News Article: Nylander, Advice for Matthews + Marner

[WTFMAN99]

9M 8 yrs for Marner
11M 8 years for Matthews

It seems right on target to me.

 

[GodEmperor]

Who cares what greedy melander thinks? Truly hope this kid gets traded, a true punk.

 

[Skin Tape Session]

Interesting story yesterday from Dubas:

“Our salary-cap situation is set up that we can defend any of those (offer sheet) threats with no worry at all,”

Maple Leafs GM Dubas has no fear of offer sheets for Matthews and Marner

Guess the “find a way to make it all fit” crap was just crap.

Suck it main board lurkers

 

[A1LeafNation]

9M 8 yrs for Marner
11M 8 years for Matthews

It seems right on target to me.

Why did you give Marner more money than Kucherov?

 

[WTFMAN99]

Why did you give Marner more money than Kucherov?

Tampa Bay Lightning signed Nikita Kucherov (8 Years / $9,500,000 AAV) - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[Pookie]

Suck it main board lurkers

?

 

[Bluelines]

Advice: Sign big,Start Slow.

I get that the guy is a few months behind everyone else and will take time to catch up from a scoring perspective but his effort has been very Kessel-like, playing Ole Ole with his stick when stick checking opponents, floating back into the zone, greedy with the puck/ trying to do too much with the puck, those things are not because he is 2 months behind, those things are because he is playing a lazy "me first" game... he's better than this lazy guy we have been seeing on the ice..

 

[Bluelines]

Don't let the media hype train fool you...Matthews is not as good as McDavid and won't be getting McDavid money...I think $11 million max for Matthews. If Matthews is asking for $13.6 million, there will be issues...and if Matthews asks for that much...how much does Marner asks for?

Since Matthews has entered the league no player has as many G/60 as Matthews, more than Laine, more than Ovie, more than Tarasenko, more than Kucherov, more than everyone in the world, believe the hype, he's that good.

 

[GBLeaf]

I think he's just trying too hard to prove his worth by putting up points. I'm not sure it's a deliberate 'me first'.

He needs to get back to basics. Get in the zone, shift past someone, put it on someone else's stick. It will come.

 

[Bluelines]

Matthews' new contract will depend if he stays healthy for the remainder of this season and the playoffs. Management cannot offer him Connor McDavid money ($12.5M per) if Matthews regularly misses 1/4 of the season. As for the playmaker extraordinaire Marner, he should be signed to $9M per (P.K. Subban money) for 8 years.

I think Matthew's will get similar % of the cap as McDavid, which puts Matthews in the $13 mil range. It's crazy money but it's what the conventional wisdom dictates for an elite player like Matthews.

I think Mitch is getting low balled with all these sub $10 mil estimates, only because his name is Marner and people don't believe that Marner is this good. If a guy named Eichel, Crosby or McDavid was producing at the pace Mitch is, people would be talking 10mil+. If you compare Mitch's 3rd season to McDavid's 3rd season to Crosby's to Eichels, Crosby, McDavid and Mitchs PPG, Mitch is at 1.29 PPG, Crosby is at 1.34 and McDavid is at 1.32. PPG. Player Comparison Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

The guy is ridiculously talented and is among the elite players in the league.

 

[DarkKnight]

9M 8 yrs for Marner
11M 8 years for Matthews

It seems right on target to me.

20 mil to get both signed sounds good to me. Marner in the 8's is outdated. Getting Matthews at 11 would be awesome.

 

[Bluelines]

I think he's just trying too hard to prove his worth by putting up points. I'm not sure it's a deliberate 'me first'.

He needs to get back to basics. Get in the zone, shift past someone, put it on someone else's stick. It will come.

Good point could be from trying too hard, young players with skill like Willie has can let their ego's get in the way and put me first.

 

[GoonieFace]

Why did you give Marner more money than Kucherov?

Just waiting to hear the old inflation argument. But seriously, this deal was just signed, so IMO there is no way Marner should get more than $8.5/year. And anyone that thinks Matthews is getting more than McDavid is whacked.

 

[GoonieFace]

I think Matthew's will get similar % of the cap as McDavid, which puts Matthews in the $13 mil range. It's crazy money but it's what the conventional wisdom dictates for an elite player like Matthews.

