OT: Oilers season seat breakfast/luncheon

[Cizin]

And next GM as well, just in a disguise.

He's going to come to finish the job.

Hello, my name is Mr. Illeraihc, and I come, er... from someplace far away! Yes, that'll do.

 

[harpoon]

I know who we need to call

Had to google that one, but yeah, we could use that guy.

I can't tell if the baloney comment is real or not.

The part about Oilers serving it to the long suffering, or the part about it tasting good?

 

[Yablo21]

I honestly wonder if Katz would just stubbornly start turning the team into a budget cap hit team if this happened. Or, if he would finally stop running the team like a treehouse club. He must know by now that he's made a mistake handing the team over to a bunch of buffoons. But a financial penalty for doing it just hasn't been there to force him to do anything about it yet.

All the fans want is for this team to not suck. Katz has been ensuring it does by letting idiots run it for over a decade. Who is really at fault if the fans stop paying and why would it be an insane idea for Katz to finally care about making the team good to earn the fans back?

His fragile ego needs his only friends around, he will never fire them. He has no one else. Hell he tried to pay and actress 1 million dollars to sleep with him and she flat out refused and metaphorically slapped him in the face by going to the media. All the talk about fan experience and the new arena is worse then Rexall was, I was never more uncomfortable in Rexall then I am at Rogers.

 

[yukoner88]

They politely asked me to not come back to one of these after I was giving them the business for trading Smythy. I don’t care as they had friggun fried baloney as one of the buffet items. Don’t get me wrong fried baloney is good but have some class when you’re feeding your season ticket holders!

Please don't ever change

 

[Drivesaitl]

Please don't ever change

I like the posts as well. We need someone posting as "Mike From Canmore" more..

"Bert from the Fort" Would be another one.

or "Lark, from the Park" for those inclined.

So many possibilities.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

All the talk about fan experience and the new arena is worse then Rexall was, I was never more uncomfortable in Rexall then I am at Rogers.

You can’t be serious.

 

[Drivesaitl]

His fragile ego needs his only friends around, he will never fire them. He has no one else. Hell he tried to pay and actress 1 million dollars to sleep with him and she flat out refused and metaphorically slapped him in the face by going to the media. All the talk about fan experience and the new arena is worse then Rexall was, I was never more uncomfortable in Rexall then I am at Rogers.

I'll always prefer Rexall to Rogers. Just like I would prefer Maple Leaf Gardens to the current ACC atrocity or any of the older rinks with history and some atmosphere to what they have now.

Rexall was simple as pie. 19min drive, park for free at Borden park, short walk, see a game. Now its massive parking fees downtown, the slow drive getting there, and to an arena where the wait lines are 15mins just to get in after detouring all over a DT in constant construction.

Used to be easy to go to an event, now nothing but aggravation and the 2nd tier at Rogers completely sucks. I can see those in first tier liking the new arena but 2nd Tier? forget it. At Rexall when somebody spills a drink or food it lands right on their aisle no problem. Now when that happens it lands on everybody in front because the rows are almost on top of each other. Whoever approves of this kind of incline for a public facility is nuts. Lots of older people or those with limited mobility uncomfortable going up and down those stairs. The worst thing is with the new design you could be in the first row of the upper deck, and that would be assumed to be easy to get to, but its the hardest area in the arena to get to because you first have to go up all the way to the top, and then down. Whoever designed this crap?

 

[Yablo21]

You can’t be serious.

I am serious, everywhere but club seating is far more crammed. Upper bowl is flat out awful.

 

[FlyingPhi]

I wonder what they are going to say to STH about the competing markets for tickets. The secondary market has tanked...again. And the Oilers have been flooding the market with cheap tickets since Cyber Monday back in November. I think that if they want to retain STH they would be wise to give some of that via payback. If the seats you hold are being discounted 40% for others the Oilers should be giving:

a) a similar discount to be applied on STH for the following season
b) a boosted value if instead of discount STH takes Oilers bucks
c) a smaller discount applicable now

That I think might be the biggest hot topic issue.

