Need some Size: Bickell or Horton or Both

[WingsOverAvs]

Penner would be a much cheaper alternative to Horton, Malone, or Bickell, allowing DET to pursue another FA if they wanted

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Penner would be a much cheaper alternative to Horton, Malone, or Bickell, allowing DET to pursue another FA if they wanted

Bickell isn't going to be much cheaper, especially in terms of over-payment. If you're going to overpay, do you do it to a guy that has been in the top 6 his entire career with an even more solid playoff track record than the one year wonder?

If Horton is overpaid by a million in his demands, what does that say about Bickell especially if he hits around 5 million?

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Said 5.5 million to 6, have to be honest I would pay him that. Some of this is about your team structure and we can fit that in.

It isn't perfect, but if we can get the 5.5 I would take it, if he gets hurt he gets hurt. But he is a terrific fit for this team and we have some carefully managed assets. Why let the cap space just sit out there.

If they can get in on somebody bought out maybe it is different. But Horton is in his prime for this contract and he performs in the playoffs and provides a big body. His head concerns are what they are, there is risk, but there is considerable upside in our lineup to adding this particular player.

I also think the cap is going to grow, although the predictions of the Canadian dollar sagging to 90 cents on the dollar do give me some pause there. Still the Blackhawks owner said he expects a billion in revenue growth over the next three years, think of what that does for the cap.

I don't have an issue with 6 mil. It was the 6 years that made me cringe.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

Bickell isn't going to be much cheaper, especially in terms of over-payment. If you're going to overpay, do you do it to a guy that has been in the top 6 his entire career with an even more solid playoff track record than the one year wonder?

If Horton is overpaid by a million in his demands, what does that say about Bickell especially if he hits around 5 million?

Huh? Penner probably signs for 3m. Bickell for 4.5 if he leaves CHI (and I think he'll take less to stay). Horton is looking at 5m. My preference would be Penner > Bickell > Horton > Malone. Horton probably slides to #1 if not for his injury history

 

[bababooeyII]

Cowen and Latendresse were both healthy scratches for the majority of the year with Latendresse being eventually released.

Gryba was filling in for injuries and might be back in the AHL next year.

Kassian was brought in, and had minimal impact on their roster despite fighting other teams heavyweights.

Neil and Method are both big guys but are both also skilled at their positions.

At the end of the day though the average size between the Wings and Senators isn't that much.

The Senators average height and weight is 6'1 204lbs
The Wings average is 6'1 202lbs
While the Bruins are 6'1 201 lbs.

With fighting being phased out of the league there is less and less reason to carry a heavyweight, if some our guys start being abused maybe we bring one in, but I'd wait and see before wasting the roster spot on one.

what are you talking about? who said anything about bringing in a "heavyweight"?

 

[Bench]

Considered the rumored prices, I'm going to be awfully surprised if the Wings are in on any of them. They probably don't fit the long-term structure the Wings are looking to keep in place.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I don't have an issue with 6 mil. It was the 6 years that made me cringe.

28-34 years old, not exactly the worst years to have.

When you look for help in the UFA market this is what happens.

If we want size he is the guy I want. We have managed the cap close enough to pay this, that is entirely up to Kenny though.

 

[jhoops89]

Both.

 

[Boomhower]

Completely misread the title! Thought you meant or Booth? (as in David Booth)
And was thinkind Booth? really? Noooo thanks!

I like both these players, but have no interest in either. Bickell is a role player and is about to be payed like a skilled power forward.

Horton will be looking for term, but is too risky with his post concussion history. 1 or 2 years, sure, but 5 or 6? That scares me, Marc Savard is still being paid 5 mill a year for 2 more years.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

So I was talking to a Blues fan who was trying to convince me Chris Stewart was only worth 3m per. I laughed and said if thats the case then DET should jump all over an offer sheet which would cost a 1st + 3rd (as per last year....not sure if that went up or down this year) if he came in @ 4-5m. Obviously Holland doesnt like offer sheets, but Holland has never had a prospect pool as stocked as it is now where they could afford to burn a couple picks. Thoughts? Would you pull the trigger? How much is Stewart worth to you?

