Management Thread: Weisileaks

[Peter10]

Burke said Gillis asked Kadri and two 1st round picks, talks were over, sure the Luongo traded ended up well for Canucks since Markstrom became a number 1 goalie but at that time I am sure he could of got more than a third line forward and a goaltending prospect.

Burke was fired 3 days after the 2013 CBA was ratified which means the offer must have been in the 2011-12 season at which point the cap recapture penalty did not exist so Luongos value was much higher as that point. Blaming Gillis for asking for a full value return while also complaining that the Kesler deal would have been a poor return is just golden.

P.S. Oh its "could have" and "would have"

 

[Bubbles]

Remember when Seattle got a franchise and everyone in this board was convinced this was gonna be Mike Gillis comeback to the NHL. Where he will show everyone that his run in Vancouver was no fluke and with better structure he will be successful? Remember all the brash postings from mostly everyone from here stating ‘don’t worry Gillis will go to Seattle and show Vancouver what this missed, blah blah blah, etc’

Then people here were dumbfounded that GASP an established member of the OBC got the GM job in Ron Francis, whom I’m sure got back up support from Jim Rutherford and Mario Lemieux.

The notion that Gillis was coming back to the NHL where he will get a job with better structure was shut down.

A tease.

When Gillis was not hired for that one, I was sure he would never get another NHL job again. It would have been a perfect scenario where he could be a president and build a hockey operations like his proposal.

Don't get me wrong, I am very pro-Gillis. But I also know the reality of the situation. He's been turned down for multiple jobs. My suggestion for him is to get in anywhere first as a scout (a lot of fired GMs go through that route) and wait for an opportunity. At 62 and not an OBC member, time may run out.

 

[Canucks1096]

Have you considered that making a "big trade" when the team was where it was at during Gillis' tenure wouldn't have been a good move? Who did you want to get rid of? Burrows? Kesler? Sedins? Edler? Salo? We were at our peak and our moves consisted of trading picks for depth because we didn't have major holes in our roster.

Imagine complaining that Gillis didn't make big trades for the sake of it

I would agree If they just want to be a good team and not win the cup, then there weren't any major holes. But Gillis was just trying to win the cup. To say there weren't major holes is completely out to lunch

2009 and 2010 Canucks D had issues with Hawks speed and size. 2011 yes they made it to the finals but most likely they would of won a cup without injuries however there were only 4 forwards with 0.5 ppg in the playoffs. When Sedins were shutdown and Kesler was playing hurt, no one else came through because they didn't have another scorer. 2012 and 2013 playoffs Canucks struggle to score. I expect Gillis to make a big trades to fix these holes.

I 100% disagree with you in saying it wouldn't be a good move to make a big trade. When you have weaknesses you need to go out and fix it. Trading the core wouldn't of make sense and you can still make a big trade without trading the core.

Kings got Carter? Got 2 cup from it, Pirs got Kessel, 2 cups from it as well.

Hodgson Raymond Grabner 1st round pick. They could of used this pieces and make a hockey trade.

I am not complaining about Gillis not making a big trade for sake of it. I think you're just debating for the sake of debating

 

[4Twenty]

Best 5 year period in team history is a failure because it only won 15 playoffs games instead of 16.

unbelievable take.

that’s a spoiled fan take.

 

[brock hughes007]

Man if I lived in Vancouver,,I'd be outside that arena with a Fire Benning sign...every day...

 

[Peen]

Best 5 year period in team history is a failure because it only won 15 playoffs games instead of 16.

unbelievable take.

that’s a spoiled fan take.

I think he’s right about 2012-2015.

I don’t agree with him on the years before that

 

[Canucks1096]

Burke was fired 3 days after the 2013 CBA was ratified which means the offer must have been in the 2011-12 season at which point the cap recapture penalty did not exist so Luongos value was much higher as that point. Blaming Gillis for asking for a full value return while also complaining that the Kesler deal would have been a poor return is just golden.

P.S. Oh its "could have" and "would have"

When you have time, ask 10 to 20 of your friends or you can start a a new thread or maybe call some hockey sports radio. Ask them this question.

