Leafs Core and Cap Looking Forward

[Daisy Jane]

Right.

well I think that we stick with our rookies for the wings (Levio, Broll, etc have looked pretty good so far) so I can do well with saying adieu to Kulemin.

we keep McClement & Brolland.

I think if i'm Nonis - I'm keeping
Phaneuf
Fraser
Franson (for the right handed shot).


I'm not sure Gardiner has a big leg to stand on, so we could in essence qualify him for lower dollars AAV. (or if we go by scuttlebutt, he's being traded anyway).

 

[New Liskeard]

we're going to have to say goodbye to someone.

for what it is worth: I want Bolland and McClement first (I think we'd miss what Kulemin would bring to the table, but to me, McClement IS our PK).


Defense wise:
Ranger, Gardiner, Franson, Fraser, Phaneuf

I say that Ranger goes, if Franson is great by the end of the year; he gets his pay day, Fraser gets a little something, and Gardiner.. (shrug). he's a mystery. I think the cog is Phaneuf and when he gets signed. (i'd say it won't go down to the wire, it will be done in season or not at all, imo).

i think what every team is hoping that the cap goes up tremendously due to the 6 outdoor games. [seriously - the league really needs to consider a luxury cap.] but if Pittsburgh can do it, we can do it.

Actually Ranger I can see staying. I believe he will improve (he has so far) despite what the Ranger haters say. The key being is he, seems to only wants to play for Toronto, and is likely to sign a reasonable deal. Franson is almost a shoo in IMHO.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Right.

well I think that we stick with our rookies for the wings (Levio, Broll, etc have looked pretty good so far) so I can do well with saying adieu to Kulemin.

we keep McClement & Brolland.

I think if i'm Nonis - I'm keeping
Phaneuf
Fraser
Franson (for the right handed shot).


I'm not sure Gardiner has a big leg to stand on, so we could in essence qualify him for lower dollars AAV. (or if we go by scuttlebutt, he's being traded anyway).

I would love Mcclement to re-sign at 1.5. Raymond is a discount that we will not have next season at the same salary. Franson is going to get a raise too.

The good teams recoup the losses with younger cheaper quality depth. We have plenty luckily through the draft. Have to keep this model going so we can be competitive for many years and not just 1 or 2.

 

[Sergei Berezin]

Posted this in the other Bolland thread:

I don't see Bolland getting a raise, unless of course he has a huge season points-wise, but I see him optimistically maxing out at around 40 points this season, which would be around his career average.

So what are comparables for 40 point 3rd line C's?

Chris Kelly at 3M x 4 years seems like a perfect comparison. Playoff performer good for 30-40 points a year.

Tyler Kennedy just signed a 2 year deal worth 2.35 per year. He's younger than Kelly but also playoff proven.

Jarret Stoll at 3.25 for 3 years is also a similar player/deal you should expect. Peverly was signed to the same deal a couple of years ago as well.

Boyd Gordon who is good for about 15 points a season signing for 3X3 this summer kinda killed the market, though.

Martin Hanzal and Dainius Zubrus have a cap hit of 3.1.

Kyle Brodziak signed a 3 year deal worth 2.833 and is usually good for the lower part of the 30-40, but did hit 44 in his last full season.


In conclusion... expect a 4 year deal worth 2.8-3.3...depending on the season Bolland has.

 

[Sergei Berezin]

Remember that Bolland signed a 5 year deal at 3.375 after his 47 point season (which seems to be an anomaly), where the Hawks thought there'd be some progression offensively, and also I think after that Dale Tallon fail where they forgot to send QO's to their RFAs and were forced to sign above market deals to all the guys they could afford to keep.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Kadri folks, what do we do with him if he hits 70 points in one of his next 2 seasons?

Long term or will he out price himself on our team?

 

[Sergei Berezin]

Remember we also have 2.5M coming off the books from buyouts and retained salary.

Also, JM Liles at 3.87 for 2 years becomes much more attractive with the cap going up, so I'm assuming he'll get a shot somewhere, even if it means we retain $1-$1.5M in salary.

 

[Mess]

IMO Leafs have toooo much money invested in wingers the least important position on a hockey team.

Leafs are getting killed in the face-off dot this year because they are weak at center and getting outshot on regularity because offense and chances are most often created by playmaking centers.

I think in the future money and cap will need to be reallocated from the wingers into more critical positions on the team including centers and dmen in hopes of being more successful in the future.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Posted this in the other Bolland thread:

I don't see Bolland getting a raise, unless of course he has a huge season points-wise, but I see him optimistically maxing out at around 40 points this season, which would be around his career average.

So what are comparables for 40 point 3rd line C's?

Chris Kelly at 3M x 4 years seems like a perfect comparison. Playoff performer good for 30-40 points a year.

Tyler Kennedy just signed a 2 year deal worth 2.35 per year. He's younger than Kelly but also playoff proven.

Jarret Stoll at 3.25 for 3 years is also a similar player/deal you should expect. Peverly was signed to the same deal a couple of years ago as well.

Boyd Gordon who is good for about 15 points a season signing for 3X3 this summer kinda killed the market, though.

