Dreger: Matt Duchene Mega-thread:Habs, NSH, NYI inquired - Part II

[Ice Crusher]

I don't know, it feels like a situation where there's SOME pressure. They're basically a lock for the best odds for #1 this year in a weaker draft than usual, there has to be some sort of feeling that "something needs to change". It might be because if this were the Isles, our fans would just be like "screw it, keep McKinnon but otherwise blow it all up", lol.

And like Sakic said: He's not going to make a deal to make a deal. The trade in question needs to make the organisation better. Some offers thrown out there isn't going to make our organsation better with losing Duchene and getting what were getting offered for him...

 

[webersshot]

And kiss the next couple years of Pacioretty and Price goodbye?
At some point you have to stop waiting for the next guy in line to be ready and pull the trigger on a run.
We have prime Price, Pracioretty, and Weber. Think it's time to pull the damn trigger.
Sergachev+ for Duchene
Find a good top 4 D on the rental market and do something.

Im not against it but this notion that we're done after prices contract is up, or pacioretty's or even weber's decline is not one that i subscribe to.

We would have a young mobile, potentially elite puck moving Defender with size joining the ranks as early as next season and not only that but being a cost controlled asset for the next 7 years.

Plekanec 6 million, Desharnais 3.5, Markovs 5.75, and eventually Emelin's 4 will be replaced with cheaper better options the more we continue to draft and develop.

Juulsen, meter are two very underrated prospects. As is Hudon, and dont forget we have lekonen, danualt who are still very young. There's lots to build on. We can have a core of price, weber, pacioretty and others for a long time yet if we surround them properly with young controlled assets.

 

[webersshot]

and to clarify, I'm not against a trade for duchene. I love the player. Im just saying all these fans saying we absolutely have to do this deal and it makes no sense to think otherwise, well i do think otherwise and the argument for not dealing any of our prospects appear just as logical to me

 

[lanceuppercut75]

Do we have any sense which teams are still in the mix? Would somebody be so kind as to correct this if any team is in the wrong place? Thanks.


AREN'T targetting Duchene...

ATL - BUF DET OTT TBL
MET - NYR PHI PIT WAS
CEN - (COL) DAL MIN WIN
PAC - ARI SJS VAN (VEG)

Maybes...

EAST - BOS FLO CBJ NJD
WEST - STL ANA CAL EDM

ARE targetting Duchene...

EAST - MON TOR CAR NYI
WEST - CHI NAS LAK

 

[Meeqs]

Do we have any sense which teams are still in the mix? Would somebody be so kind as to correct this if any team is in the wrong place? Thanks.


AREN'T targetting Duchene...

ATL - BUF DET OTT TBL
MET - NYR PHI PIT WAS
CEN - (COL) DAL MIN WIN
PAC - ARI SJS VAN (VEG)

Maybes...

EAST - BOS FLO CBJ NJD
WEST - STL ANA CAL EDM

ARE targetting Duchene...

EAST - MON TOR CAR NYI
WEST - CHI NAS LAK

Its pretty much just NYI, MTL, Car.

Ott, Nsh, Pit may all have kicked the tires but he wont go there.

You can never rule out Van in terms of the crazy department and WPG would be an off season dark horse.

 

[Meeqs]

and to clarify, I'm not against a trade for duchene. I love the player. Im just saying all these fans saying we absolutely have to do this deal and it makes no sense to think otherwise, well i do think otherwise and the argument for not dealing any of our prospects appear just as logical to me

I think its a more compelling argument to say that MTL will never be in a better spot to go all in than this year, and that it wont really matter how Sergachev turns out as the majority of the core will be in the twilight of their careers, and have bigger contracts(thus less depth) by the time he is ready to make a solid impact.

I can understand why MB would say no if Sakic is demanding Serg+Galy at the TDL.( should they not do well in the playoffs I might see him making that deal at the draft to save his job. )

However if MB isn't trading Serg with prospects and picks for a true #1c when their window is now then he will never have it in him to make a big move to make MTL a real contender.

