NHL move to Winnipeg 'a step back'

[blasted]

The anti-Winnipeg rhetoric in this thread is very entertaining. I'm going to make a point to come back to this thread at the end of every single year to get a good laugh at other peoples doubts when it will be proven, year after year after year, that we are indeed a viable small market due to the intelligence and savy business sense of TNSE.

It will be a great annual tradition.

History will repeat itself.

Just like in the old barn, once the novelty wears thin, the combination of a small city, seats priced far too expensive for the average Winnipegger and a mediocre hockey team will lead to the same problem we had before.....MANY empty seats for weekday games.

But. the Maple Leafs wil always sellout when they come to town and get the loudest cheers!!

 

[blasted]

Youth hockey participation in Canada has not "fallen for decades" as you claim....
http://www.hockeycanada.ca/index.php/ci_id/23952/la_id/1.htm

As per the most recent data...
Male registration in Canada in 99/00 - 461,946
Male registration in Canada in 09/10 - 491,453

The female numbers are growing at a more rapid pace.

To summarize, hockey registrations in Canada are rising in both categories, not falling.

If you actually believe that..then your not at all involved with any kids hockey program.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

I don't know the exact numbers and all but didn't the Hockey News run a (rather sensationalist) story about junior hockey losing players late last year? Headline something like "Is hockey dying in Canada?"

 

[Puckschmuck*]

History will repeat itself.

Just like in the old barn, once the novelty wears thin, the combination of a small city, seats priced far too expensive for the average Winnipegger and a mediocre hockey team will lead to the same problem we had before.....MANY empty seats for weekday games.

But. the Maple Leafs wil always sellout when they come to town and get the loudest cheers!!

This is funny, coming from someone who pretends to live in Winnipeg but is really from Phoenix. Nice try, again.

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

Depends I guess, personally I would much prefer freezing temperatures over some of the temperatures seen in Phoenix. Really not a fan of the heat myself.

I would prefer the cold over the 110 degrees Phoenix gets in the summer.

It's still hot when the season starts. 91 on average but by the end of October the average high temperature is down to 80. The average high at the end of December is 67 with a low of 44. By the end of the regular season the average high is 83 with a low of 57.

Now would you rather live in comfortable weather like Arizona in the winter or the freezing cold of Winnipeg or Edmonton or Minneapolis or any other northern city?

 

[Steve Passless*]

I might prefer to live in comfortable weather if I actually had to reckon with weather every day. If I'm an NHL player, I spend most of my well-compensated life working, traveling, or drinking, so it's not really as much of a factor. It's not like guys have to go clear their driveways and stuff (unless you're Joe Sakic).

Something tells me hockey players aren't particularly concerned with warm weather when they're busy trying to be good at their jobs. The glamorous weather of Phoenix and Miami has only led to junk-drawer rosters.

 

[Alex The Loyal]

It's not the cold itself, if it's -30 with no wind it's not that bad, but if it's really windy in December, ouch. The wind chill is what really makes a winter day in Canada hell

 

[Steve Passless*]

Good thing Winnipeg has an extensive network of skywalks and tunnels downtown so that everyone can live like the Mole People in winter, I guess.

 

[saillias]

History will repeat itself.

Just like in the old barn, once the novelty wears thin, the combination of a small city, seats priced far too expensive for the average Winnipegger and a mediocre hockey team will lead to the same problem we had before.....MANY empty seats for weekday games.

But. the Maple Leafs wil always sellout when they come to town and get the loudest cheers!!

So the basics of your logic:
Everything will always happen the same way as it did in the past

Well, that explains why no one in Colorado or Minnesota appreciates their NHL team during the second go around. That explains the spontaneous party Winnipegers had downtown just from a Globe and Mail speculation article.

By the way, Winnipeg has about the same metro population as Calgary did in 1991.

 

[cbcwpg]

Good thing Winnipeg has an extensive network of skywalks and tunnels downtown so that everyone can live like the Mole People in winter, I guess.

