Line Combos: Nylander > Kadri at Center

SniperOnTheWing

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Apr 28, 2017
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JHZ16Vs.png
 

Nithoniniel

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Sep 7, 2012
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That honestly looks like a pretty solid template for TOI distribution. It's hard to make something like that work without shorting one of your best talents' ice-time.

In a game where we kill a lot of penalties someone's gonna get shorted ice-time and I think that'd be the best time to have a plan B where you can reunite Nylander with Matthews to make up for lost-time. In Pittsburgh, Malkin/Kessel receives a ton of ES TOI in games where they kill a lot of penalties, because Crosby gets loaded with a bunch of PK time.
Exactly.
 

4thline

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Jul 18, 2014
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Waterloo
Looking forward it's likely going to be about getting the best possible top 9 out of Matthews/Tavares/Marner/Nylander/Kapanen/Johnsson knowing that there's going to be limited money to fill out the rest.

With that group (IMO) there's 4 elite players that can drive lines (3 high end, one low) and two solid second tier guys that can contribute and make a "1st line" calibre line in conjunction with an Elite.

Something like
xxx-Tavares-Marner
Johnsson-Matthews-xxx
xxx-Nylander-Kapanen

with xxx's being ELC's and support guys (Hyman level tops unless ELC's player exceeding expectations)

Gives a damn potent offence
 

Trapper

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Nov 21, 2013
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Need some semblance of a shut down line. The good news is that they have one. Hyman-Kadri-Kapanen would work, sub in Brown in case of injury.
Shouldn’t need a shutdown line if you have the equivalent of 3 1st/2nd lines.

Why build a line not to let the other team score when the other team is trying not to let all your lines score.
 
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justafan22

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Jun 22, 2014
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Assuming Kadri's out for the western canada trip, do they call someone up on defense?
 

Leafling

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Oct 24, 2015
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The issue with Willy on the third line is ice time distribution. Paying him 7 million and then putting him in a situation where we get 6 million value is not smart usage. However, I don't think that's unavoidable. For arguments sake, say that we average about 50 minutes even strength time per game. Such a distribution might look:

15 - 16 - 15 (Kadri-Matthews-Kapanen)
13 - 16 - 16 (Hyman-Tavares-Marner)
13 - 15 - 13 (Johnsson-Nylander-Moore)
6 - 6 - 6 (Ennis-Marleau-Brown)

Might look odd at first glance, but this is based on the idea that we load up in consecutive shifts after penalties, and in general just make sure to have our better players our there more while rotating the complementary players. If we play Nylander on the first unit, like we should, and use that unit accordingly, he could average 18 minutes per game running his own line and contributing on a top PP unit. Matthews and Tavares would be a bit north of this at 19, Marner touching 20, and most of the surrounding talent around 15.

Edit: I know I have Kadri in that lineup. That's because I'm mostly just addressing how what kind of usage could get good value from Nylander on the third line.

@IPS, remember our discussions on this topic? Now with larger contracts that need to bring the proper value, I'm with you on this.

Yes I do think that this could work, but knowing Babs, he will keep playing the 4th line imp minutes as well.

P.s. It's funny how Marleau will be a 6.5 mil 4th line C in that case. But ya personally I feel that's his best usage atm. He is just not himself anymore.
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
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St. Paul, MN
With a team that looks like a lock to make the playoffs for a long time, the individual performance in the playoffs between Kadri and Nylander will go a long way to determining which one is moved.
Willy likely yields more on the trade market and provides the greatest cap relief for the leafs. If he is ineffective this year in the playoffs, teams looking to make the playoffs won't care but the leafs will if Kadri performs well.

I have a hard time seeing an asset management guy like Dubas trading the 22 year old asset that’s signed for longer.

Kadri’s age likely makes him the asset that’s moved if the Leafs opt to go the “hockey trade” route. Kadri will be 30 when he needs a new contract and I can’t see the Leafs wanting to lock him up at 6.5-7.5 mil (or more given cap inflation) long term at that point
 

Notsince67

Papi and the Lamplighters
Apr 27, 2018
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I have a hard time seeing an asset management guy like Dubas trading the 22 year old asset that’s signed for longer.

Kadri’s age likely makes him the asset that’s moved if the Leafs opt to go the “hockey trade” route. Kadri will be 30 when he needs a new contract and I can’t see the Leafs wanting to lock him up at 6.5-7.5 mil (or more given cap inflation) long term at that point
True but the leafs will be under pressure to bolster the team in the short run for a legitimate run. Nylander represents 2.5MM more in cap relief and he might garner more for a dman.
If he fails to produce in a playoff atmosphere, the leafs will be under pressure to make a move.
 
