Player Discussion Kirill Kaprizov (Part 2)

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16thOverallSaveUs

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If Guerin was really just standing on 7/8 years since April, then he was the asshole. If Guerin comes down to 4/5 years and Kaprizov/agent remain standing on 3 or less, then they're the asshole. If Kaprizov/agent need $10+ million to get to 4 years, or are expecting $10M for 3 years, then they're the asshole.

Still a lot TBD.
Guerin has been saying they’re willing to compromise for months now. Both Seravalli and Russo reported that they’re willing to compromise. If Kaprizov’s camp was willing to go to five years and just be “somewhat overpayed” this would be done by now. Everything we know about Guerin is that he’s often more than fair in negotiations. Everything that’s reported about Theofanious is that he’s an absolute asshole in negotiations willing to use whatever tactic possible to squeeze a team. It’s not too hard for me to guess at whose the Asshole here.
 

Ban Hammered

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How is it not Guerin's fault? He's played hard ball up with Kaprizov up until a month ago when it appears that he finally relented on his 8 year stance. More so, how did he make this team better in the off-season? His biggest forward signing was Gaudreau and he ate up a significant cushion of cap space in the next three years for what reason? Kaprizov isn't going to stick around if in two years this team needs to rebuild.

As Jagged Ice mentioned, what incentives does Kaprizov have to stay with this team if they don't have a direction other than throw it at the wall and see what sticks.

No one has provided any reasonable answer to what Minnesota is going to do in the next three years when Suter and Parise's cap hit take up what? 17% of the cap?
The Wild offered 8x8... Kaprizov turned that down. The KHL threat is the only leverage he has so his agent is using it. It's a negotiation...so a compromise is in order. You have one side saying they are talking every day and one side saying no offers have been made in weeks. Someone is lying. Again.. negotiation tactic. As for Parise and Suter...why do you need to be told what they are going to do? That isn't something fans need to know. Your arguments that they are eating up cap...they still have to ice a team and you can't do that with a bottom 6 of ELC's. It just doesn't work that way.
And I'm sorry..but at this point if Kaprizov is that hell bent on getting out of here...trade him.
 

57special

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Stuff like this is why I hate hockey agents. Yes, they're doing their job but it just makes player look really bad, typical greedy Russian who only cares about money and nothing more. Makes team, fans, both Minnesota and neutral ones, really sour on the player. There're people who understand that this is just an obvious laughable bluff from the agent who's doing his job but majority will just read the headline without any fact-checking and just say something like 'Good riddance, have fun in KHL then'.

For those who believe in this nonsense about 8-figure contract in KHL I can assure you that Kirill really wants to play in NHL and it's not about the money. But 7-8 years contract is too much, he won't sign for that long. Not now. Bill Guerin would have to go for a bridge either way. If he doesn't like it that much then he can just trade Kirirll after signing.
Kaprizov hired his agent to represent him in contract negotiations knowing full well that he is very aggressive. He, and you, can't pretend otherwise, and hide behind his big, bad agent.
 

57special

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The Wild offered 8x8... Kaprizov turned that down. The KHL threat is the only leverage he has so his agent is using it. It's a negotiation...so a compromise is in order. You have one side saying they are talking every day and one side saying no offers have been made in weeks. Someone is lying. Again.. negotiation tactic. As for Parise and Suter...why do you need to be told what they are going to do? That isn't something fans need to know. Your arguments that they are eating up cap...they still have to ice a team and you can't do that with a bottom 6 of ELC's. It just doesn't work that way.
And I'm sorry..but at this point if Kaprizov is that hell bent on getting out of here...trade him.
Agreed. I have nothing against Kap and love him as a hockey player. Also seems to be a good person. If he doesn't want to be here, or will only stay here if he is overpaid, as opposed to being fairly paid, then it's time to move on. Better now than later.
 

amikaro

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wondering how the wild community feels about the open negotiations. happy to see the tenor is to be careful with overpaying longterm contracts. 8x8 or a shorter term deal seem fair and generous. if a player is all about maximizing money, let him go.
 

thestonedkoala

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Wtf is BBB supposed to offer 10, 12, 15mm? For a guy that has played in the big leagues for 55 games... Come on now... I don't even really like BBB but everybody coming out with their pitchforks against him because of the Suter buyout and this is a little damn ridiculous.