And underground heated parking for $5.

 

[bluechipbonzo]

So wait, The owners want money to make sure they dont lose money in winnipeg.
Just like phoenix wanted and the owner they had lined up.
How is this any different? It isn't.


Now to explain in further.

If Atlanta lost 20million in a year that they averaged 15500 fans. How do you think the jets will do? Thats the stadium cap right there.

So you up ticket prices to 85 bucks a ticket, and maybe break even with the current payroll and expenses.

Then, after the team misses the playoffs after a normal meltdown, and the next year comes.
Then when the islanders come to town, it's minus 40 outside and 10000 people show up, you are doing worse then Atlanta was. Sure, offseat a full game when the oilers come into town. And you are still drawing less then the Thrashers were. Or when players don't want to come to Winnipeg.

Forget "winnipeg is growing and can support a team". Winnipeg's arena is not financially viable to hold a sportsteam, Fanbase or Not. 750,000 People that at least 400k of them have heard about hockey, or watched hockey.

But include skyrocketing living costs, and day to day costs. How is that viable?

38k Annual income for Winnipeg
42k for Atlanta

Average housing price for Atlanta : $223,876
Average for Winnipeg : $241,650

Add in the 5.5 Million population where there is roughly 2 million untapped, oblivious to the game of hockey in general and in Atlanta.
Compared to 300k in Winnipeg. It's a step back, Its several steps back. Not just for the NHL, but for hockey's growth as a sport. It's up to the NHL to grow the league in untapped markets, To make sure stable ownership is there, and not sell off teams because the league is standing with their hands behind their back for 7 years, and in the month the news of the team has to find an owner or be gone, they stand pat.

Winnipeg is a better market than Atlanta, simply because of the country it's located in, and more specifically, Atlanta is not in one of the US hockey hotbeds...the NHL never should have gone to Atlanta.

 

[Dado]

Why exactly would Canada's dollar go back down? Our dollar is tied to the price of oil since these days it's one of our biggest exports and the price of oil is going nowhere.

Price of oil is going to keep oscillating like a yoyo, as current levels are an enormous economic drain and will lead to more recession. We are barely two years removed from $40 crude, the idea that price is "going nowhere" is not supportable at all.

 

[saskganesh]

Canadian arrogance.

oh come on. Americans have no reason to call anyone else in the world arrogant.

... can we all be friends now?

 

[Hank Chinaski]

One common denominator that seems to tie all the anti-Winnipeg rhetoric together is optics. Namely, that it LOOKS bad:

a) Leaving a locale with a metro pop. of 5.3 million for 700K
b) Leaving such a large U.S TV market
c) Returning to a city that already had an NHL team that didn't do all that well financially
d) Playing in an arena with a capacity just north of 15K
e) Playing in Winnipeg, because you know...umm, it's Winnipeg! What a frozen ****hole! (sarcasm, if you can't tell)

That I can understand. The optics might not be appealing, I can give you that.

However, it baffles me how most of the anti-Winnipeg (or even lukewarm-Winnipeg) contingent, whenever these talking points are met with cold, hard facts, are completely unable to engage in rational discourse. Not saying all, but many that I've seen in this thread alone lay the herp-derp on so thick, it's not even worth debating. At this point, I've become convinced that many just can't get over the optics of it all.

Atlanta fans I completely understand. They're frustrated, just like I was when the Jets left for Phoenix. They can vent. All these neutral parties? Get over it. The NHL being in Winnipeg doesn't affect you one damn bit, and it's ludicrous to even start suggesting that it would affect the health of the NHL.

 

[blasted]

So the basics of your logic:
Everything will always happen the same way as it did in the past

Well, that explains why no one in Colorado or Minnesota appreciates their NHL team during the second go around. That explains the spontaneous party Winnipegers had downtown just from a Globe and Mail speculation article.

