KHL Season 2019/20

[hansomreiste]

If league loses three bottom dwellers in Minsk, Riga, and Bratislava? What do you reckon lol? You yourself seperated Barys as you can see that their roster is actually competative and play entertaining hockey, they add value to the league to a sane person.

I was actually talking about the prospect of KHL project being shelved completely, thus not only the loss of the likes of Minsk and Riga but also other possible expansion candidates. My concern is mainly about international availability of the league since I don't live in Russia. Witte49 made a good job addressing my concerns. In theory, losing bottom dwellers shouldn't mean much. However, KHL being history may indeed change Russian hockey, direction still to be seen.

It'd still be the KHL, it'd still span a continent, it'd still be fascinating, so don't worry too much!

Sure the non russian teams add a lot of flavour to the league, but we'd always have Barys!

I would enjoy all-Russian league, no doubt, but I'd be very sad to see Minsk & Riga go, especially given that I might spend a year in Riga in a couple of years. On top of that, we might never see Czechia, Poland, Germany, Austria etc. which is basically a great dream crushed. Otherwise, it's good for me. In fact, it could make way for teams like Novokuznetsk again. Since the expenses would drop, it maybe could even turn them into an OK-ish side, dunno. I'm just trying to get used to the idea of not having KHL in years to come, honestly.

1. There is not a single reason all non-Russian clubs to leave. And even if, others will come.

2.If you want to play the if game.

The KHL would be as strong as now, if not stronger.

3. The RSL & the KHL are totally different leagues, different era, management. To use a few words, the RSL was run by unprofessional RHF, the KHL is managed by business people and is business-oriented.

I'm starting to believe that you frequent the forum only to make fun of people. If I recall correctly, you are a journalist. Why don't you stick to working with facts and reporting them instead of getting lost in baseless speculations?

 

[vorky]

I just try to write here about what is going on. All the story.

It is not correct to make a strong statement without knowing all the details. So, it is always good to find all possible details out.

Coming back to your question.

I'm just trying to get used to the idea of not having KHL in years to come, honestly.

I would like to ask you what leads you to have such a feeling?

 

[hansomreiste]

I would like to ask you what leads you to have such a feeling?

* The statement of Lukashenko regarding Dynamo Minsk. The subsequent roster moves coming from the team, very well summarized by SoundAndFury. They are weak. Regardless of whether they stay or leave, they are just an irrelevant team which contributes nothing to the league.

* The problems Slovan have been dealing with. Could it be solved? Maybe. If indeed Kellner or whatever the guy is called somehow decides to pump in millions of Euros to make them competitive again... However, as things stand, their future in the KHL, or maybe entire existence, is in jeopardy.

* Dynamo Riga are bad.

If you think that a Russian-based league which fails to keep the likes of Minsk, Riga and Slovan in the league is capable of expanding into Europe in a healthy way, it's another story.

 

[vorky]

That was not what I asked for. I asked what you lead to "the idea of not having KHL in years to come" If I get it, your opinion is the KHL will cease to exist within a few years. So, I am asking what leads you to that opinion.

Regarding Dinamo Minsk and Dinamo Riga. It is very unlikely they to leave.

Regarding Slovan, we do not know all the details. Even if they have some problems, it is not the KHL´s fault, but the problem is with the club´s management. Even the KHL said it in their statement.

All being said has nothing to do with further KHL´s expansion.

 

[ozo]

I just present the status quo right now.

But you do see that the current status quo, as said by KHL itself, is no Slovan in KHL, right?

 

[vorky]

But you do see that the current status quo, as said by KHL itself, is no Slovan in KHL, right?

And that is the problem.

The legally binding decision of the KHL Board of Directors, right now, is that Slovan continues. Even the legally binding decision of the KHL Executive Board, right now, is that Slovan continues.

Since I do not have all the details on Slovan, so I will not comment on what might happen. When there is the decision, I can comment.

It is fine if such nuance is not important for any other poster. I consider it as important. As simple as that.

 

[Rigafan]

I would enjoy all-Russian league, no doubt, but I'd be very sad to see Minsk & Riga go, especially given that I might spend a year in Riga in a couple of years. On top of that, we might never see Czechia, Poland, Germany, Austria etc. which is basically a great dream crushed. Otherwise, it's good for me. In fact, it could make way for teams like Novokuznetsk again. Since the expenses would drop, it maybe could even turn them into an OK-ish side, dunno. I'm just trying to get used to the idea of not having KHL in years to come, honestly.