Maybe, you know sign a free agent center that's better than Rask and Guadreau? If you think the contract is the only issue here and not seeing that the Wild have zero direction at the moment on what the hell this team is doing - I don't know what else to show you.

If I was an agent and I saw what Guerin was doing with Fiala - who has played with who exactly? And the negotiations that Guerin is doing with Fiala, I'd be wary about working with him as well. Not to mention, there has been really no incentive for Kaprizov to sign here. What has Guerin done to convince Kaprizov he's actually building a competitive team in the next few years other than banking on some rookies to bring them to the promise land?
 

BlackBusa24

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Dec 13, 2018
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Maybe, you know sign a free agent center that's better than Rask and Guadreau? If you think the contract is the only issue here and not seeing that the Wild have zero direction at the moment on what the hell this team is doing - I don't know what else to show you.

If I was an agent and I saw what Guerin was doing with Fiala - who has played with who exactly? And the negotiations that Guerin is doing with Fiala, I'd be wary about working with him as well. Not to mention, there has been really no incentive for Kaprizov to sign here. What has Guerin done to convince Kaprizov he's actually building a competitive team in the next few years other than banking on some rookies to bring them to the promise land?

Well you could argue that if you really wanted to build a formative team that he would take less money himself... But it sure sounds like that's not his prerogative...

The money for these centers has to come from somewhere... If you're good enough to say that you're worth 10 12 or how many million he thinks he's worth then you're going to have to put it all on your shoulders... Example McDavid
 
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2Pair

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Guerin has been saying they’re willing to compromise for months now. Both Seravalli and Russo reported that they’re willing to compromise. If Kaprizov’s camp was willing to go to five years and just be “somewhat overpayed” this would be done by now. Everything we know about Guerin is that he’s often more than fair in negotiations. Everything that’s reported about Theofanious is that he’s an absolute asshole in negotiations willing to use whatever tactic possible to squeeze a team. It’s not too hard for me to guess at whose the Asshole here.
Do you think that Guerin has offered Kaprizov a 5 year deal?
 

Nsjohnson

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Maybe, you know sign a free agent center that's better than Rask and Guadreau? If you think the contract is the only issue here and not seeing that the Wild have zero direction at the moment on what the hell this team is doing - I don't know what else to show you.

If I was an agent and I saw what Guerin was doing with Fiala - who has played with who exactly? And the negotiations that Guerin is doing with Fiala, I'd be wary about working with him as well. Not to mention, there has been really no incentive for Kaprizov to sign here. What has Guerin done to convince Kaprizov he's actually building a competitive team in the next few years other than banking on some rookies to bring them to the promise land?
You're right. But this starts all the way back in 2012. We are just in a uncomfortable place now.

KK finally comes over. There is a pandemic, cap stays essentially the same.

For WHATEVER reason, probably being that almost no teams successfully can acquire a top line center out of thin air unless they are in absolutely the best position to (lots of assets and tradables), we haven't got that. We have been in a quasi-rebuild which for me is my biggest beef. I don't like half in half out. We should have either started the rebuild a year ago or the opposite.

Instead we find ourselves with a lot of good to great players while still missing the important #1C and that is the hardest to get. We have prospects that may becomes top players, Rossi might become a #1C but he may also be nothing more than a second line winger, and yet this happens to also be the time that KK needs a contract extension.

So, you could tell KK that. And say this is bad timing, sorry. If you want out I understand. If you want a Cup tomorrow instead of maybe in 3-10 years, fine. We will trade you and continue our 'rebuild that is not a rebuild'. But if you want to stay then you need to like, get it, get the fact that this is where we find ourselves. We can't pay you 11 million for the next five seasons each year, and we would like to sign you longer than 3 seasons. We can't risk you walking and damage the team for ten years like Gabby did.

