Post-Game Talk: Nucks 3 Hawks 4 (SO): Hawks extend their streak, Honey Badger Don't Give A ****â„¢

[RobertKron]

Players should never have a night off anyways, but it bothers me nightly expectations are higher for him than even the twins.

No, they shouldn't have off nights, but you also can't be shocked when it happens. Everyone has off nights, or even strings of games where they just can't put it together. There has never been a player - ever - that hasn't had that at some point or another. Especially young guys.

 

[John Bender*]

I dont worry about players like Hamhuis who have proved to be a consistent solid defender for a long time. Edler seems to be going backwards for eff sakes. And is far from playing at the level he should be playing at.

How can you not give a longer leash and expect hamhuis to revert back to his normal self?

With edler, this is his normal self. Thats my problem

Its getting worrisome that the big playoffs he had was him playing above himself. I think most expect that to be where he'll eventually reach, but will he?

It's very possible that each of Bieksa, Garrison, and Edler could all be huge mistake signings. It's not as likely with Edler, but I think the touting from Gillis that he has the makings of a Norris winner are unfounded. I don't think he is #1 dman material.

 

[Tiranis]

They don't play hockey for style points. Too much credit gets given for how things get done rather than whether they get done or not. Also too much attention on mistakes rather than overall play.

I take the guy making 3 big mistakes while being a big part the other 20+ minutes rather than the guy that makes 0 big mistakes but is consistently putting his teammates in a bad position and not keeping up with the play. Right now that guy is Hamhuis.

Bieksa is the guy that's a combination of the two negatives.

 

[Lonny Bohonos]

Yeah I thought that was funny. The Sedins can only create offense, so if they can't create, bad night. Kassian can do everything, so there shouldn't be a night where we don't see at least one dominant aspect shine through... Wow.


You know it's crazy when Kassian is held to a _higher_ standard than the Sedins. Just mind-bottling.

The thing that bothers me is that its not as simple as some fans make it out to be. I mean if you are having an off game (not arguing whether Kass has played well of late or not), for what ever reason (fatigue, illness etc etc) its not like you can just replace one factor with another.

I was thinking of a closer comparison in Schroeder:

Schroeder is expected to:

- Score
- Pass and make plays
- Play defense

Kass is expected to:

- Score
- Pass and make plays
- Play defense
- Lay out big hits
- Fight
- Dominate along the boards


I agree with Tiranis comments on his last games (haven't watched tonight's game) that he looks mentally fatigued. He looks like hes second guessing himself and not "letting the game come to him".

I would think that having all those factors to consider game in game out is a tough thing mentally especially for a rookie/young guy. Always having to think what should I be doing now.

 

[Pseudonymous*]

It's very possible that each of Bieksa, Garrison, and Edler could all be huge mistake signings. It's not as likely with Edler, but I think the touting from Gillis that he has the makings of a Norris winner are unfounded. I don't think he is #1 dman material.

Bieksa is the same player. I dont see him being a problem. Its always been known he needs somebody to carry alot of weight so he can do his thing. Currently he does not have that. Because hamhuis isnt' paired with him and they weren't given enough time to find their stride again together because Edler and Garrison didn't work out. Because he brought in a freaking left side D man to play with a left side D man :/

I also dont see Edler being a bad signing either, mainly because, even if he struggled for quite some time, and didn't look like he'd be the player we expected he would be (which is unlikely), another team would still pay pretty good to get him and give him a shot. The kid has the size and tools. So no matter how you look at it, good signing.

Garrison. Well we'll see. Im still leaning slightly towards he'll be fine. Though with his contract, he'll have to play better than fine to please fans

 

[dsedin]

hawks commentators immediately villified hansen on that play, stating hansen targeted hossa's head and wasn't going for the puck at all...when that's clearly not the case...both players are reaching for the puck.

i think the play has some simmilarities to the cooke-karlsson incident in that both are fairly routine plays that resulted in unfortunate outcomes

 

[Pseudonymous*]

They don't play hockey for style points. Too much credit gets given for how things get done rather than whether they get done or not. Also too much attention on mistakes rather than overall play.

