Confirmed with Link: NYI-VAN Beauvillier, 1st (2023 Top 12 Protected), Raty for Bo Horvat

[JTmillerForA1stLOL]

I'm about as critical as one could be with this management and franchise, but I'm good with this trade based off the 1st alone. It's a deep draft or unprotected next year and NYI is probably the worst performing team who were willing to give up a first.

There will always be risk when you're dealing for draft picks but it's something this team clearly needs more of. They can't keep doubling down and spinning their wheels - acquire more picks and draft well, I'm on board for this strategy 100%.

 

[Vector]

Do you think Lamoriello has a scheme to house-flip Bo closer to the deadline if he doesn't re-sign? It could be quite genius.

Remember when the Isles did it with Vanek? Didn't work out quite as well as expected, though.

Moulson, 1st, & 2nd in October. By March they traded him, with a 5th, for a nothing prospect and a 2nd. Wasn't even like he wasn't producing; 44 points in 47 games.

Obvious differences but it would be funny if it happened twice.

 

[VanJack]

If Allvin and Rutherford had the benefit of hindsight or a crystal ball last summer, would Horvat be an Islander today?

Not a chance. Let's be brutally frank here. There's absolutely no way that Boeser and Miller should have been prioritized over Horvat.

The Canuck braintrust were gambling that Horvat's production would stagnate around 60 points and that they'd be able to get his extension done in a $5-$6m range. When he exploded this season, he basically priced himself out of the Vancouver market.

So Horvat is gone because of the completely mystifying signings of first Boeser and then Miller.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I can't think of a bleaker team to sign long term with than the islanders.

I can think of at least one

 

[Vector]

LeBrun on the trade:

But it’s worth pointing out that one of the sticking points from some teams who were interested in going further down the road on trade talks regarding Horvat was that the Canucks did not give permission to the player’s camp to talk extension with other teams.

That seemed surprising because you would think it would augment the return on a trade. But some front offices in Vancouver’s position have told me in the past the worry if you get the agent involved is he can hijack the trade trajectory and wrestle that control away from where the Canucks ultimately wanted to deal him. Or, more to the point, severely limit trade options.

---

The Hurricanes, Bruins and Rangers were among several teams that inquired on Horvat.

For the Rangers, I get the sense it was more tire-kicking because they have three centers they like already. The real need there is a winger before the deadline.

The Hurricanes, as I wrote last week, are not a team that spends big on high-end rental players. So, yes, they had interest in Horvat, but they would have wanted to talk extension with Horvat’s camp first, and as discussed above, that permission was never granted to the agent.

---

People were quick to point out on social media after the trade was made that if the Isles fall out of the playoff race, the team could always flip Horvat before the March 3 trade deadline. But that would fly in the face of Lamoriello’s history with pending UFAs. He often doesn’t believe in moving them no matter where his team is in the standings.

 

[Grip it N RYP it]

I wasn't sure if I was going to the Canucks vs Islanders, Rangers or Devils.

This solves that.

 

[wonton15]

If Allvin and Rutherford had the benefit of hindsight or a crystal ball last summer, would Horvat be an Islander today?

Not a chance. Let's be brutally frank here. There's absolutely no way that Boeser and Miller should have been prioritized over Horvat.

The Canuck braintrust were gambling that Horvat's production would stagnate around 60 points and that they'd be able to get his extension done in a $5-$6m range. When he exploded this season, he basically priced himself out of the Vancouver market.

So Horvat is gone because of the completely mystifying signings of first Boeser and then Miller.

Sums up this regime and the past 10 years quite nicely. 1 step forward and 2-3 steps back.

 

[rypper]

I can think of at least one

I honestly think we're a few years ahead of NYI right now. They're still in the will we or won't we stage of the last few years of Jim Benning.

 

[sting101]

Beauvillier plays with a ton of energy, and will get chances to score if he plays with talented players. He's not strong on his skates, and finishing have been the major concerns with him the last two seasons. But Beauvillier is absolutely clutch. If you need a goal, all of a sudden his finishing issues go away. He was huge in both playoff runs.

At worst, he's a frustrating 3rd-liner, but he could be a good top-6 forward. You bought low on a useful player.

Good to hear thats what i had seen from him. Had made a few proposals with a change of scenery trade on our boards before targetting him. Not sure if were needing another smallish tweener winger but he could find another gear with another opportunity. Thanks for the positivity we can use anything right now.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I honestly think we're a few years ahead of NYI right now. They're still in the will we or won't we stage of the last few years of Jim Benning.

I don't know.

Miller signals win now.

Horvat trade signals rebuild.

We are in a little-bit-of-both situation here.

 

[Nick Lang]

Remember when the Isles did it with Vanek? Didn't work out quite as well as expected, though.

Moulson, 1st, & 2nd in October. By March they traded him, with a 5th, for a nothing prospect and a 2nd. Wasn't even like he wasn't producing; 44 points in 47 games.

Obvious differences but it would be funny if it happened twice.

I think that is beyond silly. No one is gambling like that in this climate ... are they?

 

[Jay26]

I'm happy with the return. The 1st is self-explanatory - I'm frankly shocked that we were able to make a deal with a team like the Islanders in the position they are - and I'm pretty optimistic about Raty.

Lots of bellyaching over Beauvillier but quite simply put, we weren't getting that mid 1st and Raty if the roster player coming back was much better than him. I don't know why there is this expectation that the roster player would be better because if that was the case why would the Islanders even make this deal?? I have no expectations for him whatsoever but there's always the possibility he "gets it" with a new team, in which case he becomes valuable trade capital or a welcome addition to the team going forward.

 

[Vector]

I think that is beyond silly. No one is gambling like that in this climate ... are they?

