Blue Jays Discussion: New players, new uniform, new thread

[phillipmike]

I defended them last year but you have a product people want to see, there needs to be more televised games. It’s a poor business model;

From another poster.

Home team televising games:

The Blue Jays tie with the Indians for the least amount of spring training home games televised, which includes the two games in Montreal. With a newly renovated ballpark and an improved team from last year its a shame that Sportsnet does so few spring training broadcasts.

 

[phillipmike]

Sale will start the season on the DL meaning he won’t start opening day vs the Jays.

Barring injury we are likely facing Eduardo Rodriguez on opening day, likely followed by Eovaldi and Perez.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I defended them last year but you have a product people want to see, there needs to be more televised games. It’s a poor business model;

From another poster.

Home team televising games:

View attachment 327903

Lmao

Nothing says "come on down to the ballpark and see your Jays" better than "go F yourself, Blue Jays fans".

 

[Discoverer]

I defended them last year but you have a product people want to see, there needs to be more televised games. It’s a poor business model;

From another poster.

Home team televising games:

View attachment 327903

It's ridiculous that they don't do more. Is the financial return really better for them by showing more mid-afternoon darts?

I would be curious to know how many games teams broadcast through the other team's feed. I think the Jays were at 16 total this year (so 4 of their own and 12 of the opponent's) which I thought was at least a step in the right direction.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

It's ridiculous that they don't do more. Is the financial return really better for them by showing more mid-afternoon darts?

I would be curious to know how many games teams broadcast through the other team's feed. I think the Jays were at 16 total this year (so 4 of their own and 12 of the opponent's) which I thought was at least a step in the right direction.

To be fair, if the game is already being broadcast by the opposing team's network, then it is financially prudent to simply use into that feed.

Its important for a small company, who doesn't specialize in Telecommunications, to make these kinds of wise financial decisions.

 

[Deebo]

I don't know if there is a large audience in Canada that are interested in watching mid-week early afternoon (in EST) spring training games.

 

[Discoverer]

I don't know if there is a large audience in Canada that are interested in watching mid-week early afternoon (in EST) spring training games.

Most Sportsnet channels are showing Sportsnet Central right now followed by a replay of last night's Buffalo/Colorado game. SN1 is showing the Buf/Col Game in 30 and then showing... the Buf/Col Game in 30 again. And then poker.

I can't imagine the audience being a whole lot less for a spring training game than it is for that kind of lineup. And, at the very least, this team looks like one that could start to develop a following in a real hurry. Rogers should probably be pushing them as much as possible right now. (Today, for example, is a close-to-normal Jays lineup with the star acquisition on the mound.)

 

[Deebo]

Most Sportsnet channels are showing Sportsnet Central right now followed by a replay of last night's Buffalo/Colorado game. SN1 is showing the Buf/Col Game in 30 and then showing... the Buf/Col Game in 30 again. And then poker.

I can't imagine the audience being a whole lot less for a spring training game than it is for that kind of lineup. And, at the very least, this team looks like one that could start to develop a following in a real hurry. Rogers should probably be pushing them as much as possible right now. (Today, for example, is a close-to-normal Jays lineup with the star acquisition on the mound.)

I'm thinking about the incremental increase in audience/ad revenue vs. the costs of production might not be worth it. I don't think airing spring training games are going to help attract fans who aren't already interested in the Blue Jays, only regular season winning will do that.

If there is no opposing broadcast, I can see why Rogers wouldn't bother with producing these games themselves, as much I would like to see Ryu today.

 

[phillipmike]

Not an eventful game for the Jays today. Down 3-1 in the 9th.

Jays have 1 hit and 1 walk. The hit was a bomb by McGuire and Biggio with the walk.

Ryu pitched 2 innings. A walk, 3 hits and an earned run with 2 strikeouts.

Edit: seems things happen when I’m critical of the Toronto sports teams. Jays ties it up 3-3 in the 9th. Ended in a tie.

 

[Canada4Gold]

So the Jays and Twins tie the Spring Training season series.... 0-0-2

 

[The Nemesis]

I'm frustrated by the lack of televised games and the lack of Jays broadcasts, but I also bet that the demand isn't that big for them. Joe and Jane Average Fan aren't likely to care too much to watch a mid-day weekday game starring mostly a bunch of B and C team nobodies and (to said average fan) unsexy prospects they won't likely even see again for a couple years, if at all.

Given the choice between airing reruns that carry minimal additional costs or producing a whole proper broadcast (to the level that would be sufficient for people not to loudly bitch and moan about "OMG this is such a garbage broadcast, why even bother if they're going to half-ass it so much?" Because you know damn well that, twitter being twitter, people will flip their shit like Rogers is committing war crimes over something as trivial as there not being a pitch counter or the camera angles being sub-optimal or not having proper stats for each hitter in a meaningless ST game) I can see the choice like this being made.

