GDT: Lightning vs Capitals. 7pm. Verizon Center. 4.13.2013

[The Consiglieri]

Consig nailed it. Other perfect examples are the Bullets trading young for old, big for small, (Weber for Richmond) or draft picks for aging players who sometimes gave them nothing(Price), other times gave them very little (Pack).

Its ironic that GMGM would cling to Shultz forever, but jettison prospects with more complete games and more upside like Eakin and FF for older players who may, after its all said and done, give us 2.5 years of solid play.

You can only sell the future for the present for a short period of time before that catches up to you. In 2 years we may once again need a 2LW and a 2C with nothing in the pipeline.

Don't forget Wallace for Strick and Duckworth. Those two deals done a mere two years apart easily would go down as the worst two NBA trades of the nineties.

 

[Mothra]

Because decision making premised upon the ideas that grounded this trade would destroy a franchise in quick order. Franchises that make decisions like the one that formed the foundation of this trade always fail. These kinds of decisions are symptomatic with what the worst franchises in American sports consistently do.

If the trade ends up successful, it's largely a product of random chance, rather than well thought out, intelligent planning.

Please explain to me this thinking and what im missing about the "foundation" of this trade.....if, in fact they targeted a player they liked and had become available...a player they felt would fit with what they do.....how in the world is this "random" or not "thought out"? Agree with the trade or not....and again im not a fan of it....this is nonsense.

are you really starting to compare how the Caps and Skins build teams?

 

[txpd]

good to be back. i feel right at home. mcphee is an idiot for trading young pospects like eakin and forsberg for older players like erat and ribeiro. we have also established that he is an idiot for not trading young players like alzner or carlson and varly or neuvirth for an older player like pronger.

do it. dont do it.

the capitals have won 7 in a row at playoff of time and the general manager of the team is a dripping fool. makes perfect sense to me. any monkey could have done it.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

good to be back. i feel right at home. mcphee is an idiot for trading young pospects like eakin and forsberg for older players like erat and ribeiro. we have also established that he is an idiot for not trading young players like alzner or carlson and varly or neuvirth for an older player like pronger.

do it. dont do it.

the capitals have won 7 in a row at playoff of time and the general manager of the team is a dripping fool. makes perfect sense to me. any monkey could have done it.

I'm trying to see a world in which Erat joining a winger corps fully stocked by Ovechkin, Johansson, Laich, and Brouwer equals Pronger joining a d corps led by Shaone Morrisonn, but I just can't do it.

 

[txpd]

I'm trying to see a world in which Erat joining a winger corps fully stocked by Ovechkin, Johansson, Laich, and Brouwer equals Pronger joining a d corps led by Shaone Morrisonn, but I just can't do it.

sure you can. the reported deal would have been one of alzner or carlson plus one of varly or neuvirth plus a 1st round pick for pronger.

pronger played one playoffs in philly and then broke down and was gone. further had mcphee not wanted to sign ridiculous extension that the flyers did, he would have trade those 3 assets for one season of pronger who would then have walked for nothing.

the same nothing that so many complain mcphee is not managing his assets well for trading eakin.

i am cleary saying there is no consistancy here. if mcphee does it, almost always the same group of people the complain that he wont do something then complains that he did it.

i just roll my eyes.

 

[mdurbin1234]

Just for the record, are you one of the guys who after 7 games said Holtby sucks and we need to trade for Luongo? I know there were a bunch of over reactors here. He's played 3 games, it took 30 for Ovechkin to get in the swing of things in the new system, I'll give him till the end oh his contract, if not the end of FF career before I start making statements about who won.

Don't worry though, you look great when getting called out on being an over reactive ******. WE NEED LUUUUUUUU HOLTBY SUCKS GUISE!

WE HAVE A WINNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNER!!!!!

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

sure you can. the reported deal would have been one of alzner or carlson plus one of varly or neuvirth plus a 1st round pick for pronger.

pronger played one playoffs in philly and then broke down and was gone. further had mcphee not wanted to sign ridiculous extension that the flyers did, he would have trade those 3 assets for one season of pronger who would then have walked for nothing.

the same nothing that so many complain mcphee is not managing his assets well for trading eakin.

i am cleary saying there is no consistancy here. if mcphee does it, almost always the same group of people the complain that he wont do something then complains that he did it.

i just roll my eyes.