This is an interesting post. Thanks, Mike.

I've been a season seat holder for seventeen years. Now that I live out of the country, I renew my seats and sell them (or give them to buddies or to the Seats for Kids program). My seats are nothing fancy, they are in the Upper Bowl.

The first 10-15 home games of every year sell for more than what I pay for them as a STH. The years in which they have been out of it in December, their open-market value obviously drops significantly as demand goes down. This is a great opportunity for me to give them to friends and to the Seats for Kids program, or sell them for what I paid or at a loss. The tax receipts are of no value to me since I don't live in Canada anymore. It's just nice to give a kid (and their parent/chaperone/charitable representative) a chance to have that experience. As much as us "diehard fans" may moan and groan about Management, the OBC, and the on-ice product, these kids just love being there.

Even when they are out of it, and the value goes down, big-ticket games against the Habs and Leafs, or games on Saturday night, still sell for a really good price. You can see it, even now, on the exchange: seats 3 and 4, row 3, section 231, on Saturday the 23rd, the asking price is 62.5% more than the same seats on Thursday the 21st (the asking price for Saturday's game will go up or down closer to the game, based on how many games are won and lost up to that point)

In the years that they have been in a playoff position, or in a "stretch drive", all of the tickets have sold for well more than what I paid. The playoff tickets have sold for significantly more than what I pay for them (although I did come back for the last playoffs).

The "discount" or price that the owner is willing to sell them on the registry or Kijiji is up to the owner of the seat. As a season seat holder, I agree to pay for the seats at the price they are. I can choose not to renew the seats or try to get cheaper seats. It is my choice. I know that sometimes I will lose money on the seats and give some away, or if they make the playoffs or are having a good season, that I can make money with this investment. Even if I lose money, it can be rewarding knowing that I sent families to games that they would not have been able to go to without the donation.

If the Oilers offered "a similar discount to be applied on STH for the following season", by the same logic, they should be able to charge that STH more the year after if the value of the tickets in secondary-markets increased next season. Would you be okay with that?

Bottom line is, as a STH, you are buying the tickets for what they are priced at. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of a quality on-ice product or a competent management team. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of a healthy McDavid. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of being able to sell them for more than what you paid for them, or even feel like it was worth the price you paid.

I would love to see the Oilers give more Oiler Bucks out to STH because of a disappointing season, but I am not expecting that, nor do I think I am entitled to it. I think "Buyer Beware" applies to luxury products like these: sometimes you are satisfied, sometimes you are not. The choice remains yours. I do not feel like I was swindled out of my money as a STH. I have a choice each year to renew at the price tag I'm offered, knowing full well that it can be a bad year on-ice, and in the wallet.

Sorry for the rambling, but that's my two cents, Mike.

As for the STH events: I have attended one in the past. It's just a gesture they make to STH. They have to do it, regardless of how the year went, it is just what's done. I don't get much value out of it, as "rubbing elbows" with Oilers Exec's and players is not that valuable to me, but it can be a neat experience for others. I encourage everyone who has the opportunity to find out for themselves.

 

[Jet Walters]

The OBC's bacon has been saved for years by Katz. I would steer clear for fear of food poisoning. Plus the water issue.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I am serious, everywhere but club seating is far more crammed. Upper bowl is flat out awful.

IIRC the Rogers seats are all larger by 1-2” with some 4” wider. The upper deck has a steep pitch but that is the way rinks are designed now having been in 15 other NHL rinks. You want crammed? Go to the new arena in Detroit.

 

[oilersrule14]

This is an interesting post. Thanks, Mike.

I've been a season seat holder for seventeen years. Now that I live out of the country, I renew my seats and sell them (or give them to buddies or to the Seats for Kids program). My seats are nothing fancy, they are in the Upper Bowl.