Like, I don't blame BG or KK at the moment really, I understand both even if it's very frustrating. What needs to be done is cut the emotional blame sh*t and get down to brass tacks. We need to trade him ASAP after signing him- whether that's the same day or in six months- for the very best haul we can including a #1C prospect.

Had we somehow gotten a #1C this year, we wouldn't have the same cap, prospect pool, etc to win with going forward. So it's a catch 22. Damned if you acquire a #1C due to leveling the damn prospect pool and you are damned if you don't because you look like 'you've been playing with your thumbs, what have you done for the team lately' too. You f*ck yourself now or you f*ck yourself later.

KK has got to understand that, and BG needs to not pretend this isn't the case. I wish he would move off his 'we aren't rebuilding' fence and just rebuild.
 
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16thOverallSaveUs

Danila Yurov Fan Club Executive Assistant
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Do you think that Guerin has offered Kaprizov a 5 year deal?
Offered? No. But he’s obviously willing to discuss it. If the discussions have been about 3x9M+ From Kirill’s end, I just don’t see what there is to discuss from Billy’s end right now on a 5 year deal. That number is going to be even higher from Kaprizov’s end, and it’s way to high as is. Until they come down on money, the term isn’t really important. There’s no deal to be had right now.
 

Webster

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So CSKA has offered him a 1 yr deal worth at least $10M...consider him gone.

I don't know who said the KHL can't pay top NHL salaries, but you're obviously dead wrong.
There's a competition between the two leagues, and that's very interesting.
 
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2Pair

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Offered? No. But he’s obviously willing to discuss it. If the discussions have been about 3x9M+ From Kirill’s end, I just don’t see what there is to discuss from Billy’s end right now on a 5 year deal. That number is going to be even higher from Kaprizov’s end, and it’s way to high as is. Until they come down on money, the term isn’t really important. There’s no deal to be had right now.
All the real reports have said that there's been zero discussion.
 

16thOverallSaveUs

Danila Yurov Fan Club Executive Assistant
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All the real reports have said that there's been zero discussion.
What is there to discuss if Kaprizov wants 9M+ by three years and we want 7/8 x 9M? The only thing you can do is call his bluff because there’s absolutely no way you’re paying him that much on a 3 year deal. Wait for them to come down in AAV, then we can come down in term. If Guerin is the first one to compromise, we’re probably talking about a 5x10M deal. I don’t think this is anything we can blame on Guerin based on how little actual information is out there.
 
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HobeyBroten

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Again... That has been set in stone for years... Stop blaming the current administration. It's just the price of taking the shot that we did... Now we have to suffer for it
I believe this is why BG is probably playing hard ball, so he doesn't repeat history from 2012. Even if it is with one player and not 2. (Possibly similar angle he's taking with Fiala)
 

TheNumber4

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Nov 11, 2011
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Russo is reporting Guerin has been willing to compromise for a month, and Seravalli is hearing from Kap's camp that there have been no new offers since April.

One side is obviously bullshitting, but why? Sympathy from the masses who only see the tweet and assume it's just Guerin playing hardball?
It’s obviously Kaprizovs side bullshitting.
 

thestonedkoala

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That is still on our cap. So in other words ..it's already spoken for.

Except it isn't; you have to replace those players with someone else. It's not like the Wild bought out Suter and didn't need to replace him with - someone.

Again... That has been set in stone for years... Stop blaming the current administration. It's just the price of taking the shot that we did... Now we have to suffer for it

Or you know, you didn't have to buy out the players and replace them?

What if the money KK and Fiala are demanding is going to gobble up the dead cap time and he cant' afford to go out and get a 8M/yr center?

You mean the 14 million plus? You move a guy like Zuccs or Dumba - there you go.
 

Dr Jan Itor

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So CSKA has offered him a 1 yr deal worth at least $10M...consider him gone.

I don't know who said the KHL can't pay top NHL salaries, but you're obviously dead wrong.
There's a competition between the two leagues, and that's very interesting.

Thought your guy had some pull.
 
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