You're completely missing the point so I'll spell it out. Trading young players for Pronger made sense because we actually had a need for for a top pairing defenseman. Trading young players for Erat made little sense because we have plenty of top 6 wingers.

 

[kicksavedave]

You're completely missing the point so I'll spell it out. Trading young players for Pronger made sense because we actually had a need for for a top pairing defenseman. Trading young players for Erat made little sense because we have plenty of top 6 wingers.

Yup, he completely missed the point. If you're going to trade top young prospects, you do it for a guy who can potentially put you over the top, or who fills a gaping need in a big way (turns a hole into a strength). Does anyone on the planet besides GMGM and TXPD really think Erat was all that was holding this team back from a Cup run?

You trade top prospects for guys who really don't change the composition of the team, who are somewhat superfluous to the current roster, you really haven't improved the team all that much, but paid a big price.

You can harp on on the Pronger specifics all you want... that's one example. It worked for Anaheim, he lead them to a Cup. Didn't work for Philly because they pulled the trigger way too late. So which example do you want to use?

 

[Capitlols]

You're completely missing the point so I'll spell it out. Trading young players for Pronger made sense because we actually had a need for for a top pairing defenseman. Trading young players for Erat made little sense because we have plenty of top 6 wingers.

Wouldn't say we have "plenty" of top 6 guys, it was a need, just not as glaring as a top 4 Dman.

The real issue with the trade is why do such a bold trade in a year where we clearly don't stand much of a chance for a cup(unless you believe in miracles), rather than doing it in the years we were flying high and winning President's Trophies.

 

[Chokingdogs]

good to be back. i feel right at home. mcphee is an idiot for trading young pospects like eakin and forsberg for older players like erat and ribeiro. we have also established that he is an idiot for not trading young players like alzner or carlson and varly or neuvirth for an older player like pronger.

do it. dont do it.

the capitals have won 7 in a row at playoff of time and the general manager of the team is a dripping fool. makes perfect sense to me. any monkey could have done it.

this, along with the devil's advocate response from the anti-makfi crowd, is what gets rinsed and repeated time and time again. makfi isnt a dripping fool, but he isnt exactly a mensa member when it comes to building a cup winning squad.

when the signs of his shortcomings were coming to life, the pro-makfi crowd used the finals run as point 1A to why he was "good". he lucked into that more than any other GM in the league i can think of. thats so far gone now it cannot be used. so the pro-makfi crowd would cite all the SE banners.....history has shown us they mean nothing.

now it's the "winning streak"? LOL

the caps could win out the regular season and this anti-makfi person would still want him gone. 16 years is long enough for this caps fan.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Wouldn't say we have "plenty" of top 6 guys, it was a need, just not as glaring as a top 4 Dman.

I would say we have plenty of top 6 wingers. It's ****ing preposterous that we have a wing 5th on the depth chart making $4.5 million.

 

[Langway]

I would say we have plenty of top 6 wingers. It's ****ing preposterous that we have a wing 5th on the depth chart making $4.5 million.

How about a sixth for $3M and a seventh for almost $2M?

That's not even counting Green.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

*edit*

Original post deleted. No use debating with people who do nothing but overreact.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Wouldn't say we have "plenty" of top 6 guys, it was a need, just not as glaring as a top 4 Dman.

The real issue with the trade is why do such a bold trade in a year where we clearly don't stand much of a chance for a cup(unless you believe in miracles), rather than doing it in the years we were flying high and winning President's Trophies.

Not sure I agree. There's no one in the East that looks unbeatable. The East is a sea of mediocrity with the Penguins a step above. If anything, this year looks like a year where any team, including the Caps, can make a run.

 

[NobodyBeatsTheWiz]

good to be back. i feel right at home. mcphee is an idiot for trading young pospects like eakin and forsberg for older players like erat and ribeiro. we have also established that he is an idiot for not trading young players like alzner or carlson and varly or neuvirth for an older player like pronger.

do it. dont do it.

the capitals have won 7 in a row at playoff of time and the general manager of the team is a dripping fool. makes perfect sense to me. any monkey could have done it.

