[Official] Fire/Tolerate Travis Green Thread

[pgj98m3]

Hmmm...



That was two years ago.

And nothing has really changed in terms of depth.

 

[I am toxic]

If I never heard Mike Gillis' name ever again I wouldn't be upset.

But Nonis!



Picking BPA is hard!

 

[Jay Cee]

So you won't be watching when Seattle lifts the Cup before us?

before you write his name on the cup as the eventual Stanley Cup champion, how about we see if he will ever be their GM in the first place.

 

[Fire Benning]

Green may be bad but Benning is infinitely worse at this job and the heat should exclusively be put on him before Green. The Goldobin situation would be nonexistent if we had an actual quality team with quality pieces, if that were the case he'd already be in Russia, but they don't so he's been the best option for the minutes they've been giving him this season.

You can definitely critique some of the stuff he's done, but at the end of the day he's only allowed to work with what he has, the buck stops with the person who's in charge of signing and acquiring the players.

 

[pgj98m3]

before you write his name on the cup as the eventual Stanley Cup champion, how about we see if he will ever be their GM in the first place.

Wanna bet....LOL

 

[strattonius]

People just want to clean house..theres really no reason to fire Green. If we agree the roster is complete dog crap created by Jim Benning i dont understand why Green wouldnt have a longer leash. There is literally no coach that gets a result from this roster.

People blame Green for how lousy of a player Goldobin is. It's hilarious listening to people clamor how mishandled poor little Goldobin has been.

 

[timw33]

The Goldobin situation would be nonexistent

This is especially true because we shouldn't have traded for him in the first place. We should have taken a full-on picks only package.

 

[vancityluongo]

This is especially true because we shouldn't have traded for him in the first place. We should have taken a full-on picks only package.

Or even if they Benning could negotiate a better condition than the insane jump between a conditional 1st based on SJ making the FINALS which was otherwise a 4th.

Make that a non-conditional 3rd that becomes a 1st if they make the conference finals (they didn't) or a non-conditional 2nd that become an additional 1st/2nd if they win the Cup. Either of those would've been reasonable.

 

[timw33]

Or even if they Benning could negotiate a better condition than the insane jump between a conditional 1st based on SJ making the FINALS which was otherwise a 4th.

Make that a non-conditional 3rd that becomes a 1st if they make the conference finals (they didn't) or a non-conditional 2nd that become an additional 1st/2nd if they win the Cup. Either of those would've been reasonable.

Really felt like they just didn't get enough teams in the bidding process, got locked into San Jose (who had very few 1st-3rd picks over the next 2 drafts) and got a weak deal. We can see exactly why they sold relatively high on Goldobin.

The condition is honestly one of the funniest things that almost panned out and helped Benning continue to fail upward. If you're a contending team and a team asks for that condition, sure, absolutely, you can have our 30th (now 31st) overall pick if we win a championship, what a great trade off. Some team offers us a conditional 2nd that can be a late first if the team wins a couple series, you take that deal all day. I just love how low the floor was set with that 4th.

 

[jcfate]

Pettersson has not scored a 5-on-5 goal since 1/20 against Detroit. That's more than 2 months (26 games).

Can Green finally end his silly Leivo-Pettersson-Boeser experiment?

Surrounding Pettersson with two poor-skating shooter with limited play making ability has totally killed Pettersson's even strength scoring.

Green's insistence on keeping this line in tact despite horrible on-ice results really shows that he is a Willie Desjardins level coach that relies on his personal bias rather than objective analysis for making coaching decisions.

 

[Jyrki21]

Here’s something we can agree on. Tanti could score.

Definitely in the top 25 NHLers of Maltese descent. Maybe even top 20.

 

[VanJack]

If Jimbo were to walk the plank, Green wouldn't be long for the NHL coaching ranks in VanCity. A new guy is going to want to hire his own coach. I actually like Green, who if nothing else, has proven to be a steady hand on the tiller in developing younger players.

But there's no denying the Canucks dismal two-year record under his watch. And somebody new in charge up in the executive booth will want to clean house. That's just the reality of an NHL team spinning its wheels in lottery land, year after year.