The first 10-15 home games of every year sell for more than what I pay for them as a STH. The years in which they have been out of it in December, their open-market value obviously drops significantly as demand goes down. This is a great opportunity for me to give them to friends and to the Seats for Kids program, or sell them for what I paid or at a loss. The tax receipts are of no value to me since I don't live in Canada anymore. It's just nice to give a kid (and their parent/chaperone/charitable representative) a chance to have that experience. As much as us "diehard fans" may moan and groan about Management, the OBC, and the on-ice product, these kids just love being there.

Even when they are out of it, and the value goes down, big-ticket games against the Habs and Leafs, or games on Saturday night, still sell for a really good price. You can see it, even now, on the exchange: seats 3 and 4, row 3, section 231, on Saturday the 23rd, the asking price is 62.5% more than the same seats on Thursday the 21st (the asking price for Saturday's game will go up or down closer to the game, based on how many games are won and lost up to that point)

In the years that they have been in a playoff position, or in a "stretch drive", all of the tickets have sold for well more than what I paid. The playoff tickets have sold for significantly more than what I pay for them (although I did come back for the last playoffs).

The "discount" or price that the owner is willing to sell them on the registry or Kijiji is up to the owner of the seat. As a season seat holder, I agree to pay for the seats at the price they are. I can choose not to renew the seats or try to get cheaper seats. It is my choice. I know that sometimes I will lose money on the seats and give some away, or if they make the playoffs or are having a good season, that I can make money with this investment. Even if I lose money, it can be rewarding knowing that I sent families to games that they would not have been able to go to without the donation.

If the Oilers offered "a similar discount to be applied on STH for the following season", by the same logic, they should be able to charge that STH more the year after if the value of the tickets in secondary-markets increased next season. Would you be okay with that?

Bottom line is, as a STH, you are buying the tickets for what they are priced at. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of a quality on-ice product or a competent management team. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of a healthy McDavid. You are not buying tickets with a guarantee of being able to sell them for more than what you paid for them, or even feel like it was worth the price you paid.

I would love to see the Oilers give more Oiler Bucks out to STH because of a disappointing season, but I am not expecting that, nor do I think I am entitled to it. I think "Buyer Beware" applies to luxury products like these: sometimes you are satisfied, sometimes you are not. The choice remains yours. I do not feel like I was swindled out of my money as a STH. I have a choice each year to renew at the price tag I'm offered, knowing full well that it can be a bad year on-ice, and in the wallet.

Sorry for the rambling, but that's my two cents, Mike.

As for the STH events: I have attended one in the past. It's just a gesture they make to STH. They have to do it, regardless of how the year went, it is just what's done. I don't get much value out of it, as "rubbing elbows" with Oilers Exec's and players is not that valuable to me, but it can be a neat experience for others. I encourage everyone who has the opportunity to find out for themselves.

These are good points, I don’t think anyone would be okay if STH prices went up and down with the secondary market, might be beneficial this year but maybe not in others. What do you think of the Oilers themselves selling single game tickets for less than STH pricing though? It’s one thing for the secondary market to be priced less, the team doesn’t control that, but when the Oilers start using dynamic pricing and/or promotional pricing to sell single game tickets at prices less than what they sold for STH, how about that? IMO, I agree with you there’s no guarantee on the performance of the team, or what you can sell on the secondary market, but I do purchase STH with an understanding that I am getting a discount on pricing compared to what the team themselves would sell a single game ticket for. When that doesn’t happen, I think STH should be very upset.

 

[CanmoreMike]

Thanks for the thorough response. It was genuinely appreciated. Here are a few of my reflections:

If the Oilers offered "a similar discount to be applied on STH for the following season", by the same logic, they should be able to charge that STH more the year after if the value of the tickets in secondary-markets increased next season. Would you be okay with that?

Keep in mind, I may not have been crystal clear, but I was referencing theOilers and their cyber Monday discounts. I believe if they are giving those out and people are buying individual tickets the Oilers should be compensating STH who have paid in full and bought those tickets at higher prices. This is less a moral argument and more of a smart business decision. Disregard your STH and suddenly you are trying to find 18500 people to fill the arena every night as opposed to a couple of thousand.