I take the guy making 3 big mistakes while being a big part the other 20+ minutes rather than the guy that makes 0 big mistakes but is consistently putting his teammates in a bad position and not keeping up with the play. Right now that guy is Hamhuis.

Bieksa is the guy that's a combination of the two negatives.

I dont even know how you can criticize hamhuis right, or anyone can. The guy was the most consistent D to ever play in a canuck uniform IMO. He is a rock. The guy lost his partner and has been forced to play with a D man who is struggling to play the right side. Hamhuis will be fine. Sadly the canucks made a dumb move by getting too many left side D's and are giving him a hell of a time to get his game back, throwing him new partners who are also struggling.

Hamhuis will always be the last of my concerns. Atleast I know he'll get it back.

If sedins went on a real bad streak, same thing. Wouldn't spend my time getting on them. I worry about guys who may not find their game again or dont' fit

 

[JuniorNelson]

Garrison was brought in to replace Salo and is now thought to be barely the match of Rome?

Rome wasn't built in a day. He sucked for at least a year in Vancouver before he became the player he is now. Garrison will get better with more games.

I do not think Ballard is an issue for his play or his contract. He is Gillis aquisition and as such has tenure for the duration of his contract. He will be here for its entirety. That's Gillis. He is willing to overlook wierdness like a 4.5 million dollar third pairing defenseman and a six and a half million dollar back-up as long as the team keeps winning. I do not think the dollars bother him at this time. I doubt he uses a buyout during his administration.

The bright side of these oddities, is that the team seems like a tight group. They are stepping up for each other and that is what you want. I've said elsewhere that the team is growing into thier new persona. I think it's not the one Gillis imagined. This team seems to be focused on more than regular season wins. I think they are trying to become a playoff team.

 

[PG Canuck]

Bieksa needs that comfort piece with him on defense, and Garrison can't be that right now because he doesn't know Bieksa's tenancies while Hamhuis does, yet we split that pairing up which was the best pairing last year.

This year is weird because we have started out not looking like our usual selves (nothing new for each start to a season), but this time around we have a good record for our bad play.

Like I've been saying early on in the season since Schroeder's first NHL goal, it's a year of firsts.

 

[Aphid Attraction]

It's very possible that each of Bieksa, Garrison, and Edler could all be huge mistake signings. It's not as likely with Edler, but I think the touting from Gillis that he has the makings of a Norris winner are unfounded. I don't think he is #1 dman material.

Don't see another level from Edler at the mo, May be with different personal but I don't see how that will change. They might turn out to be bad signings, but still be the best options he had available.

 

[Lonny Bohonos]

It has been 2 off nights and 1 period. Big deal... Had a heck of a game a week ago against Minnesota but somehow that's already forgotten.

The funny thing is reading the posts on here before I watch the game and Im expecting a lump of turd. Then I watch the game and scratch my head.

Even with his "poor" play the last couple of games hes still done some nice things.

The pass to Kelser for the turnover wasn't great but that might have turned out differently had Kesler caught that pass which maybe is the case if it was Keslers 12th game and not his 2nd. He also made another pass to Kesler later in the game that Kesler didnt catch.

 

[Ainec]

I don't have a problem with Garrison, was happy about the signing that day

But wow... We need....

Justin Schultz.

 

[Pseudonymous*]

We have a team with 3 top D's who need a more solid D partner. and 1 solid d guy who is struggling. Nobody can get back their game because theyre all struggling at the same time. I think Edler, Hamhuis and Bieksa would all be doing much better if not for playing in a different place from last year. All due to GMMG for acquiring somebody and just crossing his fingers that Edler can make the transition to the right side. :/

 

[Bleach Clean]

Mind bottling? I have not heard that expression before.

Kassian can have the odd night off.......problem is it's been more than just an odd night off lately.

Will Farrell movie ("mind bottling").


Kassian has been off about 2 and half games. Well overblown.

 

[Tiranis]

I dont even know how you can criticize hamhuis right, or anyone can. The guy was the most consistent D to ever play in a canuck uniform IMO. He is a rock. The guy lost his partner and has been forced to play with a D man who is struggling to play the right side. Hamhuis will be fine. Sadly the canucks made a dumb move by getting too many left side D's and are giving him a hell of a time to get his game back, throwing him new partners who are also struggling.

