Speculation: Marner or Nylander?

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Lol my god open your eyes

can you explain how Nylander was first in the league in scoring goals from the front of the net if he's a coward who avoids contact? Or how he took more hits in the series against Columbus than Marner?

 

[diceman934]

Only o. Here is a player like Marner made out to be less a player then Nylander who is afraid of his own shadow.

 

[diceman934]

can you explain how Nylander was first in the league in scoring goals from the front of the net if he's a coward who avoids contact? Or how he took more hits in the series against Columbus than Marner?

Get a grip. Nylander is a coward and if you can not see it then it shows your inability to assess a player. Standing in front of the net not getting to pucks that he can get to first is a coward. Or did you miss the 55 times he did this in 5 games. He turned away from the puck or stop skating that is a coward.

 

[diceman934]

can you explain how Nylander was first in the league in scoring goals from the front of the net if he's a coward who avoids contact? Or how he took more hits in the series against Columbus than Marner?

Marner had better possession numbers killing penalties then Nylander did 5 on 5. Why is that. Answer Nylander avoided the puck far to many times. Shanny will want him gone.

I was one of maybe two posters on here who wanted to keep Kadri. I stated that Barrie was no better then Gardiner everyone thought I was wrong. I was not Barrie sucked like I though he would.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

So you are saying his 21 points in the playoffs are meaningless. Stop digging. Your in a hole rather then climb out you just keep digging. Drop the shovel and jump out.

Huh? Im confused....the eye test showed that marner was not even close to an 11 mill player. He should be paid around 7. Especially since he doesnt know how to score any goals.

If he was paid around 7 mill, then yeah definitely keep him. But that extra 4 mill is really hurting.

 

[Farsailor]

Nylander is a coward. He avoids contact. I would be shocked if he is not traded this off season ad for my lack of hockey knowledge...yeah made a living in hockey I must know nothing.

Respect. But neither of them are cowards. And Nylander engage in more "contact" per game than Mitch.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

An idiot blames Marners contract as the reason the leafs lost

Well its the not the only reason. But have that money allocated to our blueline could make us a much more balanced team.....better defensively......which is needed.

Even that extra 4 mill he is overpaid by would grab us a solid defenceman or good winger.

 

[Gabriel426]

Can people just admit that both Marner and Willie didn't even come close to playing at their contract values.
Also their style of play might no longer work in the playoffs against teams like BJs.
Honestly, if the Leafs want to win a Cup, they are destine to play against teams like BJs in their Cup run, maybe not the 1st round but definitely in the later rounds.
Marner and Willie needs to show a lot more than the BJs series to help Leafs. Not saying other players are fine as they need to show more too.

 

[hamzarocks]

Huh? Im confused....the eye test showed that marner was not even close to an 11 mill player. He should be paid around 7. Especially since he doesnt know how to score any goals.

If he was paid around 7 mill, then yeah definitely keep him. But that extra 4 mill is really hurting.

If hes worth 7 than Matthew's is a 8 million dollar player. Matthews is about 1 million better than marner. Marner blew nylander away this year in production (93 pts vs 71 pts paces) despite his ankle injury mid way through the year. Marner was much more dangerous than Nylander in the series. He wasnt 11 million dollar good but his fair deal would have been 9-9.5 million. I dont get why people bring up only goals to discredit an elite playmaker and why people assume nylander will be a 30 goal scorer moving forward when he like marner has been a mid 20s guy before this year.

 

[Notsince67]

Well its the not the only reason. But have that money allocated to our blueline could make us a much more balanced team.....better defensively......which is needed.

Nylander + a 4mm player does not get a Marner. Wake up.

 

[ACC1224]

Can people just admit that both Marner and Willie didn't even come close to playing at their contract values.
Also their style of play might no longer work in the playoffs against teams like BJs.
Honestly, if the Leafs want to win a Cup, they are destine to play against teams like BJs in their Cup run, maybe not the 1st round but definitely in the later rounds.
Marner and Willie needs to show a lot more than the BJs series to help Leafs. Not saying other players are fine as they need to show more too.

Agree on Nylander, Marner will be fine.

 

[CelticDruid]

can you explain how Nylander was first in the league in scoring goals from the front of the net if he's a coward who avoids contact? Or how he took more hits in the series against Columbus than Marner?

And that trend continued against Columbus as both goals were scored from in tight.

 

[Farsailor]

Can people just admit that both Marner and Willie didn't even come close to playing at their contract values.
Also their style of play might no longer work in the playoffs against teams like BJs.
Honestly, if the Leafs want to win a Cup, they are destine to play against teams like BJs in their Cup run, maybe not the 1st round but definitely in the later rounds.
Marner and Willie needs to show a lot more than the BJs series to help Leafs. Not saying other players are fine as they need to show more too.

Yes but they were about as good and we should expect alot more from Mitch.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

If hes worth 7 than Matthew's is a 8 million dollar player. Matthews is about 1 million better than marner. Marner blew nylander away this year in production (93 pts vs 71 pts paces) despite his ankle injury mid way through the year. Marner was much more dangerous than Nylander in the series. He wasnt 11 million dollar good but his fair deal would have been 9-9.5 million. I dont get why people bring up only goals to discredit an elite playmaker and why people assume nylander will be a 30 goal scorer moving forward when he like marner has been a mid 20s guy before this year.

Not sure how people can actually think that marner is even close to matthews.....but hey its your opinion.

In terms of assists and goals: its pretty simple. Is it harder to be a good goal scorer or good passer? Do people tend to have more assists then goals? Do secondary assists actually mean anything? How many people can score 50 goals in this league? How many players get 40-60 assists a year? Does it compare to the number of players that get 40-60 goals a year? Would you rather a 40 goal scorer or 40 assist player? Goal scoring is hard. It is the point of the game.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

Nylander + a 4mm player does not get a Marner. Wake up.