As well you discuss about choice and people feeling swindled (I'm useless, can't get multiquote to work) and I don't feel swindled. But I can see how many might be. Mark Cuban discussed Stubhub years ago and warned sports owners need to be wary that people might grow frustrated knowing they spent $50 on a ticket 41 times while the guy sitting next to him may have only spent $6 on a ticket. The Oilers haven't rewarded their STH with a winning product and with shifting demographics they may find that steep cliff is fast approaching. So if they can't guarantee a successful season more than once every 13 years they need to do something else to retain everyone here.

It'll be harder to bring people back into the fold at the prices they've grown accustomed than it'll be to retain them.

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Its official. The 2nd tier toilet bowl at Rogers sucks;

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Is anyone going to any events? Would love to hear what went on. I would go but I’m out of country.

 

[BlackDogg]

Nivek Ewol will be the real motivational speaker. And talk a little about what it's like to win for those who don't know.

 

[FlyingPhi]

Thanks for the thorough response. It was genuinely appreciated. Here are a few of my reflections:



Keep in mind, I may not have been crystal clear, but I was referencing theOilers and their cyber Monday discounts. I believe if they are giving those out and people are buying individual tickets the Oilers should be compensating STH who have paid in full and bought those tickets at higher prices. This is less a moral argument and more of a smart business decision. Disregard your STH and suddenly you are trying to find 18500 people to fill the arena every night as opposed to a couple of thousand.

As well you discuss about choice and people feeling swindled (I'm useless, can't get multiquote to work) and I don't feel swindled. But I can see how many might be. Mark Cuban discussed Stubhub years ago and warned sports owners need to be wary that people might grow frustrated knowing they spent $50 on a ticket 41 times while the guy sitting next to him may have only spent $6 on a ticket. The Oilers haven't rewarded their STH with a winning product and with shifting demographics they may find that steep cliff is fast approaching. So if they can't guarantee a successful season more than once every 13 years they need to do something else to retain everyone here.

It'll be harder to bring people back into the fold at the prices they've grown accustomed than it'll be to retain them.

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

Hey Mike,

Yeah, I definitely understand the frustration felt by some when the Oilers org sells individual game tickets at a price lower than the per game cost to season ticket holders.

They do that to ensure sellouts and maximize revenue under the guise of offering a break on prices and maximize revenue. They aren't just making revenue on the seats themselves, but every dollar spent by that person while they are in the arena.

Furthermore, they are doing what all season ticket holders are doing: selling the seat at a discount to get whatever revenue they can. What they don't do is increase regualr season individual game ticket prices based on demand, like season ticket holders do.

The point remains: season ticket holders have a choice to buy their seats at the price they are offered and are guaranteed their seat at a fixed price per game. And frankly, it's still working great.

Unlike some other organisations, where ticket sales and in-venue purchases are a significant portion of team revenue, the Oilers ownership makes their money from real estate developments, facility rentals, etc. A group of 1000 individual season seat owners deciding not to renew will not impact the bottom line as those seats will be bought up by other individuals and corporations, and they just don't represent a big enough part of the pie to justify a discount across the board on season ticket prices. Dropping prices (across the board, not in special limited time sales) on any product devalues the product, and that's a dangerous thing to do in a market with such drastic demand fluctuation potential.

I agree that there are year by year shifts in the size of the group of individuals that can buy season seats. Alberta has an up and down resource-based economy, sure, but there still exists a large enough market to keep raising prices each year at the rate they are.

Your Mark Cuban example is great, but we haven't seen that type of disparity in this market yet, not really close. If it ever reaches that point then there will be changes if it makes sense. The Oilers are running their business very well and growing revenues every year. That has nothing to do with the hockey itself.

Thanks for the reply. Who knew you could have a decent and respectful conversation on HF.

 

[samiam]

Wondering if anybody here went to either of today's events AM or PM?
How did it go, & anything to share?

