Prospect Info: Leafs Development Camp

[Kiwi]

Random summer game though, rust is there for some who didn't go deep into the year or played in a U18 tournament.

IMO though RE: Goalies. Draft more. You can stagger development and decision time by going NCAA/Euro/Russian route.

CHL / Canada hasn't been producing *crazy* goalies lately. US program on the rise.

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

 

[Menzinger]

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

Agreed on Greenway, a guy who still looks much like he was at the draft (some VERY nice tools, but nothing close to a toolbox). Middleton could be a pleasant surprise through.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

I'm okay with it if it's a no brainer (like you see the next Carey Price and you're confident that you're getting a franchise goalie) but that is rare.

I'm okay with using 2nds-7ths (Woll was a great pick and didn't need to go high) and stashing them in the NCAA/Euro as well. 4 years to decide helps a lot.

Agreed on Greenway, a guy who still looks much like he was at the draft (some VERY nice tools, but nothing close to a toolbox). Middleton could be a pleasant surprise through.

Hockey IQ is key.

 

[zeke]

I love matt murray... He is a winner, a champion, but not a top end goaltender. He isn't top 5 in even 1 major category. I believe his top placing is 10th in the 4 major ones (gaa, sv, wins, shutouts). It depends how you classify being elite. From a pure stats stand point he isn't a top goalie in the league by any means. That doesn't mean I don't think hes good...

yeah he only has the best save percentage of any starting goalie in hockey over the last 2 seasons (his only 2 seasons).

 

[GardinerTheForward]

This^. Scott was drafted based on size and potential and we are still waiting. He has a long way to go to even be a Bibeau level prospect. I think I prefer the Andersson method of acquiring qoalies.

Are you a leafs fan or a canucks fan... or a troll? I've seen you on the vancouver boards talking trash about the leafs.

 

[Mikeyg]

yeah he only has the best save percentage of any starting goalie in hockey over the last 2 seasons (his only 2 seasons).

So were counting the 930 sv with 13 games rather than just looking at the 10th he had in a larger sample size this year? Thats reckless zeke, you can do better than that.

 

[Cor]

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

Kinda nailed my thoughts.

Was super excited to see Greenway, but was left wanting more.
Didn't care for Middleton, and now I think he could be poised for a big year

 

[ErnieLeafs]

yeah he only has the best save percentage of any starting goalie in hockey over the last 2 seasons (his only 2 seasons).

And stood on his head in 2 playoffs to lead his team to 2 cups before his ELC was up. He had help from Fleury in the second run, but his play has left little doubt that he would've gotten them there on his own anyway.

For the record, I'm not grumpy, I'm just too old for nonsense.

 

[zeke]

So were counting the 930 sv with 13 games rather than just looking at the 10th he had in a larger sample size this year? Thats reckless zeke, you can do better than that.

.925 so far in the regular season (62gms), .928 so far in the playoffs (32gms).

what's reckless?

 

[saltming]

Don't k ow if this was already posted but if it was this deserves to be seen again

 

[saltming]

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

Sad to hear that about greenway. He looked very good in the playoff run. Wisconsin leaned on him pretty heavily too.

 

[Nithoniniel]

.925 so far in the regular season (62gms), .928 so far in the playoffs (32gms).

what's reckless?

Not a huge sample size, but a consistent one. Add that the more in-depth sv% versions show the same thing.

 

[Mikeyg]

.925 so far in the regular season (62gms), .928 so far in the playoffs (32gms).

what's reckless?

You know damn well what you are trying to do. I live in the real world. Murray is the 9-14th best goalie in the league right now. Does he win a cup if hes on nashville or sj? I doubt it, but that is immaterial. Hes a good goalie on a dynasty quality team. That supports my original thesis that we don't need a top goalie to win and that we don't need to spend all resources on developing a goalie.

 

[biotk]

Counting regular season and playoffs over the last 2 seasons Murray has a 0.9258 SV% in 94 games. Holtby has 0.9237 in 154 games, Gibson 0.9214 in 110 games, Bob has 0.9206 in 105 games, Dubnyk has 0.9191 in 143 games, Andersen has 0.9190 in 120 games and Fleury 0.9169 in 113.

Ranking Murray as 9-14th in the league is completely bizarre to me.

 

[cookie]

Counting regular season and playoffs over the last 2 seasons Murray has a 0.9258 SV% in 94 games. Holtby has 0.9237 in 154 games, Gibson 0.9214 in 110 games, Bob has 0.9206 in 105 games, Dubnyk has 0.9191 in 143 games, Andersen has 0.9190 in 120 games and Fleury 0.9169 in 113.

Ranking Murray as 9-14th in the league is completely bizarre to me.

I think we need to dig deeper than just save percentage points in determining goaltender rankings.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/in-the-nhl-save-percentage-is-a-team-stat/

This is an excellent read.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

You know damn well what you are trying to do. I live in the real world. Murray is the 9-14th best goalie in the league right now. Does he win a cup if hes on nashville or sj? I doubt it, but that is immaterial. Hes a good goalie on a dynasty quality team. That supports my original thesis that we don't need a top goalie to win and that we don't need to spend all resources on developing a goalie.