Hamhuis will always be the last of my concerns. Atleast I know he'll get it back.

If sedins went on a real bad streak, same thing. Wouldn't spend my time getting on them. I worry about guys who may not find their game again or dont' fit

You're worrying about the two guys that are covering for the two guys playing like crap. Seems silly. I would understand worrying about Edler if he was playing like this with the Hamhuis-rock, but that's not the version of Hamhuis he's stuck with right now.

Bieksa needs that comfort piece with him on defense, and Garrison can't be that right now because he doesn't know Bieksa's tenancies while Hamhuis does, yet we split that pairing up which was the best pairing last year.

This year is weird because we have started out not looking like our usual selves (nothing new for each start to a season), but this time around we have a good record for our bad play.

Like I've been saying early on in the season since Schroeder's first NHL goal, it's a year of firsts.

The pairing was split up as much for its own play as for the play of Edler - Garrison pairing.

 

[SnapIt]

The rivalry continues..

 

[Bleach Clean]

I dont even know how you can criticize hamhuis right, or anyone can. The guy was the most consistent D to ever play in a canuck uniform IMO. He is a rock. The guy lost his partner and has been forced to play with a D man who is struggling to play the right side. Hamhuis will be fine. Sadly the canucks made a dumb move by getting too many left side D's and are giving him a hell of a time to get his game back, throwing him new partners who are also struggling.

Hamhuis will always be the last of my concerns. Atleast I know he'll get it back.

If sedins went on a real bad streak, same thing. Wouldn't spend my time getting on them. I worry about guys who may not find their game again or dont' fit

Just because you give Hamhuis the benefit of the doubt based on _past_ play, doesn't mean he's playing well now. He isn't.


Dumb move by getting too many left side Ds? Would you rather they not have gotten a top4 Dman on a solid deal?


To me, Edler looks as he did on the left side last year. Almost the same. That's how he "looks". The difference? His competition is much greater this year. So you won't see him dominate from the point he was at last year because his competition has changed. Yet he's still producing. Still transitioning the play like he did last year, when he carried Salo.

 

[Karter]

Rome wasn't built in a day. He sucked for at least a year in Vancouver before he became the player he is now. Garrison will get better with more games.

Well played sir, well played.

 

[thebigbea]

next game fight.. hansen vs keith... lol

 

[Pseudonymous*]

Just because you give Hamhuis the benefit of the doubt based on _past_ play, doesn't mean he's playing well now. He isn't.


Dumb move by getting too many left side Ds? Would you rather they not have gotten a top4 Dman on a solid deal?


To me, Edler looks as he did on the left side last year. Almost the same. That's how he "looks". The difference? His competition is much greater this year. So you won't see him dominate from the point he was at last year because his competition has changed. Yet he's still producing. Still transitioning the play like he did last year, when he carried Salo.

I know hes playing poorly but why would people worry or vent about it? (knowing he'll return to form) Im just explaining why there are some people getting more criticism than others. Thats why people are on Edler, because we've been expecting Edler to round out his game for a while now. and it looks like he still can't carry a pairing.

Hamhuis on his game, which he usually is, is capable of doing so.

Yeah youre right, probably not a bad deal since it came without giving up any assets. Can't really blame them. But I figured it would be hard to fit him in and if he struggles and he doesn't fit, how good is his value going to be at his price tag? And I know the GM will keep him for sometime to really be sure hes worth trading. So our D pairings could be out of whack for a sometime if he does continue to struggle. So short term and long term, our pairings could be real screwed if somebody doesn't learn to adapt

I do think there was more chance the pairings weren't going to work with Garrison. Ive seen enough D's try to play their opposite side to know this

 

[deadinthewater]

next game fight.. hansen vs keith... lol

As if that **** would drop the gloves.

 

[Tiranis]

The pass to Kelser for the turnover wasn't great but that might have turned out differently had Kesler caught that pass which maybe is the case if it was Keslers 12th game and not his 2nd. He also made another pass to Kesler later in the game that Kesler didnt catch.