Ah yes, the king of straw men and false dilemmas has returned.

 

[kicksavedave]

Thing is, there are two parts to a trade. One is simply the grades of the players involved, and the other part is the intangibles such as timing, framework, and concept. The value that the traded players bring to their new teams is only part of it, so that grade is obviously incomplete so far. But the timing seems wierd, the concept -young for old - need for surplus - cheap for expensive, can be graded today. On that aspect, the trade is a D, C- at best, because its a "go for it now" move made on a team that really isn't one player away. The move hampers our cap situation next year which will open up holes that we would need cheap draft picks to fill... but those draft picks are playing for other teams now.

The trade wreaked of desperation at a time when patience and franchise building was the right play... not "one player away" type moves.

 

[Capitlols]

I would say we have plenty of top 6 wingers. It's ****ing preposterous that we have a wing 5th on the depth chart making $4.5 million.

Not saying I liked the trade by any means, I wanted a top 4 Dman, but we don't have a plethora of top 6 guys. Erat brings more flair and consistency for the 2nd line than Laich, Ward, Fehr or anyone else. Obviously, I wouldn't want a 31 year W at the cost of a top prospect, it reeked of a job security move.

Not sure I agree. There's no one in the East that looks unbeatable. The East is a sea of mediocrity with the Penguins a step above. If anything, this year looks like a year where any team, including the Caps, can make a run.

This defense will easily be among the worst, if not the worst, in the playoffs and the PK is not going to get magically better. We're still largely a one line team and still lack the killer instinct to consistently put teams away. Do not see a miraculous cup run.

 

[bacchist]

I'm sure we will win the cup this year. Haters gonna hate.

 

[Kegger]

I'm sure we will win the cup this year. Haters gonna hate.

Not with this defensive corps. And that is GMGM's biggest flaw, accumulate skill, forget about grit, defense stays the same.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

The team is streaking at the right time, but they've got to make progress in the playoffs or it's all for nothing.

I wonder how vigorously TXPD will be here defending McPhee if we lose in the 1st or 2nd round again....

 

[msrulo]

Cardiac Caps will be at it again in the first round of the playoffs!

 

[Halpysback*]

Ah yes, the king of straw men and false dilemmas has returned.

All hail the king

 

[Liberati0n*]

Not with this defensive corps. And that is GMGM's biggest flaw, accumulate skill, forget about grit, defense stays the same.

You really think the primary problem with the defense is that it lacks grit?

 

[Kegger]

You really think the primary problem with the defense is that it lacks grit?

Didn't say that, the comma was meant to separate the two.
It would not hurt but I assume i am agreeing with you in that grit is not the primary problem.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Not saying I liked the trade by any means, I wanted a top 4 Dman, but we don't have a plethora of top 6 guys. Erat brings more flair and consistency for the 2nd line than Laich, Ward, Fehr or anyone else. Obviously, I wouldn't want a 31 year W at the cost of a top prospect, it reeked of a job security move.

This defense will easily be among the worst, if not the worst, in the playoffs and the PK is not going to get magically better. We're still largely a one line team and still lack the killer instinct to consistently put teams away. Do not see a miraculous cup run.

I'm in the wait and see category with the defense; for some reason I think they'll be better in the PO than during the regular season. Carlson is night and day in the play-offs. Erksine's game is a great fit for a 7 game series. The team I actually feel our defense matches up the worst with is NYI. Their speed is a nightmare for our guys. I don't think Toronto, Ottawa, or NYR will give us as many problems in the 1st Round as the NYI do. I think we'd take Montreal to the wood shed over a 7 game series.

I also necessarily don't agree with us being a one line team. I expressed concern a few weeks ago about Brouwer, Ribs, Ward, Chimera, MP, etc disappearing and this team relying on 90-19-8 to do everything, but the supporting cast has turned it around recently. Everyone has been contributing lately, including our defenseman. Getting a healthy Erat and Ward back will only continue to make the forward lines more dynamic.