Friedman: Leafs and Matthews discusing extension?

[nabob]

I would suggest that you and all the others who are saying he will bolt from Toronto the second he has a chance are being ignorant.

That's implying that the leafs would even let him get to UFA status...which they never will. Teams simply do NOT luck onto a player like AM, spend years developing him while building around him only to let him walk.

Assuming the Leafs wouldn’t let him become a UFA ever is like Islander fans assuming they would have never lost JT when he signed with his home town. I have a news flash for you. The player decides if he goes to UFA status or not. Teams can’t force him to forgo becoming a UFA.

 

[FerrisRox]

Neither has Auston Matthews

Cool.

You know that nobody claimed he did, while the post I was responding to was talking about when Malkin and Crosby hit UFA.

 

[nabob]

I don't see how Arizona can win if they pay Matthews an amount the Leafs won't, unless they become an NHL cap team. I don't think any NHL team can pay a player a close to 20% of there full salary and win. If Arizona keeps the same budget they have now, or even just slightly increases, but allocate that money to Matthews they will still have significant issues winning. Matthews helps you win, but only at a certain price-point, or as a certain percentage of your salary expenditures.

Let's assume Matthews gets 17% of the cap (slightly more than what McDavid gets right now on a deal he signed as an RFA). Right now, Arizona has 9 million in Cap space. That's before realizing they have only 64,000,000 million (roughly 16 million below the cap) in salaries expenditures. Then factor in that 80% of Hossa's and Booth's contract is covered by insurance. So, in reality, Arizona is spending about 56,000,000 in actual salary. Paying Matthews 17% of the NHL cap would account for 13.6M under the current Cap, but on a team like Arizona that would account for roughly 25% of their salary. I don't care if its Gretzky in his prime, I don't think any NHL player could help a team win when he accounts for that much of the team's salary expenditure. Getting Matthews won't immediately make it viable for them to spend to the cap.

So you’re saying a team can never win if they have a player on their roster who is over paid by possible $3-4M dollars...it happens all the time.

You’re also assuming their roster and cap situation really won’t change much in 6 years.

The Leafs can’t even afford to sign Nylander right now to a fair contract, he possibly takes a bridge and is making huge money by the time Matthews becomes a UFA. Then they’ll have to pay toneother resign Gardner or an improvement which won’t be cheap. If I was a Leafs fan having Matthews sign for less than 7/8 years would be a terrible proposition.

My actual bet would be that he signs a 5 year deal to become a UFA quickly and signs with the Rangers who will be a strong competitor after having rebuilt their roster which they started doing last year. He seems like the type of guy who would love playing in New York as he handles the media really well and suits the city.

 

[93LEAFS]

So you’re saying a team can never win if they have a player on their roster who is over paid by possible $3-4M dollars...it happens all the time.

You’re also assuming their roster and cap situation really won’t change much in 6 years.

The Leafs can’t even afford to sign Nylander right now to a fair contract, he possibly takes a bridge and is making huge money by the time Matthews becomes a UFA. Then they’ll have to pay toneother resign Gardner or an improvement which won’t be cheap. If I was a Leafs fan having Matthews sign for less than 7/8 years would be a terrible proposition.

My actual bet would be that he signs a 5 year deal to become a UFA quickly and signs with the Rangers who will be a strong competitor after having rebuilt their roster which they started doing last year. He seems like the type of guy who would love playing in New York as he handles the media really well and suits the city.

What I'm assuming is the Coyotes don't have the economic base to pay Matthews that type of money. They only spend to 70% of the cap right now when you ignore the contracts they aren't actually paying due to insurance. It doesn't matter the actual money but the percentages. So, what I am saying is, no, you can't have a guy overpaid by 3 to 4 million when you only spend 70% of the cap. If the Coyotes need Matthews as much as you think, how do you think they can raise the money to afford to spend more at than they currently do? At least by a significant margin.