 

[PelagicJoe]

So I was talking to a Blues fan who was trying to convince me Chris Stewart was only worth 3m per. I laughed and said if thats the case then DET should jump all over an offer sheet which would cost a 1st + 3rd (as per last year....not sure if that went up or down this year) if he came in @ 4-5m. Obviously Holland doesnt like offer sheets, but Holland has never had a prospect pool as stocked as it is now where they could afford to burn a couple picks. Thoughts? Would you pull the trigger? How much is Stewart worth to you?

I live in STL, so the Blues are basically my second team. I'd take Stewart at 3 mil/year, but I'm not sure I would cough up a first AND a third to get him.
The Blues main problem is that they aren't going to be able to handle their payroll in the upcoming years. I will also go on record by saying that their great record from last season was a bit of a fluke.
If we were to offer sheet anyone in STL, I would want it to be Alex Pietrangelo. He reminds me of Lidstrom in many ways. He's obviously not as good, but who the hell is, right?

 

[WingsOverAvs]

I live in STL, so the Blues are basically my second team. I'd take Stewart at 3 mil/year, but I'm not sure I would cough up a first AND a third to get him.
The Blues main problem is that they aren't going to be able to handle their payroll in the upcoming years. I will also go on record by saying that their great record from last season was a bit of a fluke.
If we were to offer sheet anyone in STL, I would want it to be Alex Pietrangelo. He reminds me of Lidstrom in many ways. He's obviously not as good, but who the hell is, right?

I do believe I was mistaken. Its 1 + 2 + 3 I think. Stewart is still worth another 1.5m

 

[PelagicJoe]

I do believe I was mistaken. Its 1 + 2 + 3 I think. Stewart is still worth another 1.5m

That's too much (the picks) to give up for Stewart, IMO. I'd say he is worth, at most, 4 mil.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

That's too much (the picks) to give up for Stewart, IMO. I'd say he is worth, at most, 4 mil.

Probably too many picks (though DET is in a position where they could burn them). They could always try to trade for his rights if STL isnt going to sign him. A power forward with his skill is difficult to come by (Lucic makes 6m, Nash 7m+). He struggled his first year under Hitchcock, but in his other 3 seasons he scored 28 goals, 28 goals, and 18 (in a 48 game season). I'd gladly give him 4.5

 

[Henkka]

@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Bickell's deal is $16 M over 4 yrs

4.0 million caphit for Bickell. Chicago re-signed him.

 

[DatsDeking]

4.0 million caphit for Bickell. Chicago re-signed him.

Oh well, would have been nice to have though. Hawks had to drop Frolik and Bolland to make room for him though.

 

[SportsballChic]

Penner would be a much cheaper alternative to Horton, Malone, or Bickell, allowing DET to pursue another FA if they wanted

I wonder how the NHL would feel about us using free Little Ceasars pizzas to circumvent the salary cap. I bet we could get Penner to sign for like $100 a week if we included something like this:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/e...hicken-fingers-for-life-if-he-signs-with-mavs

(Jokes aside, you aren't a little worried about the fat/lazy thing? Not gonna lie, I don't stay up late to watch a lot of regular season Kings games)

 

[WingsOverAvs]

I wonder how the NHL would feel about us using free Little Ceasars pizzas to circumvent the salary cap. I bet we could get Penner to sign for like $100 a week if we included something like this:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/e...hicken-fingers-for-life-if-he-signs-with-mavs

(Jokes aside, you aren't a little worried about the fat/lazy thing? Not gonna lie, I don't stay up late to watch a lot of regular season Kings games)

I would have no reservations about Penner what so ever. He as solid for LA

 

[Yzerberg]

Guys, keep in mind that Horton's career year was 62 points and that was years ago. He has size and had an insane +/- this post season, but 6 years and 6m? For MAYBE 60 points? Very, very risky with his injury history.

