Confirmed with Link: MTL/WSH/CHI Lars Eller for two 2nd round picks. Two 2nd round picks for Andrew Shaw

[TheBlindFan]

Andrew Shaw is a true playoff warrior. He younger and cause the hab a delay of a year of 2nd round pick plus Eller.

Shaw > Eller

Until we know the salary and the term, we cannot complain.

 

[badbrains]

Non of the players you stated were a 24 year old cup winner , not even in his prime.

No?

Gomez was super young in 1999 and Gionta as well in 2003, both cup winners with the Devils.

Moen was 24 with the Ducks....

Past history does not guarantee future success.

 

[V13]

Correct me if i'm wrong but the Habs have 3 x 2nd next year right ? Wsh pick + Weise pick + Habs own pick ?

 

[Adam Spylo]

Correct me if i'm wrong but the Habs have 3 x 2nd next year right ? Wsh pick + Weise pick + Habs own pick ?

That's in 2018

 

[jaffy27]

Correct me if i'm wrong but the Habs have 3 x 2nd next year right ? Wsh pick + Weise pick + Habs own pick ?

Two 2nd round picks next year and 3 the next

 

[scrubadam]

6 millions but you need at least another 13 forward (in my calculation) and that will eat $650.000...then it's more around 5,4 millions left for that top forward. Not a plug, not a Perron, not a Weise...but a top forward.

Mb's saying:

1- We're building throught the draft = He just traded two of the best draft picks he had in years for a 3rd liner.
2- I don't like to overpay on july 1st = He's about to overpay for a 3rd liner and it's not even on the UFA
3- I don't make trades just to make trades = This is exactly what he did

Hawks had 6,6M available for 4 players (mostly depth signing)....if Shaw asked for 3-3.5M he would be a Hawks....so he wants more than that, unless the Hawks didn't think he was THAT good

TWO THINGS:
1- If Shaw gets 1$ more than Gallagher, then it's a bad trade, bad signing and letting Eller go was a mistake
2- If he don't sign a QUALITY top 6 forwards on the UFA, then this will be a very bad trade and signing.

We'll know about it in 7 days

We will know in 7 days. Lets see what Shaw is paid. If it is the same as Eller or less than no harm no fould and actually an upgrade. If its more then complain away.

He traded 2 2nds, but got them back. Sometimes you have to give to get. They were 39th and 45th but its been said this is not a good draft. I will trust Timmins and MB evaluation of the draft. We get those picks back and over the next two years fans will be ecstatic that we have more 2nd round picks and will forget about this year.

He didn't make trades just to make trades, he likes Shaw. Its the player he wanted to due his pedigree. So he got his player and recouped the cost. It's as if you gave me 5 bucks and over the next two years I will pay you back. You don't have 5$ today, but in 2 years you will. You didn't lose anything.

 

[CHwest]

MB's motto, you can never have to many bottom six players.

 

[ECWHSWI]

Andrew Shaw is a true playoff warrior. He younger and cause the hab a delay of a year of 2nd round pick plus Eller.

Shaw > Eller

Until we know the salary and the term, we cannot complain.

Shaw, who is now an amazing character guy and a much much better player than Eller according to MB followers is also...

somebody nobody cared about on the Habs board up until yesterday night...

wonder why ?

 

[scrubadam]

I'll hold you to that. I've been waiting since 2012 for the GM to add permanent, long term scoring help and I'm still waiting...

Please do I have no problem with criticizing MB. Will others on this board change their tune if MB signs a top 6? Or if the team is top in the NHL next year? I doubt it. Most will continue with their anti-MB tirades.

There's a reason it's desirable to pick higher than the next team. That "nit picking" between 5 or 10 spots up or down can be the difference between a stud and a dud. Our prospect depth is weak at best and waiting an extra year or two to replenish it is not a luxury we can afford right now.

We are on a prospect board so its impossible to argue about the value of draft picks here. We will just have to agree to disagree. IMHO 2nd round is 2nd rounder. Who knows what will happen with Washington. MB traded those 2nds and got back other 2nds to replace them. Moving from 39th and 45th to 55th twice and getting Shaw is worth it to me. 2nd rounders have a 30% chance or less to make the NHL, Shaw has already scored 20G in the NHL.