I don't like it. But I know that just like most others here, I'm part of the hardcore enough minority that would want to see these games. Most regular Jays fans I know can barely be arsed enough to care about regular season games before July, let alone spring training ones.

 

[phillipmike]

MLB.com released their top 30 prospects by team;

Prospect Rankings

Jays Top 30:
1. Nate Pearson
2. Jordan Groshans
3. Simeon Woods-Richardson
4. Alek Manoah
5. Alejandro Kirk
6. Orelvis Martinez
7. Gabriel Moreno
8. Miguel Hiraldo
9. Adam Kloffenstein
10. Anthony Kay
11. Kendall Williams
12. Eric Pardinho
13. Otto Lopez
14. Griffin Conine
15. Leonardo Jimenez
16. Estiven Machado
17. Dasan Brown
18. Rikelvin De Castro
19. Patrick Murphy
20. Reese McGuire
21. Anthony Alford
22. Santiago Espinal
23. Kevin Smith
24. Thomas Hatch
25. Julian Merryweather
26. Will Robertson
27. Riley Adams
28. Sem Robberse
29. Yennsy Diaz
30. Josh Winckowski

 

[The Nemesis]

I'm a little surprised that they're of the "Woods Richardson > Manoah" mindset, and I'm kinda sad to see Kloffenstein fall down to 9th like that (though I get it. he's kind of the least attractive of the notable pitching prospects because his numbers and pure stuff lack the blinding shininess of most of the other guys) but it's a decent list.

Because honestly, if the worst we can do is argue over who slots in what order past about #15 or so then it means we're in good shape.

 

[kb]

I'm a little surprised that they're of the "Woods Richardson > Manoah" mindset, and I'm kinda sad to see Kloffenstein fall down to 9th like that (though I get it. he's kind of the least attractive of the notable pitching prospects because his numbers and pure stuff lack the blinding shininess of most of the other guys) but it's a decent list.

Because honestly, if the worst we can do is argue over who slots in what order past about #15 or so then it means we're in good shape.

I think they are sleeping on Kloffenstein. Only 18 and to do so well in his first season.....I'm sure he has more upside. You saw him last season IIRC

 

[landy92mack29]

They wouldn't even have to broadcast it. Just have a stream on their twitter account with the stadium audio and I'd be happy

 

[Its not your fault]

I’m happy with 79/80 wins. I’m nervous about the OF though. Not a lot of consistency has been shown.

OF is easiest to luck into a hot bat and decent fielder. I'm optimistic.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I think Altuve, Bregman and Springer will be 1,2,3 in HBP this year by quite a margin. Like Reed Johnson x1000.

Oh I think they'll still get hit, but not 7 times in 3 games kind of hit.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Any early news out of the first few spring training games, asides from the fact that we can't actually watch them?

 

[Discoverer]

I'm a little surprised that they're of the "Woods Richardson > Manoah" mindset, and I'm kinda sad to see Kloffenstein fall down to 9th like that (though I get it. he's kind of the least attractive of the notable pitching prospects because his numbers and pure stuff lack the blinding shininess of most of the other guys) but it's a decent list.

Because honestly, if the worst we can do is argue over who slots in what order past about #15 or so then it means we're in good shape.

SWR over Manoah is consistent with most others, isn't it? Manoah was drafted high and flat-out dominated the few pro innings he pitched, but SWR is three years younger and has dominated at A and A+. For me, Manoah has quite a bit to prove to catch him.

 

[hd1344]

I can understand the lack of televising the weekday ST games, given their mid-day time, but come on, at least throw us a bone for the weekend dates. I can even understand picking up the opposing network's feed for road games.

Jays Spring training (pre-Montreal) has 10 weekend dates (5 home/5 away, discounting the SS day on March 15th), at least make the effort to televise at least those 5 home dates on weekends.

I'm all for any baseball on TV, but it's mildly frustrating to see how much other teams are doing vs. us

 

[phillipmike]

I'm a little surprised that they're of the "Woods Richardson > Manoah" mindset, and I'm kinda sad to see Kloffenstein fall down to 9th like that (though I get it. he's kind of the least attractive of the notable pitching prospects because his numbers and pure stuff lack the blinding shininess of most of the other guys) but it's a decent list.

Because honestly, if the worst we can do is argue over who slots in what order past about #15 or so then it means we're in good shape.

I see it more as the hitters like Kirk, Moreno, Martinez and Hiraldo rose than Kloffenstein fell. Those are 4 young, high upside bats that had great years.