I think Mitch is getting low balled with all these sub $10 mil estimates, only because his name is Marner and people don't believe that Marner is this good. If a guy named Eichel, Crosby or McDavid was producing at the pace Mitch is, people would be talking 10mil+. If you compare Mitch's 3rd season to McDavid's 3rd season to Crosby's to Eichels, Crosby, McDavid and Mitchs PPG, Mitch is at 1.29 PPG, Crosby is at 1.34 and McDavid is at 1.32. PPG. Player Comparison Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

The guy is ridiculously talented and is among the elite players in the league.

This is comical. Matthews at $13mil? No way on earth he gets more than McDavid. This whole situation is becoming a joke. Injury prone Matthews isn't worth more than $10-$10.5 as a RFA.

 

[WTFMAN99]

20 mil to get both signed sounds good to me. Marner in the 8's is outdated. Getting Matthews at 11 would be awesome.

Tavares just got 11m and all were ufa years

Matthews also doesn’t have the hardware of McDavid like an art Ross or mvp to warrant anything like his salary. Seem like fair deals.

 

[DarkKnight]

Tavares just got 11m and all were ufa years

Matthews also doesn’t have the hardware of McDavid like an art Ross or mvp to warrant anything like his salary. Seem like fair deals.

Doesn't hurt that Eichel is having a big year either, as a comparable.

 

[Bluelines]

Just waiting to hear the old inflation argument. But seriously, this deal was just signed, so IMO there is no way Marner should get more than $8.5/year. And anyone that thinks Matthews is getting more than McDavid is whacked.

Kucherov (22 yrs old) is not even in the same universe as Marner (21 yrs old) when you compare their 3rd seasons. Player Comparison Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

Comparison below of 5 elite players in the NHL in their 3rd year, which one is Mitch?

Age	GP	G	A	PTS	+/-	PIM	EV	PP	SH	GW	S	S%	TOI	G	A	PTS	S	OPS	DPS	PS	G	A	PTS
▼
21	82	41	67	108	20	26	35	5	1	7	274	15	1767	0.5	0.82	1.32	3.34	10.5	2.6	13.1	42	68	110
21	34	9	35	44	10	12	8	1	0	1	96	9.4	661	0.26	1.03	1.29	2.82	3.4	0.9	4.4	21	83	104
21	82	30	58	88	16	20	21	9	0	6	261	11.5	1574	0.37	0.71	1.07	3.18	8.1	2.2	10.3	33	61	94
22	79	30	48	78	4	20	24	6	0	6	217	13.8	1575	0.38	0.61	0.99	2.75	7.5	1.7	9.2	34	54	88
20	34	23	7	30	-4	20	13	10	0	3	127	18.1	600	0.68	0.21	0.88	3.74	3.5	0.5	4.1	55	16	71

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

The players above are:

Player

Connor McDavid

Mitch Marner

Patrick Kane

Johnny Gaudreau

Patrik Laine

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Believe it, Mitch is among the elites in hockey, he is not a complimentary guy but a top 20, maybe top 10 in the league. The guy dictates play and dictates outcomes of games.

 

[lebdafor norris]

Tavares just got 11m and all were ufa years

Matthews also doesn’t have the hardware of McDavid like an art Ross or mvp to warrant anything like his salary. Seem like fair deals.

Agreed, something a bit more than the Eichel deal is much more likely, Eichel's deal in it's first year right now is currently taking up 12.57% of the cap (contract was signed when the Cap was lower but no way Eichel's agents didn't take into consideration the expected increase in cap when they signed the deal), which would be around 10.44 AAV with the expected cap increase next year. Matthews will likely get a bit more since he looks to be a bit more promising than Eichel did during the latter's first 2 years, so 11 mill is a fair estimate. 11 x 8 is a fine deal specially since that buys the Leafs 4, prime UFA years from Matthews.

 

[GoonieFace]

Kucherov (22 yrs old) is not even in the same universe as Marner (21 yrs old) when you compare their 3rd seasons. Player Comparison Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

Comparison below of 5 elite players in the NHL in their 3rd year, which one is Mitch?

