Post-Game Talk: Make it so

[guymez]

The realization that you have NHL worst goaltending in net results in overplaying. It results in even players with the pedigree of Ekholm chasing and being out of position desperate as he is to get to pucks and knowing full well that any shot could be a GA. I mean Skinner let a goal in from the blueline on a dump, everybody saw that. KK on the bench visibly groaned.

100 people here are saying it and you don't see it. Terrible goaltending deflates teams. It deflates their play, it subverts their play. When you don't trust your goaltending the own zone play erodes, partly through panic.

In anycase theres little point to the further discussion on this topic as we both have our ingrained views on it.

No...thats not how this works. A player just does their job. They mark the man in front of the net.
They dont puck watch.
Look at virtually every goal in the last game and you see examples of players that either dont know what they are supposed to do or they just arent aware enough or motivated enough to do what they are supposed to do.

Expecting a goalie to save their ass occasionally is standard...every team does that.
Expecting a goalie to save their ass all the time isnt.

Thats were this team is at...they expect the goalie to save their ass all the time. They expect that they dont have to put in the work to play defence because the goalie will save the day.
Its an immature approach and it wont win them anything.
It wont make any difference who they put in net until that mindset changes.

 

[GMofOilers]

The goaltending in the Vegas series in particular shook this team mentally more than Holland accounted for.

He was stupid and thought "oh this is just another growing pain and if we keep getting kicks at the can, we'll just succeed like Detroit!" mindset.

The truth of what was happening though was Skinner getting his lunch money taken by Adin Hill and potentially costing the Oilers a trip to the Finals was something that lingered with this team all summer. No one would say it out loud but you know they were all thinking it.

Ken Holland didn't recognize the situation as it existed and instead doubled down on the same goaltending tandem that secretly the group had already lost trust in.

When the season started at 8-1 and then the team went out and outshot, outplayed the crap out of the Canucks in game 2 and still couldn't get a save ... that was it. Done.

Any trust in the goaltending was 100% gone.

Yup we heard the call out in the Heritage classic, Mcdavid got asked about Skinners gear “let’s hope he puts it to good use”

Ouch that was a burn back then, the team didn’t have Skinners trust at that point. They won that game because of adrenaline and they didn’t even give up a scoring chance lol

 

[Mav3rick07]

But it was amazing to watch Kotchekov break up 3-4(!!) cross crease passes/drives to the net with his stick. Why are Oilers goalies incapable of doing this? They just watch the pass go across and end up in their net.

Something something Dustin Schwartz.

 

[Soundwave]

Yup we heard the call out in the Heritage classic, Mcdavid got asked about Skinners gear “let’s hope he puts it to good use”

Ouch that was a burn back then, the team didn’t have Skinners trust at that point. They won that game because of adrenaline and they didn’t even give up a scoring chance lol

Game 2 of this season where Skinner couldn't make a save and Vancouver's back up made like 10 high danger stops pretty much was the absolute breaking point.

This team has no faith and no trust in Skinner or Campbell. No one will say it out loud but they all think it deep down.

The Vegas series did it, and then the start of the season just re-confirmed it like 10x.

 

[guymez]

Not gonna agree here because the D are both present front of net. They are in the zone that D need to be covering. If the forwards drop too low, to an area already being occupied then they leave everything up high, and other exploits up there, which is exactly how the Canes scored the goal that was called back.

The scorer was close to net in the slot. Thats a primary cover for D instead of sticking their thumbs up their arses If the scorer was higher up then I put it to forwards not covering.

A centers job is to play down low defensivley.
What was Draisaitl doing on the Canes 5th goal?

 

[GMofOilers]

Skinner lost to the Sharks! The team gave up 18 shots! He sported a 833%

18 shots!
Look at the shots! Yeah it’s all defence folks!

 

[Drivesaitl]

A centers job is to play down low defensivley.
What was Draisaitl doing on the Canes 5th goal?

Should Drai be in net? Maybe thats the answer we've been looking for.

Two D were in place in front of net. The scorer was in front of net. It was their primary cover. If the Center is too low then leaving ice open elsewhere. Too much collapse is bad too and it starts with our goalie first literally crawling into his cage making himself tiny.

See if you can pause to consider what actual job a goalie has. Get back to us on that.