Nylander and Gardiner are different, if you think they'll be treated the same it different. Gardiner will be replaced internally by Dermott. The Leafs can afford Nylander right now, we just can't afford to overpay him like you did Draisaitl. Great, hope for that. It seems to be what you want. I doubt you are right.

 

[The Man with a Plan]

Assuming the Leafs wouldn’t let him become a UFA ever is like Islander fans assuming they would have never lost JT when he signed with his home town. I have a news flash for you. The player decides if he goes to UFA status or not. Teams can’t force him to forgo becoming a UFA.

You really don't understand the difference between the situations do you...lol damn.

JT spent 9 years with the Isles. They had plenty of time to build around him properly. Snow and company shit the bed on building a competitive team. Time after time.

The Leafs however have built around AM quite well thus far... even bringing in JT to help form a double headed monster for opposing teams to have to deal with the Matthews line being followed by JT and Marner. The Leafs are already a better and much more competitive team then the Isles ever were during JTs time there.

If you think AM walks away from that... you are just deluding yourself to help with your issues with the Leafs.

 

[The Man with a Plan]

The Leafs can’t even afford to sign Nylander right now to a fair contract, he possibly takes a bridge and is making huge money by the time Matthews becomes a UFA

Once again you are dead wrong.

The Leafs can afford to sign him, they just won't unless it is a reasonable deal. A salary that he has earned and deserves. 8+ mill is not that. Simple as that.

 

[member 290103]

Once again you are dead wrong.

The Leafs can afford to sign him, they just won't unless it is a reasonable deal. A salary that he has earned and deserves. 8+ mill is not that. Simple as that.

They cant afford him. If they could, they'd have signed him

 

[The Man with a Plan]

They cant afford him. If they could, they'd have signed him

It is obvious that logic escapes you. I'm done talking to you about your fantasies and delusions. I'd seriously suggest therapy.

 

[Maplebeasts]

The money they would rake in by having a hometown top 10 player in the league would easily be enough to cover any overpay they’d have to make.

You're deluded. A population that doesn't give a shit about hockey won't care unless the team is winning, something they will not be doing operating under an internal budget and bleeding money.

 

[Pelle31]

I would suggest that you and all the others who are saying he will bolt from Toronto the second he has a chance are being ignorant.

That's implying that the leafs would even let him get to UFA status...which they never will. Teams simply do NOT luck onto a player like AM, spend years developing him while building around him only to let him walk.

You'll get your answer when Matthews signs his next deal whether he might consider bolting to another team when he hits unrestricted free agency. If he signs a deal that brings him to UFA status then the speculation will begin if he's going to stay in Toronto when his contract runs out. I'm sure there will be lots of opposing fans (some Islanders fans) will hope for that. One thing with Tavares signing in Toronto after saying all that bullshit about wanting to stay in Long Island has made lots of fans skeptical about their pending UFA stars resigning with their teams.

 

[Menzinger]

Ok, let me rephrase, I have a very strong suspicion that Matthews has misgivings about the assembly of the Maple Leafs and will eventually ask to be traded. I don't believe Kyle Dubas understands how to assemble a pro team given his pursuit of John Tavares and his failure to recognize the need to trade Nylander to rectify his putrid d-corps.

You’re absolutely right, what a blunder it was adding a 28 year old 1C for nothing but capspace

 

[Steeze]

I predict, and I am quite confident in this, that Matthews will sour on Babcock very quickly and he representation will suggest that maybe it is best he is traded. A team like Phoenix could offer the return of a top end blue liner, and is probably a logical place for him to move to.

I predict - and I am quite confident of this - that you have no idea what you're talking about. There's no evidence that suggests him leaving that should inspire any confidence whatsoever besides wishful thinking.

 

[Llewzaher]

As much as I would love to have Matthews on the Coyotes , I really dont see it happening .

Has Matthews ever hinted that he would,like to play for Arizona?

Who says he actually wants to play for them? Tavares is the only player that comes to mind about taking less to play for his favorite team as a child. ( I am sure they may be a few nore ) If Torono didnt have the players that they did I am not sure he would be playing for them now.