Not advocating a Horton signing because of the injury history but 70 points might be realistic for him playing next to Datsyuk provided he can stay healthy.

Quote:
@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Bickell's deal is $16 M over 4 yrs

4.0 million caphit for Bickell. Chicago re-signed him.

Thank Gawd!

 

[Brick Top]

Quote:
@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Bickell's deal is $16 M over 4 yrs

4.0 million caphit for Bickell. Chicago re-signed him.

Thank Gawd!

I think that's a pretty good deal for the Hawks- $4M for 4 years for a 27 year old emerging power forward. Seemed like there was a lot of speculation that he'd get a $5M or higher cap hit, so I think $4M is pretty team-friendly.

Even if he only ends up being a 15-20 goal scorer, he'll be creating space for their skill guys. And he'll only be 31 by the end of this deal, so if he lights it up he can probably bank on another decent payday.

Oh well, would have been nice to have though. Hawks had to drop Frolik and Holland to make room for him though.

Pretty sure the Hawks wanted to get Bolland off their books whether or not they brought back Bickell. IMO they got more from the Leafs for him than they likely expected, and I think Toronto isn't getting the guy they hope they're getting.

 

[crashman]

Pretty sure the Hawks wanted to get Bolland off their books whether or not they brought back Bickell. IMO they got more from the Leafs for him than they likely expected, and I think Toronto isn't getting the guy they hope they're getting.

I think the Hawks made 2 great trades unloading Bolland and Frolik.

I'm not ready to jump on the "bash Holland bandwagon" like a good portion of the posters here, but it would be nice to see him get something for our garbage for a change.

Seriously, all he has to do is unload a couple players to make this a decent off-season. I don't care if he just buys them out or loses a guy like Emmerton to waivers, it just needs to happen.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

I think the Hawks made 2 great trades unloading Bolland and Frolik.

I'm not ready to jump on the "bash Holland bandwagon" like a good portion of the posters here, but it would be nice to see him get something for our garbage for a change.

Seriously, all he has to do is unload a couple players to make this a decent off-season. I don't care if he just buys them out or loses a guy like Emmerton to waivers, it just needs to happen.

I suspect he wants to keep Emmerton around in case Helm isnt ready to go...and thats fine....his cap hit is negligible. But 3 of the 4 of Tootoo, Sammy, Quincey/Coli, and possibly Eaves need to be moved

 

[crashman]

I suspect he wants to keep Emmerton around in case Helm isnt ready to go...and thats fine....his cap hit is negligible. But 3 of the 4 of Tootoo, Sammy, Quincey/Coli, and possibly Eaves need to be moved

That's fine, Emmerton isn't a bad 4th line center, but my real hope is that Andersson would take Emmerton's place and they'll sign a top 6 center to replace Filppula, like Weiss or Vinny.

Then we have D, Z, Helm, Andersson, and Weiss/Vinny. That would be ideal because obviously D and Z are fine on the wings as well. I think Andersson is slightly better than Emmerton already, but it's not a huge difference.

Edit: plus Sheahan could easily replace Emmerton if Helm isn't available.

 

[ricky0034]

I would have no reservations about Penner what so ever. He as solid for LA

how can you have no reservations about a guy that had 18 goals/55 points in 161 games(regular season+playoffs) while he was on the Kings?

Dustin Penner is terrible

 

[crashman]

how can you have no reservations about a guy that had 18 goals/55 points in 161 games(regular season+playoffs) while he was on the Kings?

Dustin Penner is terrible

I still he's worth the risk, but only if he's coming cheap (sub $2.5m, short-term)

But like I said before, I wouldn't campaign for the guy, he's a reclamation project and a little bit of a risk. but it could pay of big time if he worked out.