 

[GoldiFox]

Its pretty much just NYI, MTL, Car.

Ott, Nsh, Pit may all have kicked the tires but he wont go there.

You can never rule out Van in terms of the crazy department and WPG would be an off season dark horse.

Can remove CAR. Already been reported by LeBrun and local sources that they aren't interested at the asking price.

 

[Dipietro39]

Believe this is a fair trade for both NYI and Col

To NYI: Duchene

To Col: Hamonic + Barzal + 1st round pick

Col can also have Pulock insteak of Hamonic if they want.

 

[RockLobster]

Believe this is a fair trade for both NYI and Col

To NYI: Duchene

To Col: Hamonic + Barzal + 1st round pick

Col can also have Pulock insteak of Hamonic if they want.

From what I can gather, that deal (with Hamonic) is the one most Avs fans prefer, if a deal is happening with the Islanders.

 

[MoBoTFB]

Believe this is a fair trade for both NYI and Col

To NYI: Duchene

To Col: Hamonic + Barzal + 1st round pick

Col can also have Pulock instead of Hamonic if they want.

I wouldn't do that trade with Barzal in it. Substitute MDC or JHS for Barzal then add an additional pick or prospect like toews or Wotherspoon. Thats the most I would offer. Hamonic + the 1st are being undervalued. Hamonic is a good dman on a great contract with more term than Duchene

 

[Dipietro39]

Not sure why the Avs would want MDC. I don't think he has any real value. 4th overall pick that is struggling in the AHL.

 

[MoBoTFB]

Not sure why the Avs would want MDC. I don't think he has any real value. 4th overall pick that is struggling in the AHL.

My point was that in my opinion, Hamonic + Barzal +1st is an overpayment for duchene. I dont think he's worth that much. Barzal makes the trade way in the Avs favor imo

 

[Habs Halifax]

I would love to know what the best offer Sakic has been offered today. I suspect there is a large gap between what he wants and what any team has offered so far. Truth somewhere in the middle? I know the Aves want Sergachev but the Habs won't offer that. Tell me Ave fans, if Sergachev is off the table. How do you feel about how this trade address your team needs?

Offer #1: Duchene for Juulsen, Gallagher, and a 2nd round pick.

Offer #2: Duchene and Iggy for Juulsen, Gallagher, DD, 1st round pick.

Not interesting in hearing posts using words like Terrible, Ridicious, etc. (because it's not in value). I'm interested in common sense people who can tell me if Juulsen, Gallagher, and a pick is a package that helps the Aves and the re-build? Does Gallagher help on the RW or is the depth already good on the right side? Juuslen is not an elite offensive defenseman but his is defense is where his strength is and will be age 20 next year and can be a very reliable top pairing D or at the minimum a top 4D in a season or two from now.

 

[Ginu]

I would love to know what the best offer Sakic has been offered today. I suspect there is a large gap between what he wants and what any team has offered so far. Truth somewhere in the middle? I know the Aves want Sergachev but the Habs won't offer that. Tell me Ave fans, if Sergachev is off the table. How do you feel about how this trade address your team needs?

Offer #1: Duchene for Juulsen, Gallagher, and a 2nd round pick.

Offer #2: Duchene and Iggy for Juulsen, Gallagher, DD, 1st round pick.

Not interesting in hearing posts using words like Terrible, Ridicious, etc. (because it's not in value). I'm interested in common sense people who can tell me if Juulsen, Gallagher, and a pick is a package that helps the Aves and the re-build?

Gallagher isn't going to happen. We'd be trading for Duchene to get another top 6, not trade one away.

 

[Freaky Styley]

From what I can gather, that deal (with Hamonic) is the one most Avs fans prefer, if a deal is happening with the Islanders.