AV hates those type of plays. Guys like Guy Boucher love them. When Kassian played in junior, those types of breakouts were likely encouraged.

 

[Bleach Clean]

I know hes playing poorly but why would people worry or vent about it? Im just explaining why there are some people getting more criticism than others. Thats why people are on Edler, because we've been expecting Edler to round out his game for a while now. and it looks like he still can't carry a pairing.

Hamhuis on his game, which he usually is, is capable of doing so.

Yeah youre right, probably not a bad deal. Can't really blame them. But I figured it would be hard to fit him in and if he struggles and he doesn't fit, how good is his value going to be at his price tag? And I know the GM will keep him for sometime to really be sure hes worth trading. So our D pairings could be out of whack for a sometime if he does continue to struggle. So short term and long term, our pairings could be real screwed if somebody doesn't learn to adapt

Edler can carry a pairing. He was dragging Salo around all of last year.


I'm not worried in the slightest about our D. The benefit you give Hamhuis, I give Edler. The guy is this team's offensive engine. Hamhuis wishes he could create like that from the back end, and that's why I give Edler the benefit of the doubt.


The forwards are more at fault for this. The team isn't playing together and it shows. The D are left to fend for themselves. Before I even look at pinning it on the pairings or Edler playing on the right side or Bieksa not being ready, I'm looking at the forwards to get their collective heads screwed on straight. Especially against fast teams. Until that happens, I'm not sure how one could judge the D fairly.

 

[dsedin]

It's like the canucks have 4 kids on defense, they youngest just doesn't know any better yet (jason), they have a quiet one who has a lot of potential but doesn't apply himself (alex), a naughty one that makes you laugh and cry ..you take the good and the bad as it comes and at the end of the day you say i did my best..but the oldest, he should know better! (dan)..then you have their cousin keith, who never fits in and is always an outcast...and his little brother chris..chris may be the one bright spot of the family if he gives it a shot.

Now Keith should have some big responsibilities as he's a big kid, but he only gets along with his younger brother chris. Only Dan can keep Kevin in check but Dan hasn't been himself lately and someone else has to keep Kevin in check..Jason is too young to deal with Kevin so that leaves Alex..we'll see how alex does ..

One big dysfunctional family, MoDern Family, 7:00 pm every other day on Sportsnet. Frustrating. On so many levels.

 

[Pseudonymous*]

Edler can carry a pairing. He was dragging Salo around all of last year.


I'm not worried in the slightest about our D. The benefit you give Hamhuis, I give Edler. The guy is this team's offensive engine. Hamhuis wishes he could create like that from the back end, and that's why I give Edler the benefit of the doubt.


The forwards are more at fault for this. The team isn't playing together and it shows. The D are left to fend for themselves. Before I even look at pinning it on the pairings or Edler playing on the right side or Bieksa not being ready, I'm looking at the forwards to get their collective heads screwed on straight. Especially against fast teams. Until that happens, I'm not sure how one could judge the D fairly.

Dragging around Salo? Salo is an extremely smart D man. I believe A.V has time and time again said where Salo stood on our team. The only reason he wasn't resigned is because of his durability and age will catch up to him soon.

Edler still needs a real smart solid D to cover his mistakes so he can be offensive. Like Bieksa. Alot expect more. There are top D's out there who could probably carry any partner. I truthfully dont think Edler could carry Tanev like Hamhuis has in the past.

Edler's game this year is just showing frustrations people have had of him for some time. The frustration with Hamhuis is just that he hasn't been playing up to par this season. Big difference. One will come back. The other may continue to frustrate nightly because we feel he has the tools to become more

I dont know, im not up for debating who is more at fault though. Im just trying to explain why there isn't as much frustration towards somebody who plays up to his level consistently and one who continues to show where he can play but never quite reaches there consistently.

I like all our D and im somewhat confident garrison will figure it out. Hopefully with Bieksa because i dont trust Edler can figure it out on the right side unless hes playing with hamhuis. Poor edler, forced to play his off side. I dont suspect we'll see the true edler until he returns back to the left side.