Line Combos: Nylander > Kadri at Center

[Willchel Marlynder]

So we'll get rid of the 4.5M physical #3 centerman for a 7 million #3 centerman??

No thanks.

Why does Kadri get the title physical C but Nylander doesn't get a title like possession beast or something?

 

[stickty111]

Why does Kadri get the title physical C but Nylander doesn't get a title like possession beast or something?

Kadri isn't even physical. It come out once in a while.

 

[moon111]

To me, Kadri being traded is a foregone conclusion. Yes he can submit a 10 team no-trade list which will hamper moved, but in the cap world he's as good as gone.
The Leafs would be way better served putting that money towards other RFA's on the team.

 

[hockeynorth]

Kadri - Matthews - Kapanen
Hyman - Tavares - Marner
Marleau - Nylander - Johnsson

Johnsson-Matthews-Kapanen
Kadri-Tavers-Marner
Marleau-Nylander-Bracco

 

[Pookie]

Kadri isn't even physical. It come out once in a while.

Did someone hack your account?

 

[Paladin2799]

To me, Kadri being traded is a foregone conclusion. Yes he can submit a 10 team no-trade list which will hamper moved, but in the cap world he's as good as gone.
The Leafs would be way better served putting that money towards other RFA's on the team.

In the cap world having a Matthews-Tavares-Kadri locked up for that long at their rates are f***ing money.

Kadri has one of the best contracts in the league for what he brings.

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

It's kind of funny how some people thought Nylander was the worst contract in the league after his first handful of games back and now another set of posters think he has made Kadri expendable in a similar time frame.

 

[Leafling]

So according to some we can afford a 7 mil 3rd line C but can't afford a 4.5 mil Kadri. Mind blowing logic. Nylander is not playing 3rd line min with that big contract come next year.

Will is much more useful to us as a top 6 winger than a 3rd line C, which Naz has done a very decent job with. It's great to know that Nylander can be used at that position when needed but his contract makes it unreasonable to use him as a C behind JT n AM. Even Kadri is not affordable at the 3rd line once his crazy good contract expires.

 

[Nithoniniel]

So according to some we can afford a 7 mil 3rd line C but can't afford a 4.5 mil Kadri. Mind blowing logic. Nylander is not playing 3rd line min with that big contract come next year.

Will is much more useful to us as a top 6 winger than a 3rd line C, which Naz has done a very decent job with. It's great to know that Nylander can be used at that position when needed but his contract makes it unreasonable to use him as a C behind JT n AM. Even Kadri is not affordable at the 3rd line once his crazy good contract expires.

The issue with Willy on the third line is ice time distribution. Paying him 7 million and then putting him in a situation where we get 6 million value is not smart usage. However, I don't think that's unavoidable. For arguments sake, say that we average about 50 minutes even strength time per game. Such a distribution might look:

15 - 16 - 15 (Kadri-Matthews-Kapanen)
13 - 16 - 16 (Hyman-Tavares-Marner)
13 - 15 - 13 (Johnsson-Nylander-Moore)
6 - 6 - 6 (Ennis-Marleau-Brown)

Might look odd at first glance, but this is based on the idea that we load up in consecutive shifts after penalties, and in general just make sure to have our better players our there more while rotating the complementary players. If we play Nylander on the first unit, like we should, and use that unit accordingly, he could average 18 minutes per game running his own line and contributing on a top PP unit. Matthews and Tavares would be a bit north of this at 19, Marner touching 20, and most of the surrounding talent around 15.

Edit: I know I have Kadri in that lineup. That's because I'm mostly just addressing how what kind of usage could get good value from Nylander on the third line.

@IPS, remember our discussions on this topic? Now with larger contracts that need to bring the proper value, I'm with you on this.

 

[Trapper]

It's kind of funny how some people thought Nylander was the worst contract in the league after his first handful of games back and now another set of posters think he has made Kadri expendable in a similar time frame.

I think it’s more along the lines of Salary Cap minus Nylander, Matthews, Tavares, Marner, Johnsson, Kapanen, has made Kadri (not expendable) but probably not able to keep.

We’ve made our choices with the 3 + JT.
You don’t get all of them + all of the others.

Our D needs money put into it. Can’t run with 3 + Marincin/Oz fill ins.

