Malkin named to IIHF All-Time Russian Team...Ovechkin left off

[PensPlz]

 

[Demandedace]

Legacy? Sure. However Malkin has been the better player.

That said, as previously stated the margin has been slim. We also must take into account other variables:

1: Ovechkin has a playing style more conducive to strong play at an advanced than Malkin.

2: Malkin has been awful this year whereas Ovechkin hasn't.

It's possible that Ovechkin will surpass him. We shall see...

This is just an awful take. You need to reevaluate if hockey is for you if you truly believe this.

 

[Amazinmets73]

This is just an awful take. You need to reevaluate if hockey is for you if you truly believe this.

What do you disagree with and why?

 

[slapKing]

To say that Malkin has been better than Ovechkin more times than not in the NHL is wrong.

Ovechkin was objectively the better player in 2007, 2008, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2015, 2019, and 2021 (so far). 8 times.

Malkin was objectively the better player in 2012, 2014, 2017, and 2020. A total of 4 times.

2009, 2016, and 2018 can go either way, but even if you say Malkin was better in those seasons, Ovechkin still wins 8-7.

But yeah, Malkin has been the better player than Ovechkin at the international stage, no argument there.

I just don't put much stock into it because the majority of the games consist of the world championships, which, no offense, holds almost no weight.

Now, this is just me, but in career value, I say 70% value for the regular season, 25% for the playoffs, and 5% for international games. i just don't put much stock into them. The NHL is where it's at.

 

[jetsforever]

Easy - Ovi is a top-100 NHL player and Malkin is a top-6 Russian player

 

[Butch 19]

Maybe Russia should get their own HF Forum...

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

Pretty good for a guy whose not even top 100 material.

 

[Ciao]

A bad joke.

 

[Deen]

In Mother Russia ... list picks you.

 

[Midnight Judges]

2009, 2016, and 2018 can go either way, but even if you say Malkin was better in those seasons, Ovechkin still wins 8-7.

Dude. 2009 cannot go either way. Ovechkin absolutely curb stomped Malkin in Hart voting (115 first place votes to 12), and then put up 21 points/11 goals in 14 playoff games.

No doubt Malkin had a great playoff run, but so did Ovie.

 

[pi314]

In Mother Russia ... list picks you.

Finally someone said it.

 

[Weztex]

I checked out Canada.

I can't believe the IIHF snubbed The Heater. The All-Star. Canada's all-time leading scorer and all-star.

On another thought, they have Gretzky selected as a right winger? He has never played right wing in his entire life.

They have Gretzky as a top-3 forward. Not as a right wing.

 

[OKR]

Was Geno that much better than Ovi in international tournaments?

Yeah, Malkin has always been a beast for Team Russia and Ovechkin is pretty notorious for dissapointing

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Dude. 2009 cannot go either way. Ovechkin absolutely curb stomped Malkin in Hart voting (115 first place votes to 12), and then put up 21 points/11 goals in 14 playoff games.

No doubt Malkin had a great playoff run, but so did Ovie.

It is not close because of Hart voting? Maybe 112 of the Ovechkin voters thought it was close.

I mean, your argument is a bad one.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Was Geno that much better than Ovi in international tournaments?

Yes he was.

 

[7even]

Of all the opinions I've seen, that's one of them.

 

[Midnight Judges]

It is not close because of Hart voting? Maybe 112 of the Ovechkin voters thought it was close.

I mean, your argument is a bad one.

Alright, fair enough. Perhaps you, Evgeny Malkin's Mom, and 112 Hart voters thought it was close.

In reality Ovie had .71 GPG to Malkin's .43 and Ovie had a higher PPG too. A 21 goal difference is kind of huge.

Ovie was also exponentially more physical.

Ovie also had a far superior CORSI Rel (4.5 to -1.9).

Ovie was on the ice for significantly more goals for (162 vs 143). But Malkin actually had a slight advantage in terms of deployment: Malkin had 63.6% offensive zone starts to Ovie's 59.3%. Both guys PK'd for about 1 minute per game. Both guys were on the PP for roughly 5.5 minutes per game. Malkin played more minutes due to the fact that he played 3 more games.

Malkin played a ton with Crosby that year (they factored in on 50 goals together). Sure, Ovie had Backstrom.

I mean dude, maybe you don't remember but there was zero doubt as to who was going to win the Hart that year.

 

[authentic]

Dude. 2009 cannot go either way. Ovechkin absolutely curb stomped Malkin in Hart voting (115 first place votes to 12), and then put up 21 points/11 goals in 14 playoff games.