We all know DD has no trade value. Is that a reason to trade the better player? Is the team better with Eller or DD at center? I feel Eller is the stronger player. So admit the error and buyout DD. Cut your losses. MB has not shown he can admit mistakes so instead the team keeps the inferior player to appease the coach and media.

Buying out DD would not get us 2 2nd rounders. MB wanted Shaw and he wanted 2nd rounders. The only option was to trade Eller. Stop making this an Eller vs DD thing it has nothing to do with DD and everything to do with the fact that Eller was able to return 2 2nd rounders. If DD was worth even 1 2nd rounder I am sure he would of been traded first. Nothing about appeasing the media or the coach.

Eller was clearly disliked by the coach. In a new environment he may thrive, he may not. Time will tell.

Source? Don't tell me based on what you see or how much he plays him or because he favors DD. Actual Source that Eller is disliked by MT not speculation or misconstrude quotes. Eller was what he was a 3rd liner. He got more offense opp this year and he didn't do much with it. Would I prefer Eller over DD for sure. Would I prefer 2 2nd rounders over Eller, I think so since we have Shaw and alot of other options for the 3c role.

No, he doesn't have any cup rings. So what? We had Gomez, Gionta, Gill, Moen, Ryder, there are more I'm sure, who all had cup rings. Didn't help much, did it?

Well we did get to an ECF with most of those players, and a 2nd with some of them so I can say it did help? Again we may disagree but I have been saying it since the season ended this team needed to add leadership, specifically someone with cup experience. I thought we would get some over the hill UFA but if we get a young player who can still improve with those rings I am happier about that. Rather take a Shaw then an over the hill UFA or PTO player.

If you don't think this team needs a player with cup experience then fine, its something I think was lacking on this team.

 

[yianik]

Yet MB comes out and says he is not trading PK. Been saying that since the end of year presser. Yet still on this board we had a 40 page thread about how MB is trading PK and its all a ruse and dragging his name through the mud.

Sorry disease seems to be on this board. If people will go so far to misinterpret MB's words to fit a specific narrative don't know how I can not say most of the complaints on this aren't painted by a biased hate against MB.

If MB doesn't add another forward then complaints can be warranted, but like the PC thread lots of chicken littles running around right now.

MT is not a fan of PK. MB does not think PK is worth what he is paid. MT and MB are tied at the hip.

The 40 pages have to do with :
1. We are Habs fans and we crash the board on a 3rd liner trade
2. We are Habs fans and have had decades of GM ineptitude
3. We do not trust MB to not do something stupid given his view and his coaches view of PK
4. Add it up, fear, absolute fear as faith in management largely does not exist.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

Shaw, who is now an amazing character guy and a much much better player than Eller according to MB followers is also...

somebody nobody cared about on the Habs board up until yesterday night...

wonder why ?

He's been brought up before by many posters..

 

[scrubadam]

- trades don't happen in a vacuum... It's not simply a question of value, it's also a matter of fit/need/cap impact.

Well no one else was tanoging so far. MB can't force GM's to move players if they don't want. EDM/VAN wanted PK but the couldn't force MB to move him. If a top6 was moved then sure you could say we could of done the deal, but none were moved. Unless you wanted MB to trade our 1st for TT/Rychel?

- trading one of our best possession fwds, who is also our only C over 6' (and I'm not a bull on size for size sake), who is on a very resonable deal for what he provides & who has clearly been negatively impacted by how our coach uses him.... For 2 late (likely) 2nds.... Ok value, bad trade given our needs.

Best forwards? Are you talking about Eller? Thats a stretch and he is barely better than DD. Take out a few inches from Eller and give him a french last name and he would be on the s**t list too. Now I did like Eller as a tweener player but I don't expect him to score more than 15 G's or so. He was the only one with value and MB wanted to recoup his 2nds.

- trading 2 high 2nd round picks, for a bottom-6 winger (all intangible accolades aside, shaw was a sub15min player for the Hawks, sub 14min these recent PO's...) who is an RFA looking to cash in... Mediocre trade value, very bad fit for our needs/situation.

So trading Eller is good value, but trading the same for Shaw who is younger, scored more goals so far (20) and has 2 rings is mediocre? Why because one is coming here and the other is leaving? Lets see what he is paid first before talking about his contract. He fit's our needs better which is on the wing since we have a lot of C (AG/Plek/DD/Daneault/Hudon/McCarron/JDR/Mitchel).