 

[namttebih]

Nylander is playing so much better than Kadri at C. Kadri would be much better as a rower winger, because whatever he is doing at C isn't working.

PS. Better than Kadri on the 1st PP too.

I think that Johnsson looks really good on that PP1

 

[SniperOnTheWing]

We pay Willy $7M AAV to light the league up with Matthews, not drag Marleau and Brown around on the 3rd line. It's great that he has the versatility to play center when needed (like right now) but when Kadri is healthy Willy needs to get promoted to the top six for his excellent play.

You don't keep a $7M player on the 3rd line, you just don't. Especially when that player has proven chemistry on our superstar center's wing.

 

[Nithoniniel]

We pay Willy $7M AAV to light the league up with Matthews, not drag Marleau and Brown around on the 3rd line. It's great that he has the versatility to play center when needed (like right now) but when Kadri is healthy Willy needs to get promoted to the top six for his excellent play.

You don't keep a $7M player on the 3rd line, you just don't. Especially when that player has proven chemistry on our superstar center's wing.

Does it matter what line he is on if he's playing big minutes? I really like the idea of having a great play-driving talent on each of the top three lines.

I agree that it shouldn't happen with Marleau and Brown as wingers though. That's just a waste. Those two should be on the fourth line at this point.

 

[SniperOnTheWing]

Does it matter what line he is on if he's playing big minutes? I really like the idea of having a great play-driving talent on each of the top three lines.

I agree that it shouldn't happen with Marleau and Brown as wingers though. That's just a waste. Those two should be on the fourth line at this point.

I get wanting to spread out offense but at the same time we are still deep enough to load up two top lines and have a really good third line, better than the large majority of teams.

Would you rather two stacked lines score four goals a game, or three diluted lines score three? I'll take option A.

 

[56 Years No Cup]

Kadri is not a 200 ft player and is a terrible back checker he's a one trick pony, he stands in the slot and waits for a pass from his wingers, so he can take a shot on net and that is the reason, he is the center on the PP, while Matthews is shifted to the wing, it's because he can't play on the wing, there used to be a lot of Kadri supporters that were forever wanting his wingers changed because he wasn't doing so well, that's settled down because Nylander and one of Johnsson or Marleau plays on the Left side, two great wingers.

Ask yourself why Kadri never is used on the wing, also ask yourself what is the purpose of the 3rd line, to stack it so Kadri can score and not play on the PK.

Kadri stole your puppy when you where kids, didn't he? Didn't he?

 

[4thline]

I get wanting to spread out offense but at the same time we are still deep enough to load up two top lines and have a really good third line, better than the large majority of teams.

Would you rather two stacked lines score four goals a game, or three diluted lines score three? I'll take option B.

Why not three diluted score 5?

 

[4thline]

The issue with Willy on the third line is ice time distribution. Paying him 7 million and then putting him in a situation where we get 6 million value is not smart usage. However, I don't think that's unavoidable. For arguments sake, say that we average about 50 minutes even strength time per game. Such a distribution might look:

15 - 16 - 15 (Kadri-Matthews-Kapanen)
13 - 16 - 16 (Hyman-Tavares-Marner)
13 - 15 - 13 (Johnsson-Nylander-Moore)
6 - 6 - 6 (Ennis-Marleau-Brown)

Might look odd at first glance, but this is based on the idea that we load up in consecutive shifts after penalties, and in general just make sure to have our better players our there more while rotating the complementary players. If we play Nylander on the first unit, like we should, and use that unit accordingly, he could average 18 minutes per game running his own line and contributing on a top PP unit. Matthews and Tavares would be a bit north of this at 19, Marner touching 20, and most of the surrounding talent around 15.

Edit: I know I have Kadri in that lineup. That's because I'm mostly just addressing how what kind of usage could get good value from Nylander on the third line.

@IPS, remember our discussions on this topic? Now with larger contracts that need to bring the proper value, I'm with you on this.

I love this out of the box thinking, and absolutely hate some of the absolute statements on here. I remember venturing to the Pens board post Kessel trade and advising them on how great would be having the ability to let Kessel drive a 3rd line and draw offense out of lesser players. Got absolutely roasted, possibly even thread banned by mods shouting about 7 million dollar players on 3rd lines, wasting talent, not acquiring a star winger to leave Crosby and Malkin with lesser talents..