Martin Hanzal and Dainius Zubrus have a cap hit of 3.1.

Kyle Brodziak signed a 3 year deal worth 2.833 and is usually good for the lower part of the 30-40, but did hit 44 in his last full season.


In conclusion... expect a 4 year deal worth 2.8-3.3...depending on the season Bolland has.

If Bolland agrees to a 3.5 x 5 years, I would do that deal all day long. Will bring him to 32 and this is just about right for the hard way he plays.

 

[Kurisu]

IMO Leafs have toooo much money invested in wingers the least important position on a hockey team.

Leafs are getting killed in the face-off dot this year because they are weak at center and getting outshot on regularity because offense and chances are most often created by playmaking centers.

I think in the future money and cap will need to be reallocated from the wingers into more critical positions on the team including centers and dmen in hopes of being more successful in the future.

you keep saying the same ********** BS over and over again but you don't give a solution. Our center core form 2-4 is good if Kadri keeps progressing, despite that, we suck on faceoffs this year. Even if we acquire an elite #1 center, 1 guy won't change the faceoff prowess of our other centers. Who do we acquire to be our #1 center? Give an answer please, this time instead of dodging the question.

 

[notdoneyet]

next year if cap is at 70M(not necessarily lines or d pairing just cap purposes)

players in BOLD need to be signed and cap hit

jvr 4.25 Bozak 4.2 Kessel 8.0
Lupul 5.25 Kadri 2.9 Clarkson 5.25
Raymond 2.0 Bolland 4.0 Ashton 840K
Orr 925K Mclement 2.5 maclaren 700K
Broll 590K

Phaneuf 7.0 Gunnarsson 3.150
Franson 4.0 Fraser 1.75
Gardiner 2.5 Ranger 2.0
Rielly 895K

Bernier 2.9

total 65.5M leaves 4.5M in cap space to sign

kulemin?
reimer?

trade liles or regular buyout

so in reality not as bad as it looks

 

[TmlHockeyFan]

Dude's making $3,375,000 aav right now.
giving him 4 and a bit to ensure he stays with us doesn't seem that bad. unless he gives us a discount. Nonis COULD spin that.

Then we must get rid of Bozak (when Kadri's contract expires). I'd prefer Bolland over Bozak anyways.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

IMO Leafs have toooo much money invested in wingers the least important position on a hockey team.

Leafs are getting killed in the face-off dot this year because they are weak at center and getting outshot on regularity because offense and chances are most often created by playmaking centers.

I think in the future money and cap will need to be reallocated from the wingers into more critical positions on the team including centers and dmen in hopes of being more successful in the future.

I don't think we are weak at Center, we don't have that elite C, and it works on our team because we would have to say goodbye to one of our core players or Dion if we had a 6.8 Kopitar cap hit.

I think we are one D man, top 4 guy away from being a legitimate contender. This would really solidify our defensive pairings and allow Rielly to eat up 3rd and 4th line competition.

 

[TheLeastOfTheBunch]

Unless Bolland puts up 50+ points, 4mil is too much.

Agreed. Will be interesting to see how things work out. Gotta' ship out Liles somehow

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Then we must get rid of Bozak (when Kadri's contract expires). I'd prefer Bolland over Bozak anyways.

Bozak's contract is one of the best cap allocations we have on the team.

 

[member 147413]

Players who I think are important pieces over to next year.

JVR - Kadri - Kessel
Lupul - _____ - _____
Raymond - Bolland - Leivo
Devane - McClemment - Ashton
Orr

Phaneuf - _____
Gunnar - Franson
Rielly - MacWilliam


Bernier
_____

JVR - 4.25
Kadri - 2.9
Kessel - 8.0
Lupul - 5.25
Raymond - 2.5
Bolland - 3.0
Leivo - 925,000
Devane - 750,000
McClemment - 1.75
Ashton - 1.0
Orr - 925,000

Phaneuf - 6.5
Gunnar - 3.15
Franson - 4.5
Rielly - 894,167
MacWilliam - 875,000

Bernier - 2.9

Likely that the C and RW spot are filled by Bozak and Clarkson... I also think Brennan will be our #6/7 and will rotate with MacWilliam...

Bozak - 4.2
Clarkson - 5.25
Brennan - 925,000

That equates to... 64,456,667 with 1,195,000 in bonuses, still with a #2 dman and back-up goalie missing...

Looks like next year will be even tighter cap wise then this year.

 

[notdoneyet]

Kadri folks, what do we do with him if he hits 70 points in one of his next 2 seasons?

Long term or will he out price himself on our team?

kadri will still be a RFA in 2015-16 when his contract is up

if the cap goes up next year to 70M as suggested then
it will also go up in 15/16 which will pay for kadri's increase.

in 15/16 we only have to sign bernier and kadri who are both RFA

and orr and maclaren are UFA's but by that time one of broll or devane will be more than ready to assume that spot

 

[Daisy Jane]

Actually Ranger I can see staying. I believe he will improve (he has so far) despite what the Ranger haters say. The key being is he, seems to only wants to play for Toronto, and is likely to sign a reasonable deal. Franson is almost a shoo in IMHO.

i forgot about that. that could play in our favour - his wanting to play in Toronto. (and i think his play is getting better every game).