Kadri Gardiner and two 1st round pick is worth Luongo. Most people will say No. That is like four 1st round picks, I don't think any goalie ever got anything close to that level of assets. If you think Luongo is worth that you're out to lunch. I do think you're debating for the sake of debating. Luongo is probably worth about half of that.

Sutter Pouliot 1st round for Kesler is a horrible trade. Most people will say No

 

[Canucks1096]

Maybe I should take a break from this forum.

One person is debating about Canucks had no major weaknesses and make a big trade wouldn't of made any sense. What????

Another person is debating Kadri Gardiner and two 1st round picks is worth Luongo. What????

I know a lot of people are Gillis fans. Bu when debating, don't just indirectly spell out "I am a Gillis fans so I am debate for the sake of debating to defend Gillis"

 

[EpochLink]

Maybe I should take a break from this forum.

One person is debating about Canucks had no major weaknesses and make a big trade wouldn't of made any sense. What????

Another person is debating Kadri Gardiner and two 1st round picks is worth Luongo. What????

I know a lot of people are Gillis fans. Bu when debating, don't just indirectly spell out "I am a Gillis fans so I am debate for the sake of debating to defend Gillis"

Some are and some aren’t, I am one of them who wasn’t a fan. The only gripe about 2011 is that we missed out on another top 6 player at the deadline.

 

[4Twenty]

Omg rehashing Gillis moves and non moves in 2021 when the current manager has the team playing at a .375 pace what a place.

 

[4Twenty]

Some are and some aren’t, I am one of them who wasn’t a fan. The only gripe about 2011 is that we missed out on another top 6 player at the deadline.

Losing two of the top 6 forwards in TOI in Malhotra and Samuelson was a tough pill.

That team with good health was deep.

It was the top scoring, lowest goals against top 5 pp/pk.

it was pretty damn deep.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Maybe I should take a break from this forum.

Well, considering you're in here babbling about hypothetical trades Gillis didn't make while ignoring 7 solid years' worth of bad deals Benning did make, I'd say that's for the best.

 

[wreckless]

Omg rehashing Gillis moves and non moves in 2021 when the current manager has the team playing at a .375 pace what a place.

in his 7th year.

troy in whiterock would have had more success.

 

[xtra]

When you have time, ask 10 to 20 of your friends or you can start a a new thread or maybe call some hockey sports radio. Ask them this question.

Kadri Gardiner and two 1st round pick is worth Luongo. Most people will say No. That is like four 1st round picks, I don't think any goalie ever got anything close to that level of assets. If you think Luongo is worth that you're out to lunch. I do think you're debating for the sake of debating. Luongo is probably worth about half of that.

Sutter Pouliot 1st round for Kesler is a horrible trade. Most people will say No

Why are we believing Brian Burke about that outright when we knows he hates Gillis? Burke 100% seems like the type of person to lie/embellish to make him look good.


Also are you saying the value of sutter puliot and 1st AT THE TIME OF THE OFFER was a bad deal or because of how the players turned out it would have been a bad deal?

I mean you have to consider/acknowledge the development of the players would have been different and the outcomes could have been different right.

 

[Canucks1096]

Omg rehashing Gillis moves and non moves in 2021 when the current manager has the team playing at a .375 pace what a place.

I am talking about Gillis because some people want to bring him back. I am giving you guys the reason why he shouldn't be back.

This has nothing to do with Benning vs Gillis debate that you're trying to start.

If it makes you feel better. I would say this

Benning is not a great gm, he made a lot of horrible moves.

Do you feel better?

Believe it or not. I am not even a Benning fan.

 

[wreckless]

I just cant think of any currently available GM I'd rather have over Gillis.

Adding to that, I could see Gillman coming back with Gillis in charge.. and despite what most of you and the 'old boys club' think, with Gillis and Gillman back, you watch how quickly other outside qualified personnel would want to join this management group.

And to those bringing up the Gillis hate and lack of GM offerings.. if it's one thing I've learned throughout my years of business acumen.. it's that hate rendered from success is a positive.