Riga/Latvia is such a great place.

I wouldn't worry too much about Riga, as much as we are turning into the whipping team and just there to make numbers, the connections in this part of the world are important, as we all know.

Riga is run by a certain man who is very close friends with another certain man - certain men want 'traditional' teams in the KHL. So basically I see that as the old Soviet teams, All the Moscows, Ak Bars, Petersburg, Minsk, Riga, etc. etc.

While Minsk are clearly going through some troubles which is a shame, Riga.. even though the budget is tiny compared, always has a budget secured it seems. I don't think Riga will go anywhere anytime soon unless some drastic changes with the KHL (and I'm not being biased here just from looking at names and history)

Even if Riga left the KHL.. Latvia very much likes hockey so when you end up there you won't go without, and remember you can travel to Russia quite easily from Lativa if you wanted to see the KHL

 

[ozo]

Riga/Latvia is such a great place.

I wouldn't worry too much about Riga, as much as we are turning into the whipping team and just there to make numbers, the connections in this part of the world are important, as we all know.

Riga is run by a certain man who is very close friends with another certain man - certain men want 'traditional' teams in the KHL. So basically I see that as the old Soviet teams, All the Moscows, Ak Bars, Petersburg, Minsk, Riga, etc. etc.

While Minsk are clearly going through some troubles which is a shame, Riga.. even though the budget is tiny compared, always has a budget secured it seems. I don't think Riga will go anywhere anytime soon unless some drastic changes with the KHL (and I'm not being biased here just from looking at names and history)

Even if Riga left the KHL.. Latvia very much likes hockey so when you end up there you won't go without, and remember you can travel to Russia quite easily from Lativa if you wanted to see the KHL

Just a nitpick, but I can't help myself, neither Kazan nor Minsk has some great Soviet hockey traditions, they were an average second tier teams before the fall of USSR.

 

[mkev400]

That was not what I asked for. I asked what you lead to "the idea of not having KHL in years to come" If I get it, your opinion is the KHL will cease to exist within a few years. So, I am asking what leads you to that opinion.

Regarding Dinamo Minsk and Dinamo Riga. It is very unlikely they to leave.

Regarding Slovan, we do not know all the details. Even if they have some problems, it is not the KHL´s fault, but the problem is with the club´s management. Even the KHL said it in their statement.

All being said has nothing to do with further KHL´s expansion.

But he answered exactly what you asked for. He told you, based on the rumors that have been circulating this very forum that why he thinks that the KHL in its current form could collapse in a few years. Im not saying it will happen (scenarios such as the ambiguous one described by Rigafan being one reason) but you can't deny that the mere fact that these rumors exist, and in the case of Minsk were apparently credible enough to result in a public denial from the national Federation, that the KHL is in rude health in some areas of the league.

Regarding Slovan, we do not know all the details. Even if they have some problems, it is not the KHL´s fault, but the problem is with the club´s management. Even the KHL said it in their statement.

[...] The legally binding decision of the KHL Board of Directors, right now, is that Slovan continues. Even the legally binding decision of the KHL Executive Board, right now, is that Slovan continues.

Since I do not have all the details on Slovan, so I will not comment on what might happen. When there is the decision, I can comment. [...]

Slovan appears to be in the rudest health of them all by now. The KHL have published a press release in which they air the clubs financial problems, namely that their continued participation in the KHL appeared to be dependent on a new investor to front the bill for the club.
I agree that the situation isnt the KHLs fault but lies with Slovan themselves for spending beyond their means, to ice, what they thought, was competitive teams. The KHLs statement also states that for now a new investor has yet to be found and that their huge debts are a roadblock for a new investor to commit to the club and that they dont have the financial means to compete in the KHL in 2019/20 at this moment in time. However, if they don't get that money together, then the legally binding decision [sic] won't mean a lot because a business thats insolvent can't make a purchases to maintain their status quo. I agree that all the details aren't known, but at the same time, going off the information that we do have, it is more than reasonable to assume that the KHL will not be playing in Bratislava in the near future.
And the loss of both Zagreb and potentially Bratislava might also be an indication that the investment required for a KHL team is not sustainable for Eastern Europe, when you factor in high travel costs along with lower sponsor investment/attractiveness for uncompetitive teams without a majority investor fronting the bill.