No doubt Malkin had a great playoff run, but so did Ovie.

Lol are you kidding me, they had equal points per game there was virtually no difference between them that season.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Lol are you kidding me, they had equal points per game there was virtually no difference between them that season.

Sure, except for the 21 goals, Ovechkin was 3x more physical, and the fact that Ovie tilted the ice way more.

"Virtually no difference between them" doesn't result in a 115 to 12 Hart vote.

 

[authentic]

To say that Malkin has been better than Ovechkin more times than not in the NHL is wrong.

Ovechkin was objectively the better player in 2007, 2008, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2015, 2019, and 2021 (so far). 8 times.

Malkin was objectively the better player in 2012, 2014, 2017, and 2020. A total of 4 times.

2009, 2016, and 2018 can go either way, but even if you say Malkin was better in those seasons, Ovechkin still wins 8-7.

But yeah, Malkin has been the better player than Ovechkin at the international stage, no argument there.

I just don't put much stock into it because the majority of the games consist of the world championships, which, no offense, holds almost no weight.

Now, this is just me, but in career value, I say 70% value for the regular season, 25% for the playoffs, and 5% for international games. i just don't put much stock into them. The NHL is where it's at.

Malkin has a higher points per game in the regular season and playoffs, they have spent their career playing during the exact same time, except Ovechkin got to play in 1 more higher scoring season that Malkin didn't in 2005-06. Even at their peak I don't see Ovechkin as the clearly better player, they were equal at best with Ovechkin having a more sustained peak.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Alright, fair enough. Perhaps you, Evgeny Malkin's Mom, and 112 Hart voters thought it was close.

In reality Ovie had .71 GPG to Malkin's .43 and Ovie had a higher PPG too. A 21 goal difference is kind of huge.

Ovie was also exponentially more physical.

Ovie also had a far superior CORSI Rel (4.5 to -1.9).

Ovie was on the ice for significantly more goals for (162 vs 143). But Malkin actually had a slight advantage in terms of deployment: Malkin had 63.6% offensive zone starts to Ovie's 59.3%. Both guys PK'd for about 1 minute per game. Both guys were on the PP for roughly 5.5 minutes per game. Malkin played more minutes due to the fact that he played 3 more games.

Malkin played a ton with Crosby that year (they factored in on 50 goals together). Sure, Ovie had Backstrom.

I mean dude, maybe you don't remember but there was zero doubt as to who was going to win the Hart that year.

I mean, cool beans, but that was not what I was arguing. I was just saying the Hart vote is a bad metric considering one guy could be obviously better, which will make the vote not that close, but it did not mean that the actual performances were not close.

I was not even debating if Ovechkin was better or not. All I am saying is that it was close. But hey "goalzzzzzz".

 

[authentic]

Sure, except for the 21 goals, Ovechkin was 3x more physical, and the fact that Ovie simply titled the ice way more.

"Virtually no difference between them" doesn't result in a 115 to 12 Hart vote.

Do you think if Ovechkin played for Pittsburgh and Malkin played for Washington the Hart voting would be the same? Do you also take Hart votes at face value? Like Draisaitl was indisputably the better player than McDavid last season?

 

[OrangePMD]

Don't fret Ovy.

We'll take you on the IIHF All-Time USA team. After all, you are an American citizen and we love you and we'll do anything for you.

Are you sure about that. I mean, Ovi is pretty good, is he better than Herb Drury or John Mayasich ?
IIHF - All-Time USA Team

 

[TheGoldenJet]

I checked out Canada.

I can't believe the IIHF snubbed The Heater. The All-Star. Canada's all-time leading scorer and all-star.

On another thought, they have Gretzky selected as a right winger? He has never played right wing in his entire life.

It’s just the top 3 forwards and the top 2 D, positions are not taken into consideration (even though they are listed).

 

[Midnight Judges]

Do you think if Ovechkin played for Pittsburgh and Malkin played for Washington the Hart voting would be the same? Do you also take Hart votes at face value? Like Draisaitl was indisputably the better player than McDavid last season?

Yeah I do think if Ovie played for Pittsburgh the result would have been the same because Ovechkin was very clearly the most dominant player in the NHL at the time. Put him with young Crosby and the sky is the limit. If anything, that would help tremendously. Under that circumstance Ovie probably wins the Art Ross too.

I think Draisaitl indisputably had the better season last year. Who was better on a per game basis is a closer call but still favors Draisaitl.