It was kind of a perfect storm that brought Tavares to Toronto. IMO.

The only thing that may push Matthews out of Toronto , may be the media . But as long as they are winning , I dont see him wanting to leave ... Why not sign for 8 years?

 

[Stickpucker]

Give him 500k more than Tavares at 8 years and call it a day.

He knows where he is in the pecker order and give small discount.

 

[AK87]

I think that Elliotte thinks that he thinks that Matthews and the Leafs are thinking of a number that they think could make Matthews think of signing a shorter extension. I think.

I don't pay you to think.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

It'd be nice to get some good news regarding contract extensions seeing as our Swedish boy is playing hardball.

Remember when we were going to sign all three at once (according to some) and make that big new splash? Might be a little more difficult than that.

 

[powerstuck]

I don't see how Arizona can win if they pay Matthews an amount the Leafs won't, unless they become an NHL cap team. I don't think any NHL team can pay a player a close to 20% of there full salary and win. If Arizona keeps the same budget they have now, or even just slightly increases, but allocate that money to Matthews they will still have significant issues winning. Matthews helps you win, but only at a certain price-point, or as a certain percentage of your salary expenditures.

Let's assume Matthews gets 17% of the cap (slightly more than what McDavid gets right now on a deal he signed as an RFA). Right now, Arizona has 9 million in Cap space. That's before realizing they have only 64,000,000 million (roughly 16 million below the cap) in salaries expenditures. Then factor in that 80% of Hossa's and Booth's contract is covered by insurance. So, in reality, Arizona is spending about 56,000,000 in actual salary. Paying Matthews 17% of the NHL cap would account for 13.6M under the current Cap, but on a team like Arizona that would account for roughly 25% of their salary. I don't care if its Gretzky in his prime, I don't think any NHL player could help a team win when he accounts for that much of the team's salary expenditure. Getting Matthews won't immediately make it viable for them to spend to the cap.

Currently, Coyotes have 8,4M in cap space...that's about 4 millions less than Leafs.

 

[FerrisRox]

It is a mythical solution. No hometown guy has saved a market in any sport outside of maybe the Rocket in Montreal. If they don't win the novelty will quickly disappear.

The desert lacks hockey fans, that won't just improve because they have a local kid.

California lacked hockey fans until Wayne Gretzky showed up and made all kinds of new fans.

It's silly to suggest that Matthews in that market wouldn't "improve" the lack of hockey fans. If Matthews came to Arizona and there was a spark of interest in the team with a big, splashy singing of a local boy, he could very well have a Gretzky-esque affect in that market.

After Gretzky joined the Kings the amount of arenas built in the area began to spike, local high school suddenly had a hockey team and new franchises popped up in San Jose and Anaheim.

Now, a generation later, California natives are being drafted into the NHL because his arrival and the excitement around having the top player in the game in the market turned on all kinds of people to NHL hockey.

 

[FerrisRox]

That's implying that the leafs would even let him get to UFA status...which they never will.

I don't pretend to know what Matthews would want to do nor do I have any reason to believe that he has any interest in leaving Toronto or playing at home, but I do know this: the Leafs have zero say in whether he gets to free agency.

What do you mean they would never "let him" get to UFA status? How would they stop him?

 

[FerrisRox]

No, you are greatly assuming things. Teams aren't saved by home-town hero's in any sport, there is almost no solid example of this since The Rocket across any league. The closest is maybe Joe Mauer.

Maybe Joe Mauer? That team was on the verge of being contracted before Mauer arrived and revitalized that franchise and, more importantly that fanbase. You can say the same thing about Barry Bonds. The Giants were in serious trouble and were in talks to move the franchise when Barry Bonds was brought in. Not only a San Fran native but the son of a star player from the past. The Giants soon became on the flagship teams in Major League Baseball thanks to Bonds and his record-setting home run chase.