By the way, Winnipeg has about the same metro population as Calgary did in 1991.

The "spontaneous party" was lame and didn't set anybody back a couple of hundred bucks like a night at the MTS Centre will..

It''s easy to talk big here, lets see you open you wallet in 2014 after the novelty is long gone. Don't worry, the 9 dollar beers are gonna be worth it to watch the 9th place Jets face the Columbus Blue Jackets on the a cold Wednesday night in January.

 

[Alex The Loyal]

I demand that a mod IP check "blasted". I highly doubt he's from Canada

 

[berklon]

The "spontaneous party" was lame and didn't set anybody back a couple of hundred bucks like a night at the MTS Centre will..

It''s easy to talk big here, lets see you open you wallet in 2014 after the novelty is long gone. Don't worry, the 9 dollar beers are gonna be worth it to watch the 9th place Jets face the Columbus Blue Jackets on the a cold Wednesday night in January.

The novelty hasn't worn off in Edmonton or Toronto, even though they've iced some horrible teams.

And can you stop pretending to be from Canada? You're not fooling anyone.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

I demand that a mod IP check "blasted". I highly doubt he's from Canada

Mods might want to check his IP for different reasons.

He's definitely from Troll-land, regardless of whether or not he's Canadian.

 

[saillias]

The "spontaneous party" was lame and didn't set anybody back a couple of hundred bucks like a night at the MTS Centre will..

It''s easy to talk big here, lets see you open you wallet in 2014 after the novelty is long gone. Don't worry, the 9 dollar beers are gonna be worth it to watch the 9th place Jets face the Columbus Blue Jackets on the a cold Wednesday night in January.

Internet poster blasted declares Winnipeg celebrations "lame." Thanks for the input, you're not even trying now.

Well as you can see from my location, I am a Calgarian. I am a Calgary Flames fan. I've been a season ticket holder since 98.

 

[berklon]

Check out his post history. Mods might want to check his IP for different reasons.

He's definitely from Troll-land, regardless of whether or not he's Canadian.

Definitely a troll.

His post count has been increasing VERY slowly as he's only at 45... and I've seen him post a lot. That's because he's had MANY of his posts deleted for trolling.

 

[cbcwpg]

The "spontaneous party" was lame and didn't set anybody back a couple of hundred bucks like a night at the MTS Centre will..

It''s easy to talk big here, lets see you open you wallet in 2014 after the novelty is long gone. Don't worry, the 9 dollar beers are gonna be worth it to watch the 9th place Jets face the Columbus Blue Jackets on the a cold Wednesday night in January.

The fact that you use the word "novelty" points to not being Canadian as other posters suspect. I don't care where you are from, but hockey in Canada is not a "novelty", it is a religion. And here we go to see the home team play regardless of who the visitor is.

 

[Alex The Loyal]

He also says no one will go because it's cold or something like that. It's cold in all the Canadian Hockey cities. And yet we all go and sell out the joint. How would Winnipeg be any different?

 

[OthmarAmmann]

Good thing Winnipeg has an extensive network of skywalks and tunnels downtown so that everyone can live like the Mole People in winter, I guess.

Sounds more like Toronto's PATH than Winnipeg's skywalks.

 

[Gump Hasek]

If you actually believe that..then your not at all involved with any kids hockey program.

Believe what? The factual statistics that prove male hockey registration in Canada is growing rather than contracting as was claimed?

Wow.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Winnipeg will not add a single fan to the aggregate NHL base. Not turn on a single more telelvision, sell more merchandise, grow the market, telelvision or otherwise, in the future. In fact exactly the opposite as what Thrasher fans there were walk away. Winnipeg will cannabalize from fans of other canadian franchises, not create a single thing but a one time franchise fee which will put a couple million dollars in each of the other owner's pockets.

And that is nothing to be happy about if you are a NHL fan, and is exactly the reason Bettman, who is charged with growing the game, was so loathe to move teams north rather than south.