Ya this is the best offer that I have seen. Like the ROR deal (McGinn) the Avs might add a little something extra, but this checks all the boxes they are looking for.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Gallagher isn't going to happen. We'd be trading for Duchene to get another top 6, not trade one away.

I don't agree. I hate to see Gallagher traded but the Habs have depth on RW. Radulov, Gallagher, Shaw, McCarron, Scherback. Yes I agree it's a top 6 for a top 6 but the Habs need a center more than they need a RW

In any trade, you have to give to get and the Habs will not trade Sergachev. Nor will the Sens trade Chabot. I don't blame the Aves for setting the price high but I strongly believe they will not acquire guys like Sergachev or Chabot. It's not the same situation as ROR as he was one year away from being a free agent and the Sabres negotiated a behind the scenes sign and trade deal. Tim Murry was extremely aggressive and willing to take risks back when too and the Aves are banking on this happening again from somebody else.

 

[tucker3434]

I would love to know what the best offer Sakic has been offered today. I suspect there is a large gap between what he wants and what any team has offered so far. Truth somewhere in the middle? I know the Aves want Sergachev but the Habs won't offer that. Tell me Ave fans, if Sergachev is off the table. How do you feel about how this trade address your team needs?

Offer #1: Duchene for Juulsen, Gallagher, and a 2nd round pick.

Offer #2: Duchene and Iggy for Juulsen, Gallagher, DD, 1st round pick.

Not interesting in hearing posts using words like Terrible, Ridicious, etc. (because it's not in value). I'm interested in common sense people who can tell me if Juulsen, Gallagher, and a pick is a package that helps the Aves and the re-build?

My opinion is that Sakic is trying to get Galchenyuk and Sergachev from MTL, and that's why Bergevin is calling the price ludicrous (it is).

No that doesn't help us rebuild if it's at the expense of someone like Duchene. We can do much better than that.

 

[jsalz16]

My point was that in my opinion, Hamonic + Barzal +1st is an overpayment for duchene. I dont think he's worth that much. Barzal makes the trade way in the Avs favor imo

This might get it done but I hope Sakic can do better elsewhere. I like Hamonic but was not overly impressed by Barzal in WJC and a mid 1st round pick in a weaker draft. Admittedly that was only time I've seen Barzal though. Silky hands but refused to use linemate's. Maybe he'll grow out of it. If Sakic is stuck on trading Duchene (which I'm against ) I'm hoping for a deal with Habs or Canes in offseason

 

[Beukeboom Fan]

Do we have any sense which teams are still in the mix? Would somebody be so kind as to correct this if any team is in the wrong place? Thanks.


AREN'T targetting Duchene...

ATL - BUF DET OTT TBL
MET - NYR PHI PIT WAS
CEN - (COL) DAL MIN WIN
PAC - ARI SJS VAN (VEG)

Maybes...

EAST - BOS FLO CBJ NJD
WEST - STL ANA CAL EDM

ARE targetting Duchene...

EAST - MON TOR CAR NYI
WEST - CHI NAS LAK

Notes on your teams listed as possibles/are:

CHI: 0% chance that a deal that makes sense for both teams IMO. Due to cap issues, the only realistic options from the Hawks perspective are players the Av's wouldn't be looking for (Seabrook, Crawford).

FLO: Aren't they set at center with Barkov/Trochek? And while Duchene can play wing, it seems unlikely that a team move the desired assets to play him at wing.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I would love to know what the best offer Sakic has been offered today. I suspect there is a large gap between what he wants and what any team has offered so far. Truth somewhere in the middle? I know the Aves want Sergachev but the Habs won't offer that. Tell me Ave fans, if Sergachev is off the table. How do you feel about how this trade address your team needs?

Offer #1: Duchene for Juulsen, Gallagher, and a 2nd round pick.

Offer #2: Duchene and Iggy for Juulsen, Gallagher, DD, 1st round pick.

