Nico Hischier

[KingTux]

That's basically Ryan O Reilly I described....I think devil fans would be happy if he's "only" as good as ROR.

I think O'Reilly is a fair comparison of what he can become

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Ohhhh wow. Your entire angle makes sense now. You didnt realize that Nico played 82 games and is no longer a prospect! See, throwing 85 point C out for someone we’ve never seen would be nonsense, but let me fill you in on what you missed.

Nico played 82 games as a rookie in 2017-18, and scored 51 points while seeing almost no power play time. Now if you recall, he was the first pick in the 2017 draft, meaning he was 18-19 during the season.

Now in hockey, and really every sport. We have this thing called progression. Players usually continue to progress until they’re about 23-26, and hit their prime.

Thus, many say it might be reasonable for a 19 year old kid who put up 51 (46 EV) points in his D+1 might have some space to continue to build on it; and be one of the better players in the league....

What exactly is so implausible about this? How is this not a realistic possibility when we’ve seen it happen in the past? You my friend, are done. Idk if you root for the canes or avs. But either way, sucks.

You're literally not even worth replying to.

How can you not read what I said about progression, but pick out the word prospect even when its used in the right context.

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

I think O'Reilly is a fair comparison of what he can become

That would be terrible and is extremely underrating Hischier

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Not going to bother with this whole thing, but this jumped out to me. Do you know what people mean by "ceiling"? You just said he could do it, so you basically agreed with the premise that that's his ceiling. Maybe someone said he definitely will, I haven't read through every post, but your post just contradicts itself. Or you just think when people say "ceiling" that they mean he'll definitely reach that mark.

Like you said, he could end up being that good. That's his ceiling. He might not though.

Do I think McDavid could score 140+ points in a season and become a top 4 player in the history of the game? Yes I think he has that potential.
But I wouldn't bet on it.
Same with Hischier. 85 is possible but I think the odds are slim, so I will go with a much safer prediction of 65ish.
But yes its based on people acting like ceilings are guarantees and they don't realize that they are an "everything goes right" scenario

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Last 10 forwards selected 1OA and their points per game in the NHL in their D+1 season:

Nico Hischier - 0.63
Auston Matthews - 0.84
Connor McDavid - 1.07
Nathan MacKinnon - 0.77
Nail Yakupov - 0.65
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins - 0.84
Taylor Hall - 0.65
John Tavares - 0.66
Steven Stamkos - 0.58
Patrick Kane - 0.88

Same players, 5on5 points per 60 minutes:

Nico Hischier - 2.40
Auston Matthews - 2.12
Connor McDavid - 2.69
Nathan MacKinnon - 2.07
Nail Yakupov - 2.14
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins - 1.95
Taylor Hall - 1.51
John Tavares - 1.32
Steven Stamkos - 1.76
Patrick Kane - 2.26

Yeah because that isn't a specific set of parameters or anything.
And I too agree that Yakupov>Stamkos and Hischier!

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

Do I think McDavid could score 140+ points in a season and become a top 4 player in the history of the game? Yes I think he has that potential.
But I wouldn't bet on it.
Same with Hischier. 85 is possible but I think the odds are slim, so I will go with a much safer prediction of 65ish.
But yes its based on people acting like ceilings are guarantees and they don't realize that they are an "everything goes right" scenario

Are you saying Hischier's ceiling is 65 points?

 

[Blender]

Yeah because that isn't a specific set of parameters or anything.
And I too agree that Yakupov>Stamkos and Hischier!

The narrative since last summer has been that Hischier was a bad 1st overall pick. Common prediction on this board before the season was that he would get 25-30 points if he even stuck in the NHL. He ends up with 52 points, the vast majority at even strength, and has a comparable season to most other recent first overall picks, yet the narrative hasn't changed to reflect reality.

There is zero reason why he can't be a ~70 point per year Selke candidate and be counted among the elite centers in the league based on how he played this season.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I think O'Reilly is a fair comparison of what he can become

I mean he had 9 less points than OReilly did this past year while playing 4 minutes per game less

he also outscored him significantly at even strength

to say that that is "what he can become" is just silliness...he is already on that level

 

[KingTux]

That would be terrible and is extremely underrating Hischier

Yeah... a 55-65 almost perfect two-way center playing on one of the worst team of the last decade is a terrible projection for Hischier ?