 

[Soundwave]

A centers job is to play down low defensivley.
What was Draisaitl doing on the Canes 5th goal?

He was slow on the rotation over on the FIFTH goal, the FIFTH coming after the D made errors on the previous FOUR f***ing goals (lol).

What is Kulak doing on that fifth goal ... he's an idiot who instead of having his stick on the ice and playing defense instead had his stick up at abdomen level, trying to hook the Carolina player (?) doing a fly by.

Like whhhhhy? What are you trying to even accomplish there? Get a penalty?

So the Carolina player with the puck behind the net was able to make an easy pass into the slot because Kulak's stick is 3 feet off the ice, might as well just have your stick up your ass at that point.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Game 2 of this season where Skinner couldn't make a save and Vancouver's back up made like 10 high danger stops pretty much was the absolute breaking point.

This team has no faith and no trust in Skinner or Campbell. No one will say it out loud but they all think it deep down.

The Vegas series did it, and then the start of the season just re-confirmed it like 10x.

Yeah. this is the game I look at as well. Skinner was absolute shit in that game again getting pulled.

Including playoffs how many times he getting pulled. The rate seems to be like 1/3 games, lolol

 

[frag2]

No team waits for a goalie to make saves before they take care of their D zone coverage.

The goaltending has been inconsistent but this team this year has been garbage defensively.
Its under their complete control not to be garbage. Just do your job.

This mindset that you cant do whats in completely your control until something else changes just doesnt make sense.


A dman or forward doesnt think to himself...hmmm...it doesnt matter what I do because our goalie is crap so I will just say f*ck it and not cover anyone...lol
Have you played?
Players play within their ability offensively but defence is learned. Once you learn how to play defence you dont just stop if the goalie isnt up to par.

A player has to be interested in putting in the work to play defence...for an offensive player its part of maturing.
Its quite clear to me after multiple defensive coaches that this team isnt interested in playing defence. They would rather let the goalie do all the work.

Id argue the goaltending has been consistent...consistently horrible.

Is it just that difficult to expect the goalies to at least make A big save? Strange how expectations are so much higher for the defense/forwards [esp McDrai for some reason] to be perfect yet you have goalies that are 20-40 pts below league average. If all 3 goalies had roughly the same save percentage, then sure-it would point to the players up front. Soup and Skinner have been significantly worse than Pickard [albeit small sample size for the latter] and they all play behind the same players.

 

[Drivesaitl]

No...thats not how this works. A player just does their job. They mark the man in front of the net.
They dont puck watch.
Look at virtually every goal in the last game and you see examples of players that either dont know what they are supposed to do or they just arent aware enough or motivated enough to do what they are supposed to do.

Expecting a goalie to save their ass occasionally is standard...every team does that.
Expecting a goalie to save their ass all the time isnt.

Thats were this team is at...they expect the goalie to save their ass all the time. They expect that they dont have to put in the work to play defence because the goalie will save the day.
Its an immature approach and it wont win them anything.
It wont make any difference who they put in net until that mindset changes.

5GA in first 13 SOG in a hockey game yesterday. "The goalies be saving the teams ass every time"

lol. You right stuff like this with no apparent recognition that people can drive Semi Trucks through your argument.

Actually what this team thinks on the ice, and headcoach even spelled it out clearly last night is they expect that any mistake they make will end up in the back of the net. That this is creating tremendous pressure for the players.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Id argue the goaltending has been consistent...consistently horrible.

Is it just that difficult to expect the goalies to at least make A big save? Strange how expectations are so much higher for the defense/forwards [esp McDrai for some reason] to be perfect yet you have goalies that are 20-40 pts below league average. If all 3 goalies had roughly the same save percentage, then sure-it would point to the players up front. Soup and Skinner have been significantly worse than Pickard [albeit small sample size for the latter] and they all play behind the same players.

The goalies need to be better... But when you get so badly outplayed like they did last night you're going to lose.

They got destroyed in the first period and had Carolina kept going they would've hit double digits.

 

[Drivesaitl]

No...thats not how this works. A player just does their job. They mark the man in front of the net.
They dont puck watch.
Look at virtually every goal in the last game and you see examples of players that either dont know what they are supposed to do or they just arent aware enough or motivated enough to do what they are supposed to do.

