Confirmed with Link: Nylander changing his number to #88 and received WC Best Man Award

[tmlms13]

Ok, Sundin in Van....10 points in 1st 12 games

or 3 in first 9 games.

And 28 in 41 gp. That pace is the lowest of his career, even lower than his rookie season.

 

[Zizzzzy]

You literally used Mario. You did that. If you are making a case for your views the logical thing would be to use comparable examples to validate your point, so when you through out a GOAT, you are comparing the players.

That and I am sure Nylander was MORE than up to speed to compete against year 2000 NHL players.....

 

[egd27]

or 3 in first 9 games.

And 28 in 41 gp. That pace is the lowest of his career, even lower than his rookie season.

True, but also still better than 27 in 54 gp and 38 years old vs 22 years old

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Leaf were hoping that 6.9 AAV number would change to about 6.25

 

[MyBudJT]

Leaf were hoping that 6.9 AAV number would change to about 6.25

Well it's already changed from 7 to 6.9

 

[kindalaidback]

I'll never understand how everyone is so certain that Nylander and Matthews will play together. We spend 2/3 of last season + the playoffs begging Babcock to play one of our best playmakers with our best shooter. But Babcock stubbornly refused.

We lost this season the moment Dubois decided to keep Babcock.

to be fair, william said he doesn't know if he'll be with matthews because he and babcock did not talk about any line combinations. at all.

Nylander said he spoke with coach Mike Babcock last week but said the subject of line combinations never came up. He said he hopes to be reunited with center Auston Matthews.

"Of course," he said. "We've had great chemistry in the past and we've been able to find each other out there. I feel I'm ready to have a huge step in my NHL career, so I think we'd do just fine together."

Nylander ready to 'dominate' for Maple Leafs this season

they've played together almost their entire nhl career-- if william had been in camp, they would've played together from day 1. and given his comments that he isn't expecting to play center (babcock probably mentioned it when he and william had their little chat last week) , i think it's more than likely that he and matthews will end up playing together.

 

[saltming]

I think you've lost the original plot.

How is it that guys can be out for 6-8 weeks with an injury that limits their ability to train, and return to the line up and start contributing almost immediately?

Putting aside the skill gap, do you think Hyman will take 4-6 weeks to get back to his form if he misses camp and the first month of the season due to the surgery? What about Dermott?

Can't use Hyman as an example of a returning player............not as skilled
Cant' use Lemieux as an example of a returning player..........far too skilled

O'Reilly? Ok.....but Nylander out pointed him by 7 in his 54 games (O'Reilly played 29) so I should rethink my stance.

Here's the point as clearly as I believe I can make it.

O'Reilly returned to the line up after holding out and not playing an NHL game for approximately 11 months and put up 8 points in his first 10 games.

Nylander returned to the line up after holding out and not playing an NHL game for approximately 8 months and took 24 games to put up 8 points (2 in his first 10)

The point - There are examples of players returning to the line up after long layoffs and contributing right away........Nylander did not do so.

Things I wasn't saying:
Hyman and Nylander are similar players
Lemieux and Nylander are similar players
O'Reilly outpointed Nylander in his holdout year

I don't have a horse in this race, but I will say if you are just going to look at the first 10 games upon returning, it seems like a very small focus and with that thought I would think it would be better to use the players complete stats, so advanced stats too, to compare the impact the player had when first returning to the game.

 

[Its not your fault]

That and I am sure Nylander was MORE than up to speed to compete against year 2000 NHL players.....

OH no you didn't, dropping a bomb like damn Nylander sure isn't Greatzky in the 80s, gold chain like yo mang.

 

[saffronleaf]

Do you know who Nylander’s most common linemate was last season?

I would suspect it's Kadri, Marleau, Brown, and so on? He only had two stints with Matthews. Right after coming back -- and that was admittedly bad. Then there was a small stretch of games toward the end of the season with AJ and Matthews. They were dominant in terms of possession but Babushcock quickly changed it up for no good reason.

 

[egd27]

I don't have a horse in this race, but I will say if you are just going to look at the first 10 games upon returning, it seems like a very small focus and with that thought I would think it would be better to use the players complete stats, so advanced stats too, to compare the impact the player had when first returning to the game.

But again.........the premise was about contributing almost immediately after an extended absence.

Anyway, I believe I've spent enough time on this so Nylander came back from his hold out and was just fine. Everyone takes 10 - 15 games to round into their old form, he was just unlucky.

 

[saffronleaf]

The fact they played together for Matthews first two seasons, then again when Nylander came back for his third, might have something to do with it....it’s like people forget who put them together in the first place, it wasn’t fate.

Then what about last season? He refused to do it for the most part. He was being so stubborn. He's known for his stubborness and Ego.

 

[MyBudJT]

I would suspect it's Kadri, Marleau, Brown, and so on? He only had two stints with Matthews. Right after coming back -- and that was admittedly bad. Then there was a small stretch of games toward the end of the season with AJ and Matthews. They were dominant in terms of possession but Babushcock quickly changed it up for no good reason.