I can see Kadri pricing himself out for money to be honest.

Mess - then who do you suggest?

 

[notdoneyet]

Then we must get rid of Bozak (when Kadri's contract expires). I'd prefer Bolland over Bozak anyways.

again kadri's contract expires in 15/16 and he is still a RFA

his salary jump will be easily handled by the cap going up

 

[The Winter Soldier]

again kadri's contract expires in 15/16 and he is still a RFA

his salary jump will be easily handled by the cap going up

Kadri's negotiations were tough this summer, I can imagine how they will be in 2 summers.

He's a very talented player, I have always been a Kadri supporter, but what is he a Tavares Cap hit? Or do we go for another bridge deal? This one looks like one of the tougher ones. He's a core player that may be too expensive unless we deal Bozak, Bolland, or Naz himself. If he asks for more than Nonis has priced him at.

 

[sommervr]

Bozak's contract is one of the best cap allocations we have on the team.

You pump Bozak's tires like it is your job. Is it your job?

 

[notdoneyet]

Kadri's negotiations were tough this summer, I can imagine how they will be in 2 summers.

He's a very talented player, I have always been a Kadri supporter, but what is he a Tavares Cap hit? Or do we go for another bridge deal? This one looks like one of the tougher ones. He's a core player that may be too expensive unless we deal Bozak, Bolland, or Naz himself. If he asks for more than Nonis has priced him at.

If he is a tavares cap hit then that means he is finally a #1C and 90 point player.
If this happens I will be very happy to drive him to the bank to cash that
big cheque

But seriously there is no way the cap hit is not going up in 15/16
just like it did every year before the lockout. He is making 2.9M right now
and his qualifying offer is around 3.4M. so again the ball is in DN's court.
I dont know is kadri is eligible for arbitration yet but even if he is
his raise shouldnt be more than 2M more than he makes now(5M X 4yr)

again cap raise should cover that easy enough

 

[Daisy Jane]

Kadri's negotiations were tough this summer, I can imagine how they will be in 2 summers.

He's a very talented player, I have always been a Kadri supporter, but what is he a Tavares Cap hit? Or do we go for another bridge deal? This one looks like one of the tougher ones. He's a core player that may be too expensive unless we deal Bozak, Bolland, or Naz himself. If he asks for more than Nonis has priced him at.

that one will be interesting.

Lupul - you can very well argue, took a cut to play here (five years), and when healthy the guys a beast

JVR (we're living on Holmgren's very rare good sense here) - but I've heard chirpings of how much he loves Toronto, so I could see him signing a discount if the years are right.

Bozak took a hit on years for a little bit more dough (which is okay, in my book).

all rumours are saying that Phaneuf would be willing to take a hit on one or the other (cash OR years, depending on what the exact numbers are).

You can even argue that while Phil cashed in at the 8x8, he could very well have gotten more on the open market. there are stupid gms out there who would have done it, so I'm led to believe with that Phil took some cash off the table to stay in Toronto.

McClement left cash on the Table, as did Clarkson.

Nonis' mantra has been "tell me you want to stay here, and we'll make it work." so he's willing to pay market value on ONE but I don't think on both, and going by the status quo so far, the players are game to make it worth.

So if Kadri demands the money - and it makes no sense (for the team), i can see him being traded.

 

[notdoneyet]

You pump Bozak's tires like it is your job. Is it your job?

in reality Bozak is a third line center on most teams.

as such he is over paid by about 1M per year

in other words for what he brings to the table his cap hit should be 3.2M not 4.2M
but that is what happens when a player reaches free agency and there is
not much out there to replace him with. Bozak cashed in at the right time.

 

[notdoneyet]

that one will be interesting.

Lupul - you can very well argue, took a cut to play here (five years), and when healthy the guys a beast

JVR (we're living on Holmgren's very rare good sense here) - but I've heard chirpings of how much he loves Toronto, so I could see him signing a discount if the years are right.

Bozak took a hit on years for a little bit more dough (which is okay, in my book).

all rumours are saying that Phaneuf would be willing to take a hit on one or the other (cash OR years, depending on what the exact numbers are).

You can even argue that while Phil cashed in at the 8x8, he could very well have gotten more on the open market. there are stupid gms out there who would have done it, so I'm led to believe with that Phil took some cash off the table to stay in Toronto.

McClement left cash on the Table, as did Clarkson.

Nonis' mantra has been "tell me you want to stay here, and we'll make it work." so he's willing to pay market value on ONE but I don't think on both, and going by the status quo so far, the players are game to make it worth.

So if Kadri demands the money - and it makes no sense (for the team), i can see him being traded.

Lupul probably got a little more because burke liked him. I dont think at the time he could have gotten as much or more that what we gave him. Remember he has
never played a full season yet in his entire career and other GM's were
afraid to put long term money into a player with his background.

Dont get me wrong I love lupul and he IS one of the best players in the league when he is healthy but that is the key.I'm really glad we traded for him and locked him up.