 

[EpochLink]

I just cant think of any currently available GM I'd rather have over Gillis.

Adding to that, I could see Gillman coming back with Gillis in charge.. and despite what most of you and the 'old boys club' think, with Gillis and Gillman back, you watch how quickly other outside qualified personnel would want to join this management group.

And to those brining up the hate and lack of offerings.. if it's one thing I've learned throughout my years of business acumen.. it's that hate rendered from success is a positive.

Yeah no not happening.
Gillman coming back with Gillis, no.
Gillman coming back with an OBC member, sure.

The NHL don’t work that way, their business ain’t your business.

 

[Canucks1096]

Well, considering you're in here babbling about hypothetical trades Gillis didn't make while ignoring 7 solid years' worth of bad deals Benning did make, I'd say that's for the best.

This has nothing to do with Benning. Why did you even bring up Benning? I didn't even write Benning in my post.

Some people want Gillis back. I am giving the reason why he shouldn't be back.

I am ignoring Benning deals in my post because the conversation is not about Benning.

Some of you guys seem hurt to know the truth about Gillis. Some People are acting like little kids. It's like I said something Negative about Gillis and now people need revenge and say something negative about Benning.

Funny thing is most of my replies don't have much defending my points, why??? Because they are all solid points and people don't know how to defend those points so people feel like they need to bring Benning in the conversation to make them feel better.

Do you feel better if I say?

Benning is a horrible gm and he made a lot of bad moves. Sure I will say that.

 

[CpatainCanuck]

I just cant think of any currently available GM I'd rather have over Gillis.

Adding to that, I could see Gillman coming back with Gillis in charge.. and despite what most of you and the 'old boys club' think, with Gillis and Gillman back, you watch how quickly other outside qualified personnel would want to join this management group.

And to those bringing up the Gillis hate and lack of GM offerings.. if it's one thing I've learned throughout my years of business acumen.. it's that hate rendered from success is a positive.

There is virtually 0 chance of Gillis coming back. Aquilini didn't want to rebuild in 2014 and if you've noticed he doesn't want to in 2021.

 

[wreckless]

i'm not saying he is coming back, I'm saying i can't think of anyone I'd rather over him.

my post was to simply discredit those opposing the move if there was a situation where it could happen.

 

[I am toxic]

Maybe I should take a break from this forum.

One person is debating about Canucks had no major weaknesses and make a big trade wouldn't of made any sense. What????

Another person is debating Kadri Gardiner and two 1st round picks is worth Luongo. What????

I know a lot of people are Gillis fans. Bu when debating, don't just indirectly spell out "I am a Gillis fans so I am debate for the sake of debating to defend Gillis"

 

[I am toxic]

If Manny doesn't get hit in the eye in 2011 - what was it, after the TDL? - we have a Cup in 2011.

If Keith doesn't cheapshot Daniel in 2012 - what was it, after the TDL? - we have a cup in 2012.

Gillis did well enough with the trades and signings (eg. Ehrhoff, Hamhuis) and smaller trades (Higgins, Lappy).

Bottom line for me: Gillis is hands down the best candidate out there, but he isn't coming back as long as the current owner is calling the shots.

The only two I can imagine I would like to hear being hired are Tlusky or Futa. Simply because I haven't seen massive red flags with them like with the other names thrown about. Jim Rutherford? God help me. Lombardi? Make me puke, character matters. Not sure about other names, throw 'em at me . . .

 

[Bubbles]

Yeah no not happening.
Gillman coming back with Gillis, no.
Gillman coming back with an OBC member, sure.

The NHL don’t work that way, their business ain’t your business.

wreckless has completely ignored my CEO/Burkie argument, which I provide direct evidence for.

 

[Peen]

I don’t think @Canucks1096 has been unreasonable whatsoever. I would bet you money they’ve run through the idea of bringing back Gillis in ownership numerous times. It’s been over a month of fire management talk at this point.

I just think they’ll find another puppet

 

[I am toxic]

Omg rehashing Gillis moves and non moves in 2021 when the current manager has the team playing at a .375 pace what a place.

. . . GILLIS!