Age	GP	G	A	PTS	+/-	PIM	EV	PP	SH	GW	S	S%	TOI	G	A	PTS	S	OPS	DPS	PS	G	A	PTS
▼
21	82	41	67	108	20	26	35	5	1	7	274	15	1767	0.5	0.82	1.32	3.34	10.5	2.6	13.1	42	68	110
21	34	9	35	44	10	12	8	1	0	1	96	9.4	661	0.26	1.03	1.29	2.82	3.4	0.9	4.4	21	83	104
21	82	30	58	88	16	20	21	9	0	6	261	11.5	1574	0.37	0.71	1.07	3.18	8.1	2.2	10.3	33	61	94
22	79	30	48	78	4	20	24	6	0	6	217	13.8	1575	0.38	0.61	0.99	2.75	7.5	1.7	9.2	34	54	88
20	34	23	7	30	-4	20	13	10	0	3	127	18.1	600	0.68	0.21	0.88	3.74	3.5	0.5	4.1	55	16	71

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

The players above are:

Player

Connor McDavid

Mitch Marner

Patrick Kane

Johnny Gaudreau

Patrik Laine

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Believe it, Mitch is among the elites in hockey, he is not a complimentary guy but a top 20, maybe top 10 in the league. The guy dictates play and dictates outcomes of games.

Scoring in general is up in the NHL, Kucherov scored 29 and 30 goals and had 2 excellent playoff performances at age 21 and 22 I believe. He scored 39 and 40 goals the past 2 seasons and just signed for $9.5mil. Like it or not, goals do matter. IMO Marner is not worth Kucherov money, but thats just my opinion. The way salaries are getting out of control, i'm sure he will get more.

 

[lebdafor norris]

My assumption is, he has realized it wasnt worth that extra $ and now trying to catch up which may not happen. I'm sure he will get better but missing that much time throws a guy off big time. He takes like 25 second shifts. Literally last game watched him ozone its cleared gets to our zone s d if no high pressure occurs hes off.

I don't see an issue with Matthew's to me hes easy. He will probably be highest paid player in the league. With cap inflation of McDavid deal..under a 83mill cap 12.5 is really 13.6. Marner is way harder. Hes come out flying this year and if he keeps this up that 90 100pt season will get him between 9 and 10.

Mcdavid's contract started this year not last year or the year before, so you are overestimating the cap inflation effect. Also, when players signs their contracts early, I'm pretty sure agents takes into account the expected cap increasing from the moment the contract is signed to the first year when the player's new contract is in effect, otherwise, the player's agents would be doing them a disservice.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Tampa Bay Lightning signed Nikita Kucherov (8 Years / $9,500,000 AAV) - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Sorry I was thinking something else.

Didn't Tampa buy more UFA years with their deal. Marner's number is probably going to start with an 8.

 

[ACC1224]

9M 8 yrs for Marner
11M 8 years for Matthews

It seems right on target to me.

For Marner, 9 is ballpark maybe a touch more.

Should be a fairly simple negotiation based on some of the interesting things I've been told this week.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

If I told you that Dubas could sign Matty today for 8 years for 12.75M and Marner for 10.25M for 8 years would you do the deal today?

Or would you continue the negotiations in hopes of securing a better deal down the line?

Curious how the wannabie GMs would play out this scenario ....

 

[GoonieFace]

If I told you that Dubas could sign Matty today for 8 years for 12.75M and Marner for 10.25M for 8 years would you do the deal today?

Or would you continue the negotiations in hopes of securing a better deal down the line?

Curious how the wannabie GMs would play out this scenario ....

Not a chance would I pay for either of them. Matthews $10.5 max, Marner $8.5 max.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Not a chance would I pay for either of them. Matthews $10.5 max, Marner $8.5 max.

Agreed and that is why both of these contracts are going to take a while to get done. Don't blame Dubas. He is taking the high road on each of the kids negotiations. This unfortunately will take some time so don't act like the Nylander negotiations. My estimate is Leafs will get Matty for 12M for 8 years (maybe a chance over the holidays if Leafs move fast). and Marner will be a lot more difficult but thinking 9M over 8 years signing before camp starts next year. At 8.5M Marner will sit out to start camp.