Jeez I'm sorry, I forgot how well we project young players on HFboard and how we tend to not overhyped them as well.

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

Yeah... a 55-65 almost perfect two-way center playing on one of the worst team of the last decade is a terrible projection for Hischier ?

Jeez I'm sorry, I forgot how well we project young players on HFboard and how we tend to not overhyped them as well.

So Hischier is almost peaked offensively at 19

What a total joke

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Are you saying Hischier's ceiling is 65 points?

No his ceiling is 85. But I don't think he'll hit it.
I think he'll be a 65 point 1C.

Calm down

 

[Dustin]

Nico is a fantastic player. Some players come into the league and set it on fire others dont and all walks in between. Nico could absolutely become one of the best players in the league. Only time will tell. One year is certainly not enough to make a judgement call on a kids potential.

 

[KingTux]

So Hischier is almost peaked offensively at 19

What a total joke

And O'Reilly was 64 ?

Look, I honestly don't know what the big deal is. O'Reilly was playing on one of the worst team of the last decadefor several years and was still racking points. He's only 27 years old and I wouldn't be surprised to see him hit 70 pts + in St-Louis. He's known for his great defensive/two-way game or whatever you want to call as well.

Calling Hischier a great 65 points defensive minded center is not an insult at all. It might be for you, but for us Habs fan, 65 points represent the point total of all our centers...

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

No his ceiling is 85. But I don't think he'll hit it.
I think he'll be a 65 point 1C.

Calm down

Im calm

I just think betting on him being a 65 point center is pretty unreasonable since most players rise more than 13 points from their rookie year

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

And O'Reilly was 64 ?

Look, I honestly don't know what the big deal is. O'Reilly was playing on one of the worst team of the last decadefor several years and was still racking points. He's only 27 years old and I wouldn't be surprised to see him hit 70 pts + in St-Louis. He's known for his great defensive/two-way game or whatever you want to call as well.

Calling Hischier a great 65 points defensive minded center is not an insult at all. It might be for you, but for us Habs fan, 65 points represent the point total of all our centers...

The problem is youre topping Hischier out at barely above his rookie season. Most players rise a lot more than 15-20 points from their rookie year

 

[tucker3434]

The problem is youre topping Hischier out at barely above his rookie season. Most players rise a lot more than 15-20 points from their rookie year

Do they? A whole lot of guys show up in the league as good players and don’t make huge leaps. I’d wager 99% of player don’t increase more than 20 points from their rookie season.

 

[goonybird]

Do they? A whole lot of guys show up in the league as good players and don’t make huge leaps. I’d wager 99% of player don’t increase more than 20 points from their rookie season.

ya, like rantanen and mackinnon

 

[Strait2thecup]

Do they? A whole lot of guys show up in the league as good players and don’t make huge leaps. I’d wager 99% of player don’t increase more than 20 points from their rookie season.

What about first overall picks? More specifically players that play their first season at 18 years old.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

I think he will be a top 10-20 , and if he's in that range, Devils fans should be ecstatic:

1-10, no order:

McDavid
Crosby
Malkin
Scheifele
Barkov
Bergeron
Matthews
Kopitar
Backstrom
Mackinnon

11-20, no order:

Eichel
Tavares
Couturier
Kuznetsov
Seguin
Getzlaf
Draisaitl
Barzal
Point
Stamkos

*if I missed someone, sorry! But you get the point of the caliber of player I think he can become!

 

[NJ DevLolz]

That would be terrible and is extremely underrating Hischier

No, it wouldn't be. O'Reilly is excellent-- stop being unreasonable

 

[Kurt Cobain]

No, it wouldn't be. O'Reilly is excellent-- stop being unreasonable

I would find it extremely disapointing if Nico only became a 65 point player since he was a 52 point player as an 18 year old. Especially when you factor in how he attained those points with almost no time on the first PP unit. How often does your first line center not play on the first PP unit. He could of easily been a 60 point player had he done so and possibly the 65 point player we're talking about him becoming. It's really not at all unreasonable to disagree with that statement. Look at how much O'Reilly improved from his 18 year old rookie season, yet Nico can't improve as he did? Strange statement from a Devils fan who you would assume watched him last season and knows the specifics about his season. Feel like you're to eager to be agreeable.