Is adding Shaw, the hockey player, a "bad" thing? Of course not. I'm sure I'll love watching him compete for us (provided his pay day doesn't take away from his fearless approach).

Did our GM do a good job of managing the assets at his disposal to improve the roster & organization? I don't think he has, even in the slightest. We are worse off today, current roster & flexibility moving forward) than we were yesterday morning. We need a GM capable of moving us in a net positive direction.

Worse off today? first off Shaw has not signed a contract yet so we are +1.5 Mill on the cap TODAY (which you wrote). When he gets paid we can talk about his contract. Shaw is better than Eller. Eller is 28 and was not going to be more than what he was here. Shaw is 24 and still has a chance to improve no matter how small it is. Not to mention he actually has scored 20G once in his career something Eller never accomplished. And Shaw brings cup experience. Shaw in Eller out is an improvment. MB lost 2 2nds, and then got them back, how is that bad job of managing the assets? Sure if everything MB does has to be looked at as negative you can pick away at this he move 45th pick for 55th pick etc. Objectivly though MB upgraded Eller with a younger Shaw and got back the 2nds he traded for Shaw. If anything at worst we are even as of TODAY.

 

[scrubadam]

Will be amazed if Shaw can produce close to his career best while being centred by Danault next season...

Eller's production, when usage is considered, was very good/great for a bottom six fwd, shaw will be extremely hard pressed to match if used at all similarly.

Shaw played 13-15min, good for 7th-8th in ice time for Hawks. Bottom six minutes even despite getting time on top6 lines.

Does he rise to challenge/opportunity of bigger role with us... Or does he get exposed as a guy who looked better thanks to playing behind one of the best top-6 fwd groups in the league?

Time will tell...

Time will tell and I am not going to go out on a limb and say that Shaw will be a 25 G scorer, but the argument often on this board is give Eller more time and linemates and he will produce. So why is that held against one player but demanded for another?

 

[Canadienna]

I think I could live with 4m per year for 4 years,
Or 3.5m per for 6

 

[scrubadam]

MT is not a fan of PK. MB does not think PK is worth what he is paid. MT and MB are tied at the hip.

The 40 pages have to do with :
1. We are Habs fans and we crash the board on a 3rd liner trade
2. We are Habs fans and have had decades of GM ineptitude
3. We do not trust MB to not do something stupid given his view and his coaches view of PK
4. Add it up, fear, absolute fear as faith in management largely does not exist.

So all speculation on your part? How do you know MT is not a fan of PK? Why does he play him almost 30 mins a game and constantly giving him the most PP time? Because he said some comments 5 years ago on A/C so people cant change their minds especially when the work and know someone personally?

MB does not think PK is worth what he is paid? Again you know this how? Where has MB indicated this?

Or is this more interpretation like the PC thread where MB was clearly saying he was NOT TRADING PK yet posters on this board know better than MB and what he is saying and put words in his mouth that he was 100% trading PK and dragging his name through the mud. Sorry after that thread its pretty hard to take peoples interpretations of what they think they know seriously. Bring up actual proof that MT and MB don't like PK and think he is over payed not hearsay or your own interpretation.

Ya HF crashed because everyone wants to come out of the word work and complain about MB. When another team trades for a player bash MB. If MB trades or signs a player, bash MB. If the fans have no faith in MB thats fine can have your own opinon I don't think I or anyone can change that. I just don't see the reason to complain about things that have not happend yet. We didn't give Shaw a big contract and we have not struck out at UFA yet. When those happen crash HF and complain away I will join you. Until then whats the point? There is already 10000's of pages of negativity on the board.

 

[David Suzuki]

Shaw, who is now an amazing character guy and a much much better player than Eller according to MB followers is also...

somebody nobody cared about on the Habs board up until yesterday night...

wonder why ?

Damn. You've stumped us. People care more about players on our team then players on another team. Shock. Of. The. Century.

 

[WG]

I think I could live with 4m per year for 4 years,
Or 3.5m per for 6

We've spent two years lamenting the overpayment for marginal players and scheming ways to get rid of them. Paying Price or PK is not what kills the cap, it's the $4M to Emelin, $3.5 to DD etc when comparable players are available for less.