Not interesting in hearing posts using words like Terrible, Ridicious, etc. (because it's not in value). I'm interested in common sense people who can tell me if Juulsen, Gallagher, and a pick is a package that helps the Aves and the re-build? Does Gallagher help on the RW or is the depth already good on the right side? Juuslen is not an elite offensive defenseman but his is defense is where his strength is and will be age 20 next year and can be a very reliable top pairing D or at the minimum a top 4D in a season or two from now.

If Sergachev isn't in the deal MTL isn't getting Duchene all there is to it.

 

[Habs Halifax]

My opinion is that Sakic is trying to get Galchenyuk and Sergachev from MTL, and that's why Bergevin is calling the price ludicrous (it is).

No that doesn't help us rebuild if it's at the expense of someone like Duchene. We can do much better than that.

Not trying to insult anybody but Galchenyuk and Sergachev for 2 years of Duchene is beyond insane. I get why the Aves are asking for Sergachev in a package deal but to add Galchenyuk on top of that is just crazy. It's likely not true and just a rumor. I don't believe Sakic is that naive.

Can't wait to see what the actual market value will end up being. I really do think it will be somewhere around what the Pens gave for Kessel but hey, I could be wrong and another aggressive and desperate Tim Murry comes along out of nowhere. If Sakic is not willing to bend... Duchene is an Avalanche for a few years yet IMO

 

[Aspirine]

I would love to know what the best offer Sakic has been offered today. I suspect there is a large gap between what he wants and what any team has offered so far. Truth somewhere in the middle? I know the Aves want Sergachev but the Habs won't offer that. Tell me Ave fans, if Sergachev is off the table. How do you feel about how this trade address your team needs?

Offer #1: Duchene for Juulsen, Gallagher, and a 2nd round pick.

Offer #2: Duchene and Iggy for Juulsen, Gallagher, DD, 1st round pick.

Not interesting in hearing posts using words like Terrible, Ridicious, etc. (because it's not in value). I'm interested in common sense people who can tell me if Juulsen, Gallagher, and a pick is a package that helps the Aves and the re-build? Does Gallagher help on the RW or is the depth already good on the right side? Juuslen is not an elite offensive defenseman but his is defense is where his strength is and will be age 20 next year and can be a very reliable top pairing D or at the minimum a top 4D in a season or two from now.

If you think people will call your offer ridiculous, it most probably is. And then you sing the "you've got to give to get" verse . Sergachev is what it takes, it hurts but it is what it is.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If Sergachev isn't in the deal MTL isn't getting Duchene all there is to it.

Try telling the rest of us something we already don't know. How about I counter you pointless post with another? If Sakic don't come down to reality, Duchene stays with the Aves. Truth is in the middle somewhere. Sakic is clearly trying to get a bidding war going and other GM's are not biting. If the "dream deals" some are referring to were on the table, the trade would of happened.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If you think people will call your offer ridiculous, it most probably is. And then you sing the "you've got to give to get" verse . Sergachev is what it takes, it hurts but it is what it is.

No my comment was referring to "garbage" post replies to the one you just mentioned. All that does is cause post wars. Congrats.

 

[tucker3434]

Not trying to insult anybody but Galchenyuk and Sergachev for 2 years of Duchene is beyond insane. I get why the Aves are asking for Sergachev in a package deal but to add Galchenyuk on top of that is just crazy. It's likely not true and just a rumor. I don't believe Sakic is that naive.

Can't wait to see what the actual market value will end up being. I really do think it will be somewhere around what the Pens gave for Kessel but hey, I could be wrong and another aggressive and desperate Tim Murry comes along out of nowhere. If Sakic is not willing to bend... Duchene is an Avalanche for a few years yet IMO

It's not being naive. He can ask for whatever he wants. Why not ask for the moon? If a trade doesn't happen, Duchene remains an Av for at least 2 1/2 more years. Nobody would be upset about that.