Then the the H-B-K driven cup happened

 

[MarnerElite]

Naz will be gone not just because Willy is a better center(and player overall) but by moving Naz and a guy like Brown you free up 6-7 mil and now have enough to sign Kappy and AJ for at least short term deals. And so those guys are much more important as they are also younger and have proven themselves. With Trevor Moore basically doing the job of Brown(and maybe even better) we don't need him. Naz is very much replaceable as our offensive ability won't suffer that much(if at all). With Marner, Matthews, Tavares, Nylander, Kappy, AJ, that's a very good top 6 and it basically doesn't matter who you play on the 3rd and 4th lines(cheap rentals, young guys from AHL, etc).

 

[Koolboss]

Naz will be gone not just because Willy is a better center(and player overall) but by moving Naz and a guy like Brown you free up 6-7 mil and now have enough to sign Kappy and AJ for at least short term deals. And so those guys are much more important as they are also younger and have proven themselves. With Trevor Moore basically doing the job of Brown(and maybe even better) we don't need him. Naz is very much replaceable as our offensive ability won't suffer that much(if at all). With Marner, Matthews, Tavares, Nylander, Kappy, AJ, that's a very good top 6 and it basically doesn't matter who you play on the 3rd and 4th lines(cheap rentals, young guys from AHL, etc).

thank you for your opinion, but what if Matthews is out or Tavares is out for a stretch?

 

[IPS]

The issue with Willy on the third line is ice time distribution. Paying him 7 million and then putting him in a situation where we get 6 million value is not smart usage. However, I don't think that's unavoidable. For arguments sake, say that we average about 50 minutes even strength time per game. Such a distribution might look:

15 - 16 - 15 (Kadri-Matthews-Kapanen)
13 - 16 - 16 (Hyman-Tavares-Marner)
13 - 15 - 13 (Johnsson-Nylander-Moore)
6 - 6 - 6 (Ennis-Marleau-Brown)

Might look odd at first glance, but this is based on the idea that we load up in consecutive shifts after penalties, and in general just make sure to have our better players our there more while rotating the complementary players. If we play Nylander on the first unit, like we should, and use that unit accordingly, he could average 18 minutes per game running his own line and contributing on a top PP unit. Matthews and Tavares would be a bit north of this at 19, Marner touching 20, and most of the surrounding talent around 15.

Edit: I know I have Kadri in that lineup. That's because I'm mostly just addressing how what kind of usage could get good value from Nylander on the third line.

@IPS, remember our discussions on this topic? Now with larger contracts that need to bring the proper value, I'm with you on this.

That honestly looks like a pretty solid template for TOI distribution. It's hard to make something like that work without shorting one of your best talents' ice-time.

In a game where we kill a lot of penalties someone's gonna get shorted ice-time and I think that'd be the best time to have a plan B where you can reunite Nylander with Matthews to make up for lost-time. In Pittsburgh, Malkin/Kessel receives a ton of ES TOI in games where they kill a lot of penalties, because Crosby gets loaded with a bunch of PK time.

 

[SniperOnTheWing]

Why not three diluted score 5?

Because one of those lines is Nylander trying to drag two corpses around.

 

[MarnerElite]

thank you for your opinion, but what if Matthews is out or Tavares is out for a stretch?

And? Many teams have exact same problems, we have enough depth to overcome it..You make it sound as if Naz is this irreplaceable player who can drive his own line..He never has which is exactly why he's very much replaceable(who would you get rid of instead? Kappy who can play a better 2 way game and still get 20 goals or so? AJ who works his ass off and can still get 20 or so goals? It makes no sense...

 

[4thline]

Because one of those lines is Nylander trying to drag two corpses around.

And (hypothetically) turning water into wine, giving us three potent lines.

 

[Notsince67]

With a team that looks like a lock to make the playoffs for a long time, the individual performance in the playoffs between Kadri and Nylander will go a long way to determining which one is moved.
Willy likely yields more on the trade market and provides the greatest cap relief for the leafs. If he is ineffective this year in the playoffs, teams looking to make the playoffs won't care but the leafs will if Kadri performs well.

 

[swint]

Kadri - Tavares - Marner

Johnsson - Matthews - Hyman

Ennis - Nylander - Kapanen

Marleau - Gauthier - Moore/Petan/Brown
​