 

[vorky]

But he answered exactly what you asked for. He told you, based on the rumors that have been circulating this very forum that why he thinks that the KHL in its current form could collapse in a few years. Im not saying it will happen (scenarios such as the ambiguous one described by Rigafan being one reason) but you can't deny that the mere fact that these rumors exist, and in the case of Minsk were apparently credible enough to result in a public denial from the national Federation, that the KHL is in rude health in some areas of the league.

We talk about the KHL as a league. I do not see any indications that the KHL as a league to collapse soon. Teams leaving & coming is normal for the league.

Slovan appears to be in the rudest health of them all by now. The KHL have published a press release in which they air the clubs financial problems, namely that their continued participation in the KHL appeared to be dependent on a new investor to front the bill for the club.
I agree that the situation isnt the KHLs fault but lies with Slovan themselves for spending beyond their means, to ice, what they thought, was competitive teams. The KHLs statement also states that for now a new investor has yet to be found and that their huge debts are a roadblock for a new investor to commit to the club and that they dont have the financial means to compete in the KHL in 2019/20 at this moment in time. However, if they don't get that money together, then the legally binding decision [sic] won't mean a lot because a business thats insolvent can't make a purchases to maintain their status quo. I agree that all the details aren't known, but at the same time, going off the information that we do have, it is more than reasonable to assume that the KHL will not be playing in Bratislava in the near future.
And the loss of both Zagreb and potentially Bratislava might also be an indication that the investment required for a KHL team is not sustainable for Eastern Europe, when you factor in high travel costs along with lower sponsor investment/attractiveness for uncompetitive teams without a majority investor fronting the bill.

We need to wait for the decision of the KHL Board of Directors. I presented the legal status quo is the earlier post. I will comment on the situation when the league decides. And Slovan´s situation is nothing new, the current state has been known for a couple of months.

 

[geri]

KHL press Release seams was made to put more pressure on Slovan to get a solution.
What I think? There is a high Poker game currently!
IF (!) this Czech investor is real ?
he would go for 100% kicking out sirokys finally and they are just fighting now,
As he also wants buy the arena from the city this isn’t a matter of quick result..
So KHL put this pressure to speed up for a final long term solution..
A short term would just to decide some sponsor like in recent years- nobody wants that again

 

[hansomreiste]

Let's think of the best possibility and assume that this Czech investor got his hands on the club. Could he theoretically ice a contender team or at least a top 6 one? Similar to today's Sochi or maybe even Dynamo Moscow? Is this what he wanted to buy the club for? Because if not, this will only delay the inevitable.

Slovan might not have the best management but I don't believe the root of the problem is simply mismanagement. It is not like Slovan spent their money on cocaine instead of signing players. When you have too little money to ice a competitive team in the KHL, you eventually will run out of it. The only bad thing about this kind of management is staying in league and not mismanagement of the funds. To mismanage funds, you first need to have some of them in the first place.

 

[alko]

Let's think of the best possibility and assume that this Czech investor got his hands on the club. Could he theoretically ice a contender team or at least a top 6 one? Similar to today's Sochi or maybe even Dynamo Moscow? Is this what he wanted to buy the club for?

I hardly believe it. That will cost too much money. Dont forget, Slovan has a lot of old money problems, that must be resolved. Players, staff and also their ice rink.

Then you can think about the next season. And im sure, many players are now very cautious about Slovan. After all this years, when they hear and read, how much issues were there with salaries, they will at first look to other options.

 

[geri]

Therefore you need a complete restart.
A new owner 100%
And if it is really that billionaire money is no problem and of course to cover old debt ( let’s guess 5 mio) Not at all
As a fan I still hope the best

 

[Rigafan]

Just a nitpick, but I can't help myself, neither Kazan nor Minsk has some great Soviet hockey traditions, they were an average second tier teams before the fall of USSR.

That's fair and my mistake, I was thinking more big cities but I wrote it wrong, thanks!

 

[Toro2017]

Dont forget, Slovan has a lot of old money problems, that must be resolved. Players, staff and also their ice rink.

Do we know how much Slovan has old money problems? I heard somewhere that Slovan owes about one million euros for the use of their rink. How much do they owe to others (players, staff and others)?

It is not very promising when we were let to belive that there will be some billionaire coming to rescue Slovan and making it great again. Now there is no willingness to deal with the old money problems. If that new possible investor does not have the will to pay one million to the city of Bratislava (for the use of the rink) then will he be ready to spend 10-15 million euros, per season to the team? I hope all the best for Slovan, but it looks like that nothing is going to change.