The situation with the Arizona market is very unique. As a non traditional market where a lot of locals have no hockey history and no connection to the game, having a local kid who was not only playing in the NHL but doing so at a high end level would give many fans that connection to the team and the sport and would tell kids in Arizona that hockey is a viable thing for them to do as well.

I think it's a very unique situation and I think if he ever did his free agency no team would go after him harder than the Coyotes would.

 

[BAM]

Maybe Joe Mauer? That team was on the verge of being contracted before Mauer arrived and revitalized that franchise and, more importantly that fanbase. You can say the same thing about Barry Bonds. The Giants were in serious trouble and were in talks to move the franchise when Barry Bonds was brought in. Not only a San Fran native but the son of a star player from the past. The Giants soon became on the flagship teams in Major League Baseball thanks to Bonds and his record-setting home run chase.

The situation with the Arizona market is very unique. As a non traditional market where a lot of locals have no hockey history and no connection to the game, having a local kid who was not only playing in the NHL but doing so at a high end level would give many fans that connection to the team and the sport and would tell kids in Arizona that hockey is a viable thing for them to do as well.

I think it's a very unique situation and I think if he ever did his free agency no team would go after him harder than the Coyotes would.

1. Mauer was drafted by the twins, different situation.
2. Those talks with the Giants potentially moving started way back in the 70's, it's not like Bond's signing was the only thing that kept them in San Francisco. The Giants were one of the most storied teams in baseball far before Bonds lmao, they're one of the oldest teams in baseball and one of the original NY teams.
3. A team that trades for retired players to reach the CAP FLOOR, is not going to have money to give the richest contract in the league.

 

[FerrisRox]

You're deluded. A population that doesn't give a **** about hockey won't care unless the team is winning, something they will not be doing operating under an internal budget and bleeding money.

Again, people said that Los Angeles didn't care about hockey and that it would never get on the radar of sports fan in California. Until it did. And then it grew, and now there are three healthy franchises in Cali.

The Kings didn't become big contenders when they got Gretzky, but he captured the imagination of fans and suddenly going to the Kings game became the thing to do in Los Angeles. I don't see how it's a huge stretch to suggest that Matthews could do the same with the Coyotes.

 

[FerrisRox]

1. Mauer was drafted by the twins, different situation.

How he was acquired is totally irrelevant. The topic is about a local boy capturing the imaginations of fans and turning around a team's fortunes. How he was acquired has nothing to do with it.

2. Those talks with the Giants potentially moving started way back in the 70's, it's not like Bond's signing was the only thing that kept them in San Francisco. The Giants were one of the most storied teams in baseball far before Bonds lmao, they're one of the oldest teams in baseball and one of the original NY teams.

Since Bonds came to San Francisco, those talks were never heard again. That's exactly my point. The Giants potentially moving before (including almost to Toronto before the Blue Jays) is exactly what I'm talking about. The team was never on solid ground in that market and was always in a shaky financial situation because the fans never embraced the franchise... until Barry Bonds came. He turned them from an afterthought to the hottest ticket in town and and since his years with the club, they went from the outhouse to the penthouse.

Saying the San Francisco Giants, before Bonds, were "one of the most storied teams in baseball" is laughable. They nearly got moved to Toronto and Tampa Bay and were rumoured in several other cities. Their time, and their history in New York is completely irrelevant. Why would you even bring that up? What does it have to do with the topic of a team being revitalized by a hometown hero?

3. A team that trades for retired players to reach the CAP FLOOR, is not going to have money to give the richest contract in the league.

You don't think bringing in a star player like Matthews would help them at the gate? Los Angeles Kings games went from tons of empty seats to sell outs after Gretzky arrived... Also, why would it have to be the richest contract in the league? Did John Tavares take the most money available to him this summer, or did he take less in order to go home?

 

[threeVo]

8 X 96 would be a solid deal for both sides.

 

[93LEAFS]

Currently, Coyotes have 8,4M in cap space...that's about 4 millions less than Leafs.

Look at actual salary expenditure. They are spending like 54 to 56 million a year when you remove the insured contract on their books.