember a year ago when people were saying Hall is the most expendable of our core group and RNH is more valuable than Malkin. The Hall contract was overpayment, but the Eberle one was a steal, lol.

It's definitely a "what have you done for me lately?" fan base (at least parts of it, for sure).

 

[Replacement*]

All the Oiler kids are good kids, the comment wasn't nearly as bad as you're making it out to be. The kid has said nothing but all the right things in 3 years here and you're picking up on one mild comment.

Attitude isn't the problem, they're kids playing against grown men without much in the way of sheltering and there's going to be growing pains.

That's all there is to it.

After several of his performances in OKC and here this year I'm questioning his attitude. Eberle isn't matching production this year because he's not always paying the price. Theres been a lot of games this year where he's done very little.

I admire the tenacity of Hall, Yak, Gagner, and RNH(in allzone play)

In contrast Eberle picks his spots, is only remotely interested in one zone play, and as long as thats what he's content with its a problem.