 

[Del Preston]

Wondering if anybody here went to either of today's events AM or PM?
How did it go, & anything to share?

Heather Marginet (@margih99) | Twitter

- Some thoughts from the season seat holders meetings - the Oilers cited a Change of economic conditions in talking about the season ticket holder packages. Translation tickets are probably going to be lower (especially upper bowl)

- I did ask my question about analytics. The Oilers will expand it more, in and including all aspects including player acquisition but still a tool - eyes will continue to be main scouting tool but They do use tracking and corsi now.

- I’ve been going to these for over 20 years and this was the most open and honest they’ve been including Nicholson talking to people in the audience and asking ? after

- This is The 1st Time I remember them going significantly over time to answer all questions

- General Manager search. His beginning list had 36 people on it - now down to 12-13 people. Gretzky is part of that list.

- He will not rush his decision and advised that he hasn’t interviewed anyone yet and is open to adding to the list as people become available.

- Ken Hitchcock has committed to only coaching this year and it will be up to the new GM to name his coaches. Hitchcock will be part of the organization going forward. (He didn’t spell it out but it was obvious he probably will not be head coach)

- He is being very thorough. He said he made a mistake with Chiarelli and won’t make that mistake twice

- Do not have expect Bouchard to start the year here - he said a major shift of this organization will be to and I quote “over percolate players in the AHL”. He said it was a mistake to have Bear and Yamamoto on the NHL roster

- His off-season priorities are to change the wingers and to build around McDavid, Draisaitl and Hopkins. He said that that procurement has been a weakness.

- He is open to adding a real number 1 dman but thinks defence is the strength in the organization. He would be willing to package assets but I didn’t get the impression that was likely

- As for the uniform. They will stay orange. Something I learned is you can only change the main uniform once every 3 years (there are some exceptions). They are looking at a different 3rd jersey.

- Old boys club roles. Kevin Lowe is an ambassador in a business sense. Very valuable but hasn’t been involved in the hockey decisions since Bob Nicholson hired.

- Craig Mctavish - is involved in hockey decisions but main responsibility is to oversee the Condors.

- Wayne Gretzky. Didn’t really define his role but he sometimes travels with the team. Has been to Edmonton twice

- Mentioned Hendricks and how important he was in the dressing room. Mentions Gagner in the same breath. He has been instrumental in the leadership in the dressing room since the 1st day he arrived. Players really respect him

- Also mentioned Lucic and how he has been somewhat subdued in the leadership because he hasn’t had the success he was hoping for. He has changed recently and been more comfortable in that role

- I didn’t really buy all of the next portion but 7 teams other than the Oilers were in on Lucic that offered more. (I don’t remember all mentioned) Vancouver, Minnesota, were 2 for sure

 

[harpoon]

36 candidates on a list slimmed down to 12 - without doing any interviews.
Wonder how many people told Nicholson to scratch their names off his stupid list immediately.
I have zero confidence in Nicholson being the guy to hire next GM.

Does this indicate that MacT's job is safe because the Condors are over performing?
That's going to make some people's heads explode.

Hitch is going to slide into a nice comfy chair in the job for life club. We all knew that.

 

[foshizzle]

Using Nuge as one the players to build around is already a fail in my eyes. Eye test being the main source of scouting is also a fail. Analytics and eye test need to be used in conjunction with each other. The numbers should support what the eyes see. Using Corsi? Holy outdated metric Batman

 

[TheRebuild]

- General Manager search. His beginning list had 36 people on it - now down to 12-13 people. Gretzky is part of that list.

Gretzky makes up candidates 1-12, with MacT making up candidate 13.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Going from 36 candidates down to 10-12 without interviews is probably pretty easy. They have 36 maybes and when you look at the guys careers or histories it's easy to knock them down.

It's like any hiring. You have a pool of candidates you are interested in but you trim them down to the ones you actually interview.

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

He pretty much said all the right things imo.

 

[CycloneSweep]

He pretty much said all the right things imo.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until he messes up again or goes back on what was said.