Give Shaw $4M long term and we have a new contract we'll be aiming to rid ourselves of in short order. I like some of the elements that Shaw brings but fact is he is career 0.4 ppg and it doesn't make sense to give this kind of player big dollars and term. I am expecting 6/$24M, hope I am wrong. He should be quite a bit below Gallagher's salary; Gallagher does the same heart and soul/agitator bit but he's 10-15 points per season better than Shaw. $3M AAV and the trade is tolerable.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

I'm just happy braindead Eller is gone. Shaw is younger and better at everything.

 

[Natey]

We've spent two years lamenting the overpayment for marginal players and scheming ways to get rid of them. Paying Price or PK is not what kills the cap, it's the $4M to Emelin, $3.5 to DD etc when comparable players are available for less.

Give Shaw $4M long term and we have a new contract we'll be aiming to rid ourselves of in short order. I like some of the elements that Shaw brings but fact is he is career 0.4 ppg and it doesn't make sense to give this kind of player big dollars and term. I am expecting 6/$24M, hope I am wrong. He should be quite a bit below Gallagher's salary; Gallagher does the same heart and soul/agitator bit but he's 10-15 points per season better than Shaw. $3M AAV and the trade is tolerable.

So less money than the player he was basically traded for and it's just tolerable?

 

[yianik]

So all speculation on your part? How do you know MT is not a fan of PK? Why does he play him almost 30 mins a game and constantly giving him the most PP time? Because he said some comments 5 years ago on A/C so people cant change their minds especially when the work and know someone personally?

MB does not think PK is worth what he is paid? Again you know this how? Where has MB indicated this?

Or is this more interpretation like the PC thread where MB was clearly saying he was NOT TRADING PK yet posters on this board know better than MB and what he is saying and put words in his mouth that he was 100% trading PK and dragging his name through the mud. Sorry after that thread its pretty hard to take peoples interpretations of what they think they know seriously. Bring up actual proof that MT and MB don't like PK and think he is over payed not hearsay or your own interpretation.

Ya HF crashed because everyone wants to come out of the word work and complain about MB. When another team trades for a player bash MB. If MB trades or signs a player, bash MB. If the fans have no faith in MB thats fine can have your own opinon I don't think I or anyone can change that. I just don't see the reason to complain about things that have not happend yet. We didn't give Shaw a big contract and we have not struck out at UFA yet. When those happen crash HF and complain away I will join you. Until then whats the point? There is already 10000's of pages of negativity on the board.

Really ? Are you really asking me about MT and MB on PK ?

MT benches PK (and Patches, but he blew the play) against Colorado for an individualistic play. That is PK, he makes individualistic plays because he is high end talent, coaches should encourage and develop it, but not MT.

MB would not pay PK the $ at arbitration, it took Molson to step in, so obviously MB thought it was too much.

And I did not say MB was trading PK. The question was why there were 40 pages. Posters went into a tizz . If they trusted MB on PK, there would not have been 40 pages as it would have been dismissed as stupid. Also, as Habs fans we spaz out. And we have 20 years of reasons .

Clear enough for you ?

By the way, I am one of a minority who has not written MB off, but getting close. Still open to see what happens July 1.

 

[Sorinth]

So less money than the player he was basically traded for and it's just tolerable?

Considering many felt Eller was overpaid and it's highly questionable whether Shaw is actually a better player, then yeah I can see why people would only find the move good if he makes less money then Eller.

 

[Mad Brills*]

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

I'd love for it to be less than 4 per but are we really going to rip MB's head off if it's more just because it's more than Gally's?

Gally I'm sure is easily in the top 10 best contracts in the NHL. Probably top 5. Can't remember the blithering idiot who signed him to that contract.

If he gets rid of DD and adds another top 6 forward then it'll be fine.

MB's harshest detractors pick apart every move they don't like with a fine tooth comb and show a million different angles with dubious contexts how it's the 'worst move ever' yet marginalize every good move he makes.

 

[Deebs]

Lock'em up for six. Guy's a beauty

 

[SB164]

I think that's just BS. Dreger seems like the type of guy that literally says anything that he hears from around the league.

Shaw isn't going to get Gallagher-like term before ever playing a single game for the Habs.