 

[WestCoast CyberG]

Surrounding Pettersson with two poor-skating shooter with limited play making ability has totally killed Pettersson's even strength scoring.

Just to add to this, the first half of the season saw a different offence zone entry than we have seen recently in the past 6 weeks or so....maybe it is just me and possibly tighter defence on EP but he used to glide through the neutral and setup a play which usually involved circling back and using the wingers to setup offensive pressure.

Now we see him pass off well before O-zone entry relying on the D to carry the puck while he waits for wingers to catch up. It is painful to watch. and if this is Green's style is sucks.

Goldie was a far better fit with EP, but somehow our coach thinks he is not good enough and plays...Tim Schaller instead?

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Green is bad, but Benning is absolutely horrible.

 

[Fatass]

Green is bad, but Benning is absolutely horrible.

How excited would we all be if Aquilini spent some big bucks and got us coach Quenville and GM/President Yzerman?

 

[Canucks1096]

People just want to clean house..theres really no reason to fire Green. If we agree the roster is complete dog crap created by Jim Benning i dont understand why Green wouldnt have a longer leash. There is literally no coach that gets a result from this roster.

People blame Green for how lousy of a player Goldobin is. It's hilarious listening to people clamor how mishandled poor little Goldobin has been.

Green had Gudbranson on the 2nd pairing for the first half of the season. His -27 and about 40% Corsi. Stecher plus/minus is still around the same playing in the top 4. His Corsi about 51% is still about the same and his plus/minus 12 is around the same as well.

Question I have for you.

If Stecher played in the top 4 for the whole season and not Gudbranson.

Do Canucks still have the same amount of points?

A coach can't make a grinder score 25 goals but with the right coaching move it can make a 6 to 8 point difference in the Standings.

 

[Zippgunn]

Green may be bad but Benning is infinitely worse at this job and the heat should exclusively be put on him before Green. The Goldobin situation would be nonexistent if we had an actual quality team with quality pieces, if that were the case he'd already be in Russia, but they don't so he's been the best option for the minutes they've been giving him this season.

You can definitely critique some of the stuff he's done, but at the end of the day he's only allowed to work with what he has, the buck stops with the person who's in charge of signing and acquiring the players.

I find this is pretty typical of what many on HF think of Green which puzzles me. Torts had this team for one season under JB and was a game over .500; he is mostly reviled here. Willie D. had three years here, was a game under .500 (largely thanks to a 101 pt. season) and even made the playoffs but he is almost universally loathed and even hated here. Green won't even get close to .500 and yet it seems everybody wants to cut him all kinds of slack and blame everything on Benning. What has he done that is so much better than his two predecessors (both of whom were back in the NHL in pretty short order which is unlikely for Green once he gets his walking papers, at least IMHO)? Serious question.

 

[TruKnyte]

I find this is pretty typical of what many on HF think of Green which puzzles me. Torts had this team for one season under JB and was a game over .500; he is mostly reviled here. Willie D. had three years here, was a game under .500 (largely thanks to a 101 pt. season) and even made the playoffs but he is almost universally loathed and even hated here. Green won't even get close to .500 and yet it seems everybody wants to cut him all kinds of slack and blame everything on Benning. What has he done that is so much better than his two predecessors (both of whom were back in the NHL in pretty short order which is unlikely for Green once he gets his walking papers, at least IMHO)? Serious question.

Torts and Willie were so bad that the bar was set very, very low when Green came in. He only had to be an upgrade on them, which isn't hard to do.

For the record, I, and a lot of posters here, don't like Green much either. I mean hell, we have a whole thread called the "Fire Travis Green Thread." It's a false dichotomy that you're creating.

 

[vancityluongo]

I find this is pretty typical of what many on HF think of Green which puzzles me. Torts had this team for one season under JB and was a game over .500; he is mostly reviled here. Willie D. had three years here, was a game under .500 (largely thanks to a 101 pt. season) and even made the playoffs but he is almost universally loathed and even hated here. Green won't even get close to .500 and yet it seems everybody wants to cut him all kinds of slack and blame everything on Benning. What has he done that is so much better than his two predecessors (both of whom were back in the NHL in pretty short order which is unlikely for Green once he gets his walking papers, at least IMHO)? Serious question.