I would be absolutely shocked if they couldn't work a deal out. If they don't, then we know that Horvat is committed to becoming UFA or had specific destinations in mind. Would explain why the Canucks wouldn't grant extension permission and treated this as a standard rental deal.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Realistically, what would have been a better package?

The other big players were teams like Boston and Toronto. Both would've netted a much worse first rounder, and their best prospects aren't exactly that much better than Raty.

From Boston you might've gotten Lysell, from Toronto maybe someone like Knies or Niemela.

According to their fan bases, absolutely not

 

[Tom Hardy]

Meh. Big meh. Really hoping the Islanders implode.

f***...it's protected. Yuck.

With Horvat, I expect the Islanders to make the playoffs and get a pick about 18th. Unless of course, they make another trade before the trade deadline. I am a Canuck fan, but this forces them to sign Horvat to an extension. It is also a sign of a team that is trying to go for it this year. Not sure this move will get them there, but it certainly improves them.

 

[sting101]

According to their fan bases, absolutely not

Lysell is terrible

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Fantastic that we got exactly what we needed - a first pairing defenseman.

Name one that is available

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I don’t agree with the timeframes that most have here.

You can stop pretending everyone shares your premise.

Arguing from that position makes zero sense.

 

[Tom Hardy]

Raty was a 2nd round pick, I heard those never work out. This isnt nhl 23 people

Since when? Lots of second rounders make it. In fact, Raty, has made it and still has upside. Hearing this was the best off they got. That is because of the risk of trading for an upcoming UFA. They will probably sign him, but it will not be cheep.

HOpefully the Islanders start losing and pick in the top 12. So next year's pick would be unprotected and maybe we can get lucky and they suck.

The only way I see that now, is if they start getting injuries. Horvat should provide an element they lacked.

 

[Nick Lang]

I would be absolutely shocked if they couldn't work a deal out. If they don't, then we know that Horvat is committed to becoming UFA or had specific destinations in mind. Would explain why the Canucks wouldn't grant extension permission and treated this as a standard rental deal.

Yep. It's a reasonable proposition that they feel they can win/show promise and have the cap to pay him, while wining and dining him. It's New York after all. Just maybe they can beat beat Blue Water Café? Hah lol.

 

[me2]

I had not considered this.

Win.

I like this for the same reason I hated that Benning left control of the 1st round pick in the Miller trade to fate. If it hadn't been for Covid it very nearly cost us a top 10 pick.

It could be anything except a top 12 this year, in fact it still might be If NYI look like they are going to be awful next year they might give away the pick of it is 11/12, unlikely as it is.

 

[bossram]

If Allvin and Rutherford had the benefit of hindsight or a crystal ball last summer, would Horvat be an Islander today?

Not a chance. Let's be brutally frank here. There's absolutely no way that Boeser and Miller should have been prioritized over Horvat.

The Canuck braintrust were gambling that Horvat's production would stagnate around 60 points and that they'd be able to get his extension done in a $5-$6m range. When he exploded this season, he basically priced himself out of the Vancouver market.

So Horvat is gone because of the completely mystifying signings of first Boeser and then Miller.

Oh absolutely. I think the deal today is fine. But the logic/thought process as to how they got here is puzzling, if we're being generous. They landed here by accident after tripping over their own shoelaces.

If they had made a similar Miller deal last deadline, like Chytil + Lundkvist (and flipped him for another 1st)+ 1st, the Canucks would be situated very nicely to rebound out of a retool in 2-3 years and have some younger contributing players now

I'm happy with the return. The 1st is self-explanatory - I'm frankly shocked that we were able to make a deal with a team like the Islanders in the position they are - and I'm pretty optimistic about Raty.

Lots of bellyaching over Beauvillier but quite simply put, we weren't getting that mid 1st and Raty if the roster player coming back was much better than him. I don't know why there is this expectation that the roster player would be better because if that was the case why would the Islanders even make this deal?? I have no expectations for him whatsoever but there's always the possibility he "gets it" with a new team, in which case he becomes valuable trade capital or a welcome addition to the team going forward.

My view of the deal is that Beavillier is completely ancillary. He's not expected to contribute anything particularly strong. He's there to make the cap work for the Isles and that's it. If the Canucks can retain 30-50% and flip him next season for a mid-round pick, that's about as good of an outcome as they can get from him.

 

[Peen]

I like this for the same reason I hated that Benning left control of the 1st round pick in the Miller trade to fate. If it hadn't been for Covid it very nearly cost us a top 10 pick.

It could be anything except a top 12 this year, in fact it still might be If NYI look like they are going to be awful next year they might give away the pick of it is 11/12, unlikely as it is.

I think Horvat has gone into a situation that has similar leverage.

He does not have any loyalty to that organization. Islanders have to be good next year as well.

I think he would be smart to wait it out. If he signs instantly, I think that shows how desperately he did not want to sign here.

 

[bbud]

Well watching Horvat respond saying he expected to be a Canuck for life is interesting looking at his career avgs probably had a fair deal or close should have signed did his agent get that memo lol.
Anyway he is out of here hoping next moves make longer term impacts a few more spots in early rounds in drafts over next 2 years would help.

 

[hlrsr]

Bleh. I guess in terms of the market rate for rentals it's not bad, especially considering it's about as well as you'll do for a first round pick in these type of deals (count me in the camp that believes 25+ overall first rounders are extremely overrated).

But if that's the market then sign him. He's still a very good player in his prime.

Allvin's repeated mention of Pettersson and Hughes as leaders kind of makes me think there was a culture element to this. Maybe they believe this is a change the room needs for whatever culture they are looking for that they keep talking about. Still hard to reconcile Miller though.