Expecting a goalie to save their ass occasionally is standard...every team does that.
Expecting a goalie to save their ass all the time isnt.

Thats were this team is at...they expect the goalie to save their ass all the time. They expect that they dont have to put in the work to play defence because the goalie will save the day.
Its an immature approach and it wont win them anything.
It wont make any difference who they put in net until that mindset changes.

No.... Thats not how this works.

 

[Soundwave]

Campbell has never had the team's trust.

Skinner lost it after being bad in both the LA but especially the Vegas series when he got dummied by Adin Hill.

And then whatever good will either of them had was toast by game 2 of this season.

You can cry all you want about D this and D that, but when the other team's BACK UP goalie is continually making saves your so-called "starter" doesn't, it registers with the team, don't kid yourself.

 

[trick91]

Would a team actually pick up Skinner if we waived him? Im beginning to think no, not at his cap hit (2.6mill)

 

[Drivesaitl]

The goalies need to be better... But when you get so badly outplayed like they did last night you're going to lose.

They got destroyed in the first period and had Carolina kept going they would've hit double digits.

The Oilers were not badly outplayed last night by any metric.

First period Canes, 2nd period even, 3rd period all Oilers.

 

[GMofOilers]

Would a team actually pick up Skinner if we waived him? Im beginning to think no, not at his cap hit (2.6mill)

Never he’s a fraud

The Oilers were not badly outplayed last night by any metric.

First period Canes, 2nd period even, 3rd period all Oilers.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Never he’s a fraud

Thanks. I pictured it more 60/40 OIlers but its interesting it was even more pronounced than that. We both know Keith didn't even watch the game.

 

[Mav3rick07]

Just give the Pickard the crease for now and try and make a move for a goalie and or defence without getting fleeced or mortgaging our future.

 

[bone]

The goalies need to be better... But when you get so badly outplayed like they did last night you're going to lose.

They got destroyed in the first period and had Carolina kept going they would've hit double digits.

Yeah, you probably lose yesterday's game regardless, but the score doesn't get to 5-1 before your team wakes up.

If the score is 3-1 after the first and they see a goalie that made a couple nice saves keeping it 3-1, maybe you have the team rally a bit around the goalie to go pay him back for keeping them in it after discombobulated first period that was in many ways a carryover of a strange warm up session.

The goalies too often haven't kept them in it when the team struggles for a stretch, or in many cases they've let teams back into it when Edmonton starts well (which they've done often in recent times) but the first opportunity against after building a lead goes in.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

The Oilers were not badly outplayed last night by any metric.

First period Canes, 2nd period even, 3rd period all Oilers.

Yeah those are called score effects. Typically a team that’s far ahead will coast while a team that’s behind will play catch up because… well, they’re behind. We have seen this with the team countless times. The Canes were never in danger of losing that game.

 

[GMofOilers]

Skinner is the worst goalie in the league that has played more than game. Every important stat, save%, GAA, goals saved above expected, the list goes on and on.

It’s only the defence though……

 

[Drivesaitl]

Yeah those are called score effects. Typically a team that’s far ahead will coast while a team that’s behind will play catch up because… well, they’re behind. We have seen this with the team countless times. The Canes were never in danger of losing that game.

yet the fans were booing the home team 1minute into the third with the Oilers all over the Canes as if was a PP. Its how most of the period went.

The fans were shitting bricks. So were the canes. The game wasn't actually over. If even one of the post shots go in Canes are brown streaking all over the ice.

If Skinner is in the Canes net we probably hit double digits.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

yet the fans were booing the home team 1minute into the third with the Oilers all over the Canes as if was a PP. Its how most of the period went.

The fans were shitting bricks. So were the canes. The game wasn't actually over. If even one of the post shots go in Canes are brown streaking all over the ice.

If Skinner is in the Canes net we probably hit double digits.

They were down by four goals to an elite team playing in their barn. You want a better idea of how that game went?

Edmonton Oilers @ Carolina Hurricanes, 2023-11-22

The Canes were in control the entire game.

 

[frag2]

Skinner lost to the Sharks! The team gave up 18 shots! He sported a 833%

18 shots!
Look at the shots! Yeah it’s all defence folks!

From what I got out of those charts, it doesn't matter where opposition shoots the puck.