Huh? It would be 11 million dollars to spend on your blue line.....or goalie.....or defender plus big gritty winger. It is a lot of money to help your team who already has matthews, tavares, nylander, hyman, kapanen, kerfoot, johnsson, robertson, mikheyev.

Compare that to our defenceman of rielly, muzzin......sandin, lily.....holl, dermott.....and best of all: marincin.

 

[Gabriel426]

Agree on Nylander, Marner will be fine.

Yes but they were about as good and we should expect alot more from Mitch.

Both need to get better and quite frankly, I expect more from both of them.
At this moment, their style won't cut it in the playoffs. Thats something they need to work on and get better.
Willie is starting to score goals in front of the net, which is an improvement in his game. Thats a fact. He just needs to do more in order to be an effective player or difference maker in playoffs.
Marner's shot has been crap and I don't see any improvements since 4 yrs ago when he broke into the league. We can go back and forth about his points total all we want, but we all heard of 50 goals scorer, 40 goals scorer but we never hear anything like 50 assists guy or 40 assists guy, or even an award for having the most assists. He needs to practice his shots. Quite frankly, with all the resources he could get, there is no way his shots can't improve over the past 4 years. It is like Shaq kept saying he has been practicing his free throws in the off season and he still shot 50% or worse. He needs to keep his game simple instead of thinking about making highlight wheel play.

There is no question both of them got talents to be in the elite level but talents mean nothing if they are not on display consistently and their team winning the Cup.

Also, when it comes to trading Marner or Willie, or whoever. It all depends on the package coming back.
Not saying it will happen, but if Marner or/and Willie can be trade for players like Jones, Drai, McDavid, Parayko, Rosi or even 40% retention on Doughty. You make that trade

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

An idiot blames Marners contract as the reason the leafs lost

If you want to draw parallels between the two statements I'll leave you to it but that's not what I said. Giving Marner that contract was crazy and Dubas shouldn't have done that.

Regardless, given the situation Dubas is in, he shouldn't be calling anyone dumb. He spent to the cap paying guys big contracts with the hope of going deep in the playoffs. This is now the Second straight year that the leafs have failed to make it to the second round. Before Dubas starts hurling insults it might be a good idea to put out a product that can get it done on the Ice. His vision, while early, has failed and we're wasting the best year of our FA high profile signing.

 

[ACC1224]

Not sure how people can actually think that marner is even close to matthews.....but hey its your opinion.

In terms of assists and goals: its pretty simple. Is it harder to be a good goal scorer or good passer? Do people tend to have more assists then goals? Do secondary assists actually mean anything? How many people can score 50 goals in this league? How many players get 40-60 assists a year? Does it compare to the number of players that get 40-60 goals a year? Would you rather a 40 goal scorer or 40 assist player? Goal scoring is hard. It is the point of the game.

That’s a pretty simplistic take. It’s hard to be elite at either. Matthews will always score more goals, Marner will always get more points.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

That’s a pretty simplistic take. It’s hard to be elite at either. Matthews will always score more goals, Marner will always get more points.

Marner has only paced for more points in 1 out of 4 seasons, and 1 out of 4 playoff series

 

[Menzinger]

That’s a pretty simplistic take. It’s hard to be elite at either. Matthews will always score more goals, Marner will always get more points.

Not to nitpick, but Matthews was on pace to finish by slightly more points this season. Imo I wouldn't blink if Matthews out produced Marner next year.

That's not a critique of Marner mind you, just more of a testiment about Matthews value.

 

[ACC1224]

Not to nitpick, but Matthews was on pace to finish by slightly more points this season. Imo I wouldn't blink if Matthews out produced Marner next year.

That's not a critique of Marner mind you, just more of a testiment about Matthews value.

Yep shows how close they really are even with Marners disappointing season.

 

[Notsince67]

Huh? It would be 11 million dollars to spend on your blue line.....or goalie.....or defender plus big gritty winger. It is a lot of money to help your team who already has matthews, tavares, nylander, hyman, kapanen, kerfoot, johnsson, robertson, mikheyev.

Compare that to our defenceman of rielly, muzzin......sandin, lily.....holl, dermott.....and best of all: marincin.

Marner >>Nylander plus a player you can get for 4mm. That means you move nylander plus a 4mm player to get the same cap space. Is that clear?

 

[Menzinger]

Marner >>Nylander plus a player you can get for 4mm. That means you move nylander plus a 4mm player to get the same cap space. Is that clear?

This is hyperbole.

Marners career high in points is 23 ahead of Nylander. Nylanders career high in goals is 4 higher than Marners (in a season shortened by 12 games).

Marner is the better player, but that's not a 4 million dollar gap

 

[david999]

I would not want either player moved. Making an important team decision based on a 5 game series during a pandemic, where everyone new that Columbus would concentrate team defence against the Leafs top players, would be wrong. The failure really was with the lack of secondary scoring from the bottom 6, lack of scoring from the defence, and second best goaltending.

 

[Menzinger]

I would not want either player moved. Making an important team decision based on a 5 game series during a pandemic, where everyone new that Columbus would concentrate team defence against the Leafs top players, would be wrong. The failure really was with the lack of secondary scoring from the bottom 6, lack of scoring from the defence, and second best goaltending.

Yep. The fact is too, folks can keep going back and forth on these guys but the fact is it will be a heck of a lot easier to remake the setup of the support players than move either Marner or Nylander. Which I think remains the wisest course of action.

Both guys are under contract and the trade issue can be revised next off-season if need be