His most common linemate was Matthews

 

[saffronleaf]

His most common linemate was Matthews

Damn. But like by how many minutes? I suspect not many. Though I've been wrong before.

Oh well, at least that bodes well for Nylander and Matthews playing together this season, which is the important part.

 

[MyBudJT]

Damn. But like by how many minutes? I suspect not many. Though I've been wrong before.

Oh well, at least that bodes well for Nylander and Matthews playing together this season, which is the important part.

Iirc, Kadri is a close 2nd but there is a little gap after that.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I would suspect it's Kadri, Marleau, Brown, and so on? He only had two stints with Matthews. Right after coming back -- and that was admittedly bad. Then there was a small stretch of games toward the end of the season with AJ and Matthews. They were dominant in terms of possession but Babushcock quickly changed it up for no good reason.

Willie played 5-vs-5 minutes ...

1. 270:16 - Kadri
2. 266:16 - Matthews
3. 239:24 - Johnsson
4. 231:07 - Brown
5. 225:05 - Marleau

 

[saltming]

But again.........the premise was about contributing almost immediately after an extended absence.

Anyway, I believe I've spent enough time on this so Nylander came back from his hold out and was just fine. Everyone takes 10 - 15 games to round into their old form, he was just unlucky.

Sure. Like I said I have no horse in the nylander debate. I was just flummoxed and the nylander lemieux comparisons is all

 

[MyBudJT]

Willie played 5-vs-5 minutes ...

1. 270:16 - Kadri
2. 266:16 - Matthews
3. 239:24 - Johnsson
4. 231:07 - Brown
5. 225:05 - Marleau

I'd like to see your source. Dobberhockey states a different story.

Total icetime:
Matthews: 37.9%
Kadri: 35.38%

EV ice:
Matthews: 35.92%
Kadri: 34.66%

Edit: When you look at when there are just 3 forwards too, Matthews still has Kadri beat.


I've attached my calculations.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I'd like to see your source. Dobberhockey states a different story.

Total icetime:
Matthews: 37.9%
Kadri: 35.38%

EV ice:
Matthews: 35.92%
Kadri: 34.66%

Edit: When you look at when there are just 3 forwards too, Matthews still has Kadri beat.


I've attached my calculations.

I just put up 5-vs-5 minutes ... if you use even-strength minutes that can include 3vs3, 4vs4 ...

Even strength minutes are ...

1. 282:58 - Matthews
2. 276:31 - Kadri

 

[MyBudJT]

I just put up 5-vs-5 minutes ... if you use even-strength minutes that can include 3vs3, 4vs4 ...

Even strength minutes are ...

1. 282:58 - Matthews
2. 276:31 - Kadri

And what is your source?

Dobber doesn't provide 5v5, but even when you select just 3F on the ice (assuming they're all 5v5), Nylander still played more with Matthews....

Regardless, EV and total TOI is more relevant in this discussion than 5v5.

 

[DarkKnight]

Then what about last season? He refused to do it for the most part. He was being so stubborn. He's known for his stubborness and Ego.

He started them out together, and Willie stunk so he was off the first line. I mean, Matthews has played 70 percent of his career or more with Nylander, but apparently the coach doesn’t like them together. What? Marner Matthews he has a thing about, that’s real...last year he had every intention of having them together, context matters. And, I felt they would have played together in the playoffs if not for Kadri, Babcock said very specifically Kap and Nylander would move around against Boston, a home away consideration.

 

[Mr Hockey]

And what is your source?

Dobber doesn't provide 5v5, but even when you select just 3F on the ice (assuming they're all 5v5), Nylander still played more with Matthews....

Regardless, EV and total TOI is more relevant in this discussion than 5v5.

natural stats site...

at all strengths, Willie played the most with Marleau and even had a better CF% than with Matthews, most likely because of QoC and Willie was in better shape...
319 - marleau
302 - matthews
302 - johnsson
283 - kadri

 

[saffronleaf]

And, I felt they would have played together in the playoffs if not for Kadri, Babcock said very specifically Kap and Nylander would move around against Boston, a home away consideration.

I think Babcock just said that to save himself by throwing Kadri under the bus. Didn't even give Matthews much ice time in game 7.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I think Babcock just said that to save himself by throwing Kadri under the bus. Didn't even give Matthews much ice time in game 7.

Matthews line had a 38.10 CF% in the game 7 ...

game 7 CF% ...

• 59.38 tavares line
• 53.33 Willie/Marleau/brown line
• 38.10 Matthews line and played against the Krejci line

 

[MyBudJT]

natural stats site...

at all strengths, Willie played the most with Marleau and even had a better CF% than with Matthews, most likely because of QoC and Willie was in better shape...
319 - marleau
302 - matthews
302 - johnsson
283 - kadri

Dobber has Marleau at 37.11% and Matthews at 37.92% in All situations.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Lol priceless.

Ok chief give me another example of a skilled player that started his season in December

Gaudreau lol