 

[Toro2017]

Let's think of the best possibility and assume that this Czech investor got his hands on the club. Could he theoretically ice a contender team or at least a top 6 one? Similar to today's Sochi or maybe even Dynamo Moscow? Is this what he wanted to buy the club for? Because if not, this will only delay the inevitable.

Well if I remember it correctly, we were let to believe that there will be a very rich man coming to rescue Slovan. Not just rescue, but making it a playoff team again. I remember that someone even painted the picture, where this same rich man would not only rebuild Slovan, but bring Sparta Praha also to KHL. Businessman that has the money for two KHL teams, would propably have the money to build Sochi or Dynamo Moscow level ice hockey team(s).

It was a very nice picture, painted by a dreamer. But then came the journalist, the real journalist (whose job is to find out the truth behind pretty pictures, not just being a parrot for presidents and CEOs) and gave us the real picture. There is no willingness to pay off Slovans debts, so will there be money for making Slovan -> Dynamo Moscow level team? I have hard time to believe it, even if I like "pretty pictures".

But one thing that we already know, is that someone who let us to believe that there will be investor that will make Slovan great again and even bring Sparta Praha to KHL, clearly did not have all the facts and were just speculating on the future. It would be very funny, if that same someone would now be whining that we should not speculate with the future of Slovan, because we dont have all the facts.

 

[vorky]

Looks like @Toro2017 is better informed about Slovan´s case than anybody here. So, I ask you to present all the details right now.

Regarding Slovan´s case, I just analysed the media reports, it is not my business that media does not say the truth. You should ask the journalists to present all the details. Of course, if there is at least one journalist who knows all inside information. Honestly, I doubt about it.

 

[Toro2017]

Looks like @Toro2017 is better informed about Slovan´s case than anybody here. So, I ask you to present all the details right now.

First you make a claim and then ask a question based on your claim. From my point of view your claim is flawed. I never said that I know all the details about Slovan case. I only pointed out (based on KHL's own tweet about Slovan case), that someones dreamy view of the situation did not seem to be "holding water". So now you should show us on what your claim is based on, because otherwise it might look like that you are making things up, and that is rarely a good thing, unless one is a storyteller.

 

[geri]

Vorky just qouted siroky telling he has investor, it even was video message

 

[vorky]

Vorky just qouted siroky telling he has investor, it even was video message

Yeah, but it cannot be explained to the haters. They just wait for any negative news to criticise the league, the club, the country, anybody.

And coming back to Slovan. I would like to meet any journalist, Slovak or Russian, who knows 100% what is going on.

 

[jasonr90]

Where are we at with slovan? Saw something on twitter that there’s a meeting on the 29th?

 

[Toro2017]

Yeah, but it cannot be explained to the haters.

Yeah, but "the haters" are not the ones that needed to be convinced about the new investor. KHL told us via twitter some time ago, that from their point of view there is no new investor. So it is KHL that needs to be convinced about the new investor, not "the haters".

And on that tweet KHL tells us that "The club's Vice President, Juraj Shiroki Jr, assured KHL more than once that an inverstor would be found, and the team will continue to play, but this did not happen". So has something new happen since that tweet (15. may)?

 

[vorky]

@Toro2017

You must be kidding. Once, you accuse the poster of the situation which took place before May 15 & now asking what happened after May 15? Would be cool to find out what has happened in the case for last year or two. I am so kind & I will help you not to spend too much time on google - March & April, your turn, googling.

 

[Toro2017]

@Toro2017

You must be kidding. Once, you accuse the poster of the situation which took place before May 15 & now asking what happened after May 15? Would be cool to find out what has happened in the case for last year or two. I am so kind & I will help you not to spend too much time on google - March & April, your turn, googling.

Well I am not a native english speaker/writer and I am guessing that neither are you. So from time to time we might not understand each other the right way. So to be clear, from my point of view, i did not ask you a favor. From my point of view you are trying to build a narrative here, that favors KHL/(teams in it) and so in a way I gave you a change to build that same narrative. KHL basicly told on their tweet on 15. may that they have heard many times, that there will be a new investor in Slovan (without concrete results). So if now somebody just tells us again that there will be new investor, then it is basicly the same that KHL have heard many times now. So thats why I asked has something new happen since 15. may or is it the same and we still are just getting the same message "there will be a new investor" without any concrete proof of it. Just somebodys word for it.