Nobody said anything about spending "all resources" on goaltending. We could use some young, highly rated talent at the position, like we had with Rask, when 3rd rounder Pogge was supposed to be the answer.

Goaltending is often the difference in winning championships, like I stated with Murray, and others like Quick, Fleury, Hasek, Ward (when he was prime). A great goalie can carry a team.

 

[Mikeyg]

Nobody said anything about spending "all resources" on goaltending. We could use some young, highly rated talent at the position, like we had with Rask, when 3rd rounder Pogge was supposed to be the answer.

Goaltending is often the difference in winning championships, like I stated with Murray, and others like Quick, Fleury, Hasek, Ward (when he was prime). A great goalie can carry a team.

I just don't think it is necessary. Since 2007 theres only been 2 goalies that imo were top end at the time (Quick and Thomas). Crawford is average, Giguere is average, Osgood at that time in his career was average (they won in his .914 sv season) as well. History does not support this notion that winners need a great goalie to carry them. I think the most likely scenario is that you just can't be weak back there. Average is fine, i'd rather spend the flexibility elsewhere.

 

[LeafChief]

I just don't think it is necessary. Since 2007 theres only been 2 goalies that imo were top end at the time (Quick and Thomas). Crawford is average, Giguere is average, Osgood at that time in his career was average (they won in his .914 sv season) as well. History does not support this notion that winners need a great goalie to carry them. I think the most likely scenario is that you just can't be weak back there. Average is fine, i'd rather spend the flexibility elsewhere.

I stand proud with Mikeyg!!!

gang gang gang

 

[hullsy47]

I can understand rusty but some of those guys were brutal
I've been pretty excited by Greenway but man he was all over the place defensively

Middleton has been a really nice surprise
He's got good mobility he's excellent in his own zone and he's looked much better offensively than I expected and Liljegren just straight up looks good

As long as we're not burning high picks on goalies I'm fine
If your going to do that you may as well just trade for one that's already developed
I'm in the take one mid to late rounds every year and stash them away in Europe and the NCAA camp

I bet the drafted prospect just ramped up their offseason workout
after the first round there are still lots of kids that can play ,the draft could go 20 rounds a year ,if hockey had like 15 minor leagues like baseball does ,

 

[ErnieLeafs]

I stand proud with Mikeyg!!!

gang gang gang

Urban Dictionary tells me all I need to know about this response...

Stand proudly denying the truth? Good on ya, I guess?

LA was an 8 seed. Quick backstopped a cup. Matt Murray, last year, stood on his head. Was excellent again this year. Rinne carried Nashville to the finals this year.

Goaltending is essential to success.

 

[glue]

Not sure if someone already shared - https://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/2017/07/12/six-step-up-at-maple-leafs-development-camp.html

 

[TML Dynasty]

In the video of Lou's interview he mentions the 'shooting room' the leafs prospects have access to....I guess at Ricoh. Anyone have any info about it? I imagine a room with a net and targets and a plastic floor to mimic ice......but maybe theirs is super hi tech?

https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/.../toronto-maple-leafs-development-camp-wrap-up

Just curious

 

[Mikeyg]

Urban Dictionary tells me all I need to know about this response...

Stand proudly denying the truth? Good on ya, I guess?

LA was an 8 seed. Quick backstopped a cup. Matt Murray, last year, stood on his head. Was excellent again this year. Rinne carried Nashville to the finals this year.

Goaltending is essential to success.

Grumpy... you are distorting reality again. I literally just credited Quick in the above comment. The Rinne comment is a reach at best... where does this madness stop Grumpy? Going to model after semi final finishers too?

Actually the more I think about it, the Rinne argument kills your thesis. 7 mill on a guy who wasn't mentally tough enough to even show up in half of the cup final games? Imagine if that was toronto, oh the fireworks.... c'mon grumpy. I'd rather pay an average starter average money and upgrade the team in other places.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

Grumpy... you are distorting reality again. I literally just credited Quick in the above comment. The Rinne comment is a reach at best... where does this madness stop Grumpy? Going to model after semi final finishers too?

Actually the more I think about it, the Rinne argument kills your thesis. 7 mill on a guy who wasn't mentally tough enough to even show up in half of the cup final games? Imagine if that was toronto, oh the fireworks.... c'mon grumpy. I'd rather pay an average starter average money and upgrade the team in other places.

Is "grumpy" really supposed to.... bother me? Not sure what the continuing issue you're having is all about, but your embarrassing yourself by namecalling like a child.

Rinne carried that team to the final, and would have easily been the Conn Smythe winner if his team could have figured out a way to beat Murray. The other stellar goalie I mentioned shut the door almost completely.

This is really just another example of you arguing mindlessly for the sake of it. My point was that it would be nice to have a great young goalie prospect in the pipeline. There's zero grounds to argue that it's a bad thing, but yet, here you are.

 

[nuck]

Are you a leafs fan or a canucks fan... or a troll? I've seen you on the vancouver boards talking trash about the leafs.

If you bother to look at my 6000 posts on this forum you would know I am a Leafs fan. As far as the Canucks board goes I think you are mistaking me for someone with a similar handle. I post there once a month or so, just like one the Flames or Oilers boards. When I feel compelled to take a shot at something the Leafs do it would probably be on this board.