 

[Anthrax442]

MLB.com released their top 30 prospects by team;

Prospect Rankings

Jays Top 30:
1. Nate Pearson
2. Jordan Groshans
3. Simeon Woods-Richardson
4. Alek Manoah
5. Alejandro Kirk
6. Orelvis Martinez
7. Gabriel Moreno
8. Miguel Hiraldo
9. Adam Kloffenstein
10. Anthony Kay
11. Kendall Williams
12. Eric Pardinho
13. Otto Lopez
14. Griffin Conine
15. Leonardo Jimenez
16. Estiven Machado
17. Dasan Brown
18. Rikelvin De Castro
19. Patrick Murphy
20. Reese McGuire
21. Anthony Alford
22. Santiago Espinal
23. Kevin Smith
24. Thomas Hatch
25. Julian Merryweather
26. Will Robertson
27. Riley Adams
28. Sem Robberse
29. Yennsy Diaz
30. Josh Winckowski

Can't believe Logan Warmoth can't crack top 30

 

[phillipmike]

Can't believe Logan Warmoth can't crack top 30

I have a better shot at our top 30 than Warmoth. He has been awful.

 

[landy92mack29]

I like the new layout of the prospects page on the mlb site

 

[phillipmike]

MLB.com released their top 30 prospects by team;

Prospect Rankings

Jays Top 30:
1. Nate Pearson
2. Jordan Groshans
3. Simeon Woods-Richardson
4. Alek Manoah
5. Alejandro Kirk
6. Orelvis Martinez
7. Gabriel Moreno
8. Miguel Hiraldo
9. Adam Kloffenstein
10. Anthony Kay
11. Kendall Williams
12. Eric Pardinho
13. Otto Lopez
14. Griffin Conine
15. Leonardo Jimenez
16. Estiven Machado
17. Dasan Brown
18. Rikelvin De Castro
19. Patrick Murphy
20. Reese McGuire
21. Anthony Alford
22. Santiago Espinal
23. Kevin Smith
24. Thomas Hatch
25. Julian Merryweather
26. Will Robertson
27. Riley Adams
28. Sem Robberse
29. Yennsy Diaz
30. Josh Winckowski

More information on the top 30;

Blue Jays
After ushering in a plethora of young talent to the Majors last year, it would be difficult for the Blue Jays to graduate nearly as many players from this year’s preseason Top 30 list before the season comes to a close, but the names remaining have plenty of clout in their own right. More »

1) Nate Pearson, RHP
2) Jordan Groshans, SS
3) Simeon Woods Richardson, RHP
Complete Top 30 list »

Here are the Blue Jays' 2020 Top 30 Prospects

After ranking fifth in the preseason last year among MLB’s top farm systems and 10th at the midseason mark, the Blue Jays will rank in the middle of the pack when this year’s rankings come out next week. Toronto’s dip is largely due to the number of top prospects who graduated from prospect status last year.

A little surprising as I still see a top 10 farm here.

Biggest jump/fall
Here are the players whose ranks changed the most from the 2019 preseason list to the 2020 preseason list:

Jump: Kirk (2019: 29 | 2020: 5) -- His natural hitting ability, incredible eye and good plate discipline helped the native of Mexico to his meteoric rise through the rankings, and despite his uncommon frame, his athleticism could help him stick behind the plate.**

Fall:** T.J. Zeuch, RHP (2019: 16 | 2020: NR) -- Despite pitching his way up to the Majors last season, the 2016 first-rounder was outshined by a number of other impressive right-handers in the system.

Best tools
Players are graded on a 20-80 scouting scale for future tools -- 20-30 is well below average, 40 is below average, 50 is average, 60 is above average and 70-80 is well above average. Players in parentheses have the same grade.

Hit: 60 -- Kirk
Power: 55 -- Griffin Conine (Groshans, Orelvis Martinez, Miguel Hiraldo, Kevin Smith, Will Robertson)
Run: 80 -- Dasan Brown
Arm: 60 -- Conine (Groshans, Martinez, Smith)
Defense: 60 -- McGuire (Brown, Rikelvin de Castro)
Fastball: 80 -- Pearson
Curveball: 60 -- Eric Pardinho (Murphy)
Slider: 60 -- Pearson
Changeup: 60 -- Merryweather
Control: 55 -- Pearson (Merryweather, Pardinho)

How they were built
Draft: 13 | International: 11 | Trade: 6

Breakdown by ETA
2020: 10 | 2021: 5 | 2022: 9 | 2023: 3 | 2024: 3

Breakdown by position
C: 4 | 1B: 0 | 2B: 1 | 3B: 0 | SS: 8 | OF: 4 | RHP: 12 | LHP: 1

Many here were calling for Kirks rise (not me), so good on you guys. He has been a pleasant surprise.

Conine has some big swing and miss but if he legit has great power and a strong arm then he is a perfect corner outfielder. Potentially a Jay Bruce type bat this FO has been after since 2016.

Pearson is just elite with the best fastball, slider and control in the system. Pardinho and Merryweather secretly have some top tools in the farm as well. Merryweather was surprising for me.

That second wave is coming and it coming fast with 24 of the top 30 coming within in the next 2 years.

A lot of SS in the system, many will move to other positions if they are truly going to make an impact in the majors. It includes moves the 2B and 3B... perhaps they should be thinking of moving 1 or 2 to the outfield now to get a head start on developing.