TSN: Mikheyev

[All Mod Cons]

It wouldn't matter to me if this team had 35 million in cap space paying Mikyehev 4+ million is ridiculous. You can find players that do what he does for less than that.

For sure you can. We just don't find them very often. Most of them are pretty useless. Other than Ilya, our European FA signings have been a waste of everyone's time. And the vast majority of our UFA signings have been pointless.

 

[shortfuze]

If this is anything like what we tried with Hyman it'll go hilariously bad. I hope we learned from that and decided to not ask for a 3rd round pick for basically nothing again

But it wasn’t nothing though. Why did Edmonton get to dictate the value on a trade. If you want cap space you need to pay.

 

[Nineteen67]

If there's market competition for the guy, a team trading a late pick for exclusive negotiation rights for a few days could be worth it for them.

It's rare but does happen from time to time

Would teams get in a bidding war to sign Mik?

Maybe someone pays a 7th to get him signed to have that piece of the roster covered before the draft/FA season.

 

[rocketman588]

But it wasn’t nothing though. Why did Edmonton get to dictate the value on a trade. If you want cap space you need to pay.

Because Edmonton had all the leverage as evidenced by them saying f*** it and giving us nothing.

There's a difference between needing to dump him and just adding 500k to his number when it's not on the roster.

It will most likely be a benefit overall to them in the long run as they won't need to have him there for year 8.

Would teams get in a bidding war to sign Mik?

Maybe someone pays a 7th to get him signed to have that piece of the roster covered before the draft/FA season.

If we get anything higher then a 6 I'll tip my cap to dubas.

NHL teams don't usually give up big value for UFAs rights especially ones like mik. Maybe jack would get more who knows

 

[Nineteen67]

Mik is probably getting 4.5

 

[rocketman588]

Mik is probably getting 4.5

Most likely.

Interesting deal for Paul idk if he's worth that

 

[ACC1224]

Most likely.

Interesting deal for Paul idk if he's worth that

Very few are worth what they get as UFA.

 

[ToneDog]

Most likely.

Interesting deal for Paul idk if he's worth that

Who would you rather have for $21+m if Mik gets 4.5x5?? Paul all day for me.

 

[shortfuze]

Because Edmonton had all the leverage as evidenced by them saying f*** it and giving us nothing.

There's a difference between needing to dump him and just adding 500k to his number when it's not on the roster.

It will most likely be a benefit overall to them in the long run as they won't need to have him there for year 8.



If we get anything higher then a 6 I'll tip my cap to dubas.

NHL teams don't usually give up big value for UFAs rights especially ones like mik. Maybe jack would get more who knows

They had no leverage. Toronto wasn’t re-signing him so why help another team if they aren’t gonna even meet in the middle. Dubas isn’t a lucky isn’t gonna take just what’s thrown his way.

 

[Mess]

Best Bang for your Salary Cap Buck !!!! ** Cap management 101 **

2021-21 stats
=========
John Tavares ........ 79 games .. 27 goals .. $11 mil AAV = $407,400 cap $ consumption per goal.
Ilya Mikheyev ...... 53 games .. 21 goals .. $ 1.645 mil AAV = $78,333 cap $ consumption per goal.
Michael Bunting ..79 games .. 23 goals .. $950k AAV = $41,304 cap $ consumption per goal.

Last season a JT goal cost the Leafs $400k of Cap, a Mikheyev goal at $78K and Bunting goal $41K, with Leafs getting much better value per goal from the bottom end of the roster.

First Kadri, then Hyman, now Mikheyev and next year Bunting all forced off the Leafs roster for salary cap reasons, because Leafs can no longer afford these higher cap value productive players because they have so much invested in JT among others. Leafs can only afford depth players making $1.5 mil or less but once their contracts are up and you have to pay for their production, you have to move on from them.

 

[rocketman588]

Who would you rather have for $21+m if Mik gets 4.5x5?? Paul all day for me.

Rather neither at the cost or Paul at his price for 1/2 years

I think a 2/2.5 mil a year player at the level of both of them is something that is something we can get if that's something we want to spend money on

Very few are worth what they get as UFA.

Yeah agreed. Shows how important all the picks we've thrown away might have been

 

[rocketman588]

They had no leverage. Toronto wasn’t re-signing him so why help another team if they aren’t gonna even meet in the middle. Dubas isn’t a lucky isn’t gonna take just what’s thrown his way.

The oilers signed him anyways for a very short aav bump and we got nothing

We turned down the opportunity to get an asset to "not help" a team that's not even in our conference when the help was a fairly insignificant amount of money.

It'll be the same thing in this case if we ask for something dumb everyone will just tell us no and we'll get nothing

 

[shortfuze]

The oilers signed him anyways for a very short aav bump and we got nothing

We turned down the opportunity to get an asset to "not help" a team that's not even in our conference when the help was a fairly insignificant amount of money.

It'll be the same thing in this case if we ask for something dumb everyone will just tell us no and we'll get nothing

Dubas was willing to help them. Doesn’t mean Edmonton gets to dictate what they will give Toronto. If Edmonton wasn’t willing to meet in the middle than screw them. I wouldn’t help them either. Toronto isn’t a charity case.