 

[byrath]

Thats exactly the problem

No one has a problem claiming Hischier wont be some McDavid or Matthews level hyped player, but the kid gets treated like he is aome Jankowski or Baertschi level guy who hasnt proven **** and is turning 24

I've maybe seen one person say he'll be worse than a 60-65pt 1B center with good defense, not really seeing the problem. Given his rookie production I'd guess that he peaks higher than that, but it's not an unreasonable opinion (the 60-65pts).

 

[zharkenby]

Okay so this thread is:

3 NJ homers telling all of us how Hischier is to linearly progress for the next decade and crack 99's point record.
5ish NJ fans giving reasonable and objective opinions.
10 neutral fans fighting with the 3.
10 different neutral fans agreeing with the 5.

That about sums it up.

But actually going back to topic. It is 100% wrong to attribute Hall's season to Hischier. He's had better even strength seasons in the past, and his Hart winning point spike was on the PP- where Hischier was nowhere to be found.
Also to the guy saying Hischier is a 1st OA on the level of Stamkos and Mackinnon. Yeah thats going to be a no for me dawg. Stamkos is a 2 time Rocket winner and a PPG 1C on the most dangerous team in the NHL. He's also had near 100 point seasons, as well as a 60 goal peak. I will actually eat my shorts if Hischier even comes close to touching either of those numbers.
Mackinnon is much younger, but Mackinnon was more highly regarded as a 1st OA, and he proved that this year with a phenomal dynamic season where he just DOUBLED Hischier's production.
Progression isn't linear, and I think its just as likely he is near his ceiling, as it is him having another gear. Just ask the respective fans where they thought Toews, RNH, Landeskog, Yakupov, and Ekblad would be years after their rookie seasons. I'm not saying he can't progress, but it is not the guarantee that many several of you are acting like it is.
Professional scouts said that he was a weaker 1st OA and thats okay. Not every guy is going to be a McDavid/Crosby. But actual professionals did say they thought his ceiling was a low end 1C, and I doubt his good but not amazing rookie season would really change their opinions significantly.
Predicting a ceiling of PPG and top 5 defensively is a BOLD play. Could he do it? Yes. Will he? I have my doubts. Because a PPG top 5 defensive C is ****ing Kopitar. Aka one of the best centers in the league for the better part of the last decade. Being top 5 defensively basically means a selke finalist, and PPG is the upper echelon of center production. That is without a doubt a top 5 center in the league. If you believe that is what he'll be then I wish you the best, because there is clearly no reasoning with you there.
I think he is a good player, and I think NJ has a bright future with him as a centerpiece of their franchise. But some people really need to tone it back. No one has ever had that high of expectations of him, and it seems crazy to suddenly throw them on.
I personally see him as Monahan-lite. More playing-making and less goal-scoring though. Solid (but not selke) level defense, as well as 65ish point upside (playing next to a star winger). I think its a decent parallel and one that Hischier will fulfill.

When Hischier has his 1st 85 point season or selke trophy win, feel free to come back and make fun of me. Until then, no need to be so defensive, especially when you can't back it up.

Also to the guy citing what Hall said about his linemate as "evidence" for Hishcier contributing to his Hart win. Whats Hall suppose to say? "Yeah **** that guy, if I had Crosby I could have hit 100". No, of course he is going to give some credit to his linemate. I guarantee you every single other player in the league would do the same. Ive personally never seen weaker argument on this site than that right there.

I’ll read the rest of your post when you find me where anyone said that.

He will however progress for the next 4-5. Jesus dude, this kid f*** your girlfriend or something? Take hike bud

 

[tucker3434]

What about first overall picks? More specifically players that play their first season at 18 years old.

I don’t think it matters. I think if you’d asked the scouts at the draft, they’d probably say he had 70 point upside. I don’t think a 52 point rookie season playing next to the Hart winner drastically changes that. I guess I’m just not seeing what Devils fans are seeing.

 

[Blender]

I don’t think it matters. I think if you’d asked the scouts at the draft, they’d probably say he had 70 point upside. I don’t think a 52 point rookie season playing next to the Hart winner drastically changes that. I guess I’m just not seeing what Devils fans are seeing.

How many Devils games did you watch last season? I don't even have an issue with him being around a 70 point player who is great defensively, but I'm wondering what you're basing your evaluation off of.