Torts blew up with a roster that was two years removed from a President's Trophy. Desjardins blew a playoff series with one of the worst coaching performances any of us have ever seen. Both coaches are also likely getting fired this year.

Travis Green isn't great, but pretty hard to make chicken salad out of the chicken shit roster Benning has provided him.

The Goldobin example is really the best way to illustrate it. Goldobin is probably a comparable player to Sergei Shirokov, who some people were kinda mad at AV for mishandling/not playing, but it was quickly forgotten. Harder to quickly forget Goldobin when he's like the 5th or 6th best forward on the team.

 

[me2]

I find this is pretty typical of what many on HF think of Green which puzzles me. Torts had this team for one season under JB and was a game over .500; he is mostly reviled here. Willie D. had three years here, was a game under .500 (largely thanks to a 101 pt. season) and even made the playoffs but he is almost universally loathed and even hated here. Green won't even get close to .500 and yet it seems everybody wants to cut him all kinds of slack and blame everything on Benning. What has he done that is so much better than his two predecessors (both of whom were back in the NHL in pretty short order which is unlikely for Green once he gets his walking papers, at least IMHO)? Serious question.

Willie was a one season wonder. After the first season he and his offensive system had been worked out by the league and was getting exploited. He went more defensive and it made it worse. The 1 2 3 4 line management was a joke, it was home ice for Calgary every games of that series which is an utter embarrassment.

Willie lead the Canucks to a record low scoring period in Canucks history. The Canucks went from 242 goals to 191 to 182 under Willie to 218 under Green and on track for 225ish this year. LA kings have seen their scoring drop from 239 goals last year to just 185 so this year under Willie.

 

[strattonius]

Green had Gudbranson on the 2nd pairing for the first half of the season. His -27 and about 40% Corsi. Stecher plus/minus is still around the same playing in the top 4. His Corsi about 51% is still about the same and his plus/minus 12 is around the same as well.

Question I have for you.

If Stecher played in the top 4 for the whole season and not Gudbranson.

Do Canucks still have the same amount of points?

A coach can't make a grinder score 25 goals but with the right coaching move it can make a 6 to 8 point difference in the Standings.

You are asking me pointless hypothetical situations. Instead of wasting the time, let's both analyze the current roster and project where this team will end up: At the beginning of the year it was a consensus dead last place by fans and almost all analysts and publications.

 

[Canucks1096]

You are asking me pointless hypothetical situations. Instead of wasting the time, let's both analyze the current roster and project where this team will end up: At the beginning of the year it was a consensus dead last place by fans and almost all analysts and publications.

The point I am trying to make is coaching definitely can make a difference. If it makes no difference, teams wouldn't even spend bucks on coaching. The numbers show Gudbranson was like the worst D in the league. Having Stecher is the top 4 instead of Gudbranson definitely would of make a difference.

Green should be fired becaude he is a horrible coach. I am still trying to figure out where this mythe came from that he good at developing players. He is horrible at developing players.

 

[Cancuks]

Green gets his accolades from riding Markstrom's coattails to the Calder Cup finals and because he won a Memorial Cup with a roster that had about 10 future NHLers on it. I guess he was responsible for "developing" Seth Jones. Pouliot was also on that team and Green is still "developing" him.

 

[BeardyCanuck03]

Green should be fired becaude he is a horrible coach. I am still trying to figure out where this mythe came from that he good at developing players. He is horrible at developing players.

Player development is such a complex topic. There are a lot of different parts and each player is different.

Who on the Canucks outside of Goldobin do you think Green has failed to develop well in the past 2 seasons as Canucks coach?

 

[F A N]

Green gets his accolades from riding Markstrom's coattails to the Calder Cup finals and because he won a Memorial Cup with a roster that had about 10 future NHLers on it. I guess he was responsible for "developing" Seth Jones. Pouliot was also on that team and Green is still "developing" him.

10 future NHLers? I have to cringe at that comment...