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Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
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True but the leafs will be under pressure to bolster the team in the short run for a legitimate run. Nylander represents 2.5MM more in cap relief and he might garner more for a dman.
If he fails to produce in a playoff atmosphere, the leafs will be under pressure to make a move.

Nylander represents upside.

Kadri represents decline.

Choice is pretty easy.
 

Dragao6

Registered User
Dec 25, 2013
3,139
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Ontario, Canada
Need some semblance of a shut down line. The good news is that they have one. Hyman-Kadri-Kapanen would work, sub in Brown in case of injury.

I've always thought hyman kadri kapanen is a perfect 3rd line, when this happens we know our other lines are also properly set finally but...

If people on here are loving nylander is better then kadri as 3C then we can finally move kadri on wing to play with 91 and 16, hyman down to 3rd line??
 

New Liskeard

Registered User
Jul 7, 2007
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Nylander represents upside.

Kadri represents decline.

Choice is pretty easy.

Nylander represents a player that has not lived up to his cap hit

Kadri arguably has one of the best cap hits in the NHL as it relates to value and what he brings.

Kadri plays a much more effective overall game than Nylander, and Nylander has not scored 30 goals whereas Kadri has done it twice. Facts.
 

Pookie

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Oct 23, 2013
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Nylander represents a player that has not lived up to his cap hit

Kadri arguably has one of the best cap hits in the NHL as it relates to value and what he brings.

Kadri plays a much more effective overall game than Nylander, and Nylander has not scored 30 goals whereas Kadri has done it twice. Facts.

Historical facts are interesting.

Where are they on the age related performance curve?
 

New Liskeard

Registered User
Jul 7, 2007
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Historical facts are interesting.

Where are they on the age related performance curve?

Not sure what this curve is you speak of, but keeping to facts, Kadri is signed for 3 years at 4.5 and is 28. Without question, earns his way and is great value. Nylander is 22 and has 5 more years at just under 7 per year and has not come close to playing to his contract and is inferior to Kadri as it relates to an overall game. Until Nylander plays as effectively as Kadri and contributes to that level, he is overpaid and living off potential and has not proven the ability to live up to the expectations set.
 

stickty111

Registered User
Jan 23, 2017
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William Nylander
CF/60: 71.75(1st)
CA/60: 57.48(5th)
CF%: 55.52(1st)

SCF/60: 35.81(3rd)
SCA/60: 27.75(7th)

HDCF/60: 12.95(5th)
HDCA/60: 11.63(14th)

Kadri is not the player he was for 2 seasons. Dubas should trade him and replace him with the 22 year old Nylander. It's the smart thing to do.
I love Kadri but he is regressing.
 

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
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Not sure what this curve is you speak of, but keeping to facts, Kadri is signed for 3 years at 4.5 and is 28. Without question, earns his way and is great value. Nylander is 22 and has 5 more years at just under 7 per year and has not come close to playing to his contract and is inferior to Kadri as it relates to an overall game. Until Nylander plays as effectively as Kadri and contributes to that level, he is overpaid and living off potential and has not proven the ability to live up to the expectations set.

Irrelevant to future production.

What we know from studying the performance curves of NHL players is that performance peaks around 25-27 for forwards.

After which, performance declines. Nylander is on the growth side. Kadri’s production is dropping each year.
 

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
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William Nylander
CF/60: 71.75(1st)
CA/60: 57.48(5th)
CF%: 55.52(1st)

SCF/60: 35.81(3rd)
SCA/60: 27.75(7th)

HDCF/60: 12.95(5th)
HDCA/60: 11.63(14th)

Kadri is not the player he was for 2 seasons. Dubas should trade him and replace him with the 22 year old Nylander. It's the smart thing to do.
I love Kadri but he is regressing.

Someone totally hacked your account ;)
 

Not My Tempo

Registered User
Feb 22, 2015
3,663
3,701
Toronto
William Nylander
CF/60: 71.75(1st)
CA/60: 57.48(5th)
CF%: 55.52(1st)

SCF/60: 35.81(3rd)
SCA/60: 27.75(7th)

HDCF/60: 12.95(5th)
HDCA/60: 11.63(14th)

Kadri is not the player he was for 2 seasons. Dubas should trade him and replace him with the 22 year old Nylander. It's the smart thing to do.
I love Kadri but he is regressing.
Kadri is a steal at 4.5M and tbh that number is reasonable for a 3C. I think leaving Willy at C, and as a result him not getting the full ice time he deserves, doesn’t optimize this lineup to its fullest
 

stickty111

Registered User
Jan 23, 2017
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32,810
Kadri is a steal at 4.5M and tbh that number is reasonable for a 3C. I think leaving Willy at C, and as a result him not getting the full ice time he deserves, doesn’t optimize this lineup to its fullest
Thats alright.
I'm just pointing out Nylander is a very good player, and if you had to pick one of them, you go with the younger asset
 

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