 

[deprw]

The oilers signed him anyways for a very short aav bump and we got nothing

We turned down the opportunity to get an asset to "not help" a team that's not even in our conference when the help was a fairly insignificant amount of money.

It'll be the same thing in this case if we ask for something dumb everyone will just tell us no and we'll get nothing

Trading negotiation rights is one thing, but signing player first and lowering the cap hit is another. There is certain price on the market for that and it was right call from Dubas not to negotiate on that. If Holland wants to gain advantage and lower cap hit, then you can't walk over another teams GM.

Next time we don't get low balled that easily, because another team knows that we aren't desperate.

 

[hotpaws]

Dubas was willing to help them. Doesn’t mean Edmonton gets to dictate what they will give Toronto. If Edmonton wasn’t willing to meet in the middle than screw them. I wouldn’t help them either. Toronto isn’t a charity case.

yup f*** them , getting nothing is much better than a 6th rd pick

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

The official cut off day is actually trade deadline day, and only the team that owns his rights after that time and can sign him to 8 year term is his is original team.

That is why Toronto had to be the signing team and then trading him to Edmonton thereafter, the only way the 8th year was a possibility.

I did not know about the trade deadline date affecting UFA's. I thought it was mostly about just being under contract with the current team when the player hits UFA. Good to know. In that case I don't blame Dubas for asking for more than a 6th.

 

[Racer88]

Most likely.

Interesting deal for Paul idk if he's worth that

Most likely not worth it but he sure was dam good in the playoffs…….something we sorely lack

Who would you rather have for $21+m if Mik gets 4.5x5?? Paul all day for me.

No question it’s Paul

 

[shortfuze]

yup f*** them , getting nothing is much better than a 6th rd pick

Glad you understand

 

[Nylanderthal]

Even if we had 50 million in cap space I wouldn't sign him

He has 0 goals on a goalie in his last 19 playoff games, he's not particularly physical either. Cut bait and let someone overpay him, they will regret it

This is the correct answer. The truth is they could easily afford to keep him by moving out some of the expected riff raff from the team (kerfoot Holl mrazek), it’s just we’ve seen what he’s capable of here and it’s not what the team needs so moving on is the right move regardless of cap space

 

[Stephen]

Mik is probably getting 4.5

Why would Mik be worth 33% more than Paul? Hope we're not paying the premium.

 

[Stephen]

Trading negotiation rights is one thing, but signing player first and lowering the cap hit is another. There is certain price on the market for that and it was right call from Dubas not to negotiate on that. If Holland wants to gain advantage and lower cap hit, then you can't walk over another teams GM.

Next time we don't get low balled that easily, because another team knows that we aren't desperate.

Those sign and trade scenarios feel like more of a courtesy/convenience thing than a hard up negotiation in the NHL. Like oh well, we couldn't get the 8 years from Toronto. Leafs have no leverage in any case. Would be fine to just have an extra marginal asset than none.

 

[BTP]

if you get rid of him then you gotta bring in someone just as fast. we cant be getting any slower. our bottom 6 is already slow as hell with the grey beards.

 

[fahad203]

if you get rid of him then you gotta bring in someone just as fast. we cant be getting any slower. our bottom 6 is already slow as hell with the grey beards.

Spezza is not coming back. Simmonds shouldn't have played at all. There goes your problem with being slow

Speed isn't everything.

 

[deprw]

Those sign and trade scenarios feel like more of a courtesy/convenience thing than a hard up negotiation in the NHL. Like oh well, we couldn't get the 8 years from Toronto. Leafs have no leverage in any case. Would be fine to just have an extra marginal asset than none.

Would other team help us for basicly free? Probably not, so if you're going to help by lowering cap hit, you should get something back. I think our ask was the common price and Oilers tried to low ball.

This is always this same discussion. If Dubas is hard on negotiations it's wrong, but he gives up he should be harder. Look CBJ and Jarmo, he gets his price everytime, because he has his ask and either you pay or you don't. No discounts. If you start giving discounts, you'll never build that hard line.

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

Kadri wasn't traded because of cap reasons.

Best Bang for your Salary Cap Buck !!!! ** Cap management 101 **

2021-21 stats
=========
John Tavares ........ 79 games .. 27 goals .. $11 mil AAV = $407,400 cap $ consumption per goal.
Ilya Mikheyev ...... 53 games .. 21 goals .. $ 1.645 mil AAV = $78,333 cap $ consumption per goal.
Michael Bunting ..79 games .. 23 goals .. $950k AAV = $41,304 cap $ consumption per goal.

Last season a JT goal cost the Leafs $400k of Cap, a Mikheyev goal at $78K and Bunting goal $41K, with Leafs getting much better value per goal from the bottom end of the roster.

First Kadri, then Hyman, now Mikheyev and next year Bunting all forced off the Leafs roster for salary cap reasons, because Leafs can no longer afford these higher cap value productive players because they have so much invested in JT among others. Leafs can only afford depth players making $1.5 mil or less but once their contracts are up and you have to pay for their production, you have to move on from them.