Value of: Kevin Hayes to the Carolina Hurricanes

[One Winged Angel]

whatever

Ok, so let's break this down further.

You're banking Brendan Smith to go back to his 2017 form. Is that not a giant question mark?

Marc Staal just flat out sucks and was never a great skater to begin with and doesn't look like he's gotten even a smidge faster. Am I wrong there?

Claesson is a puck whacker who Ottawa fans said wasn't anything special and didn't even look good next to Karlsson.

Boston fans respect the shit outta McQuaid, but he's beat up and has taken years of abuse and isn't a great skater. An upgrade on Staal? Yeah, most likely but that's not saying much.

Shattenkirk healthy helps everywhere else BUT the defensive zone. He was atrocious defensively last year. If Skjei rebounds and plays like he did in his rookie season, then things are a little different.

But I don't know how you can say a defense that was TERRIBLE with McDonagh and Holden now doesn't have them and didn't do anything to upgrade isn't going to be a disaster.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Ok, so let's break this down further.

You're banking Brendan Smith to go back to his 2017 form. Is that not a giant question mark?

Marc Staal just flat out sucks and was never a great skater to begin with and doesn't look like he's gotten even a smidge faster. Am I wrong there?

Claesson is a puck whacker who Ottawa fans said wasn't anything special and didn't even look good next to Karlsson.

Boston fans respect the **** outta McQuaid, but he's beat up and has taken years of abuse and isn't a great skater. An upgrade on Staal? Yeah, most likely but that's not saying much.

Shattenkirk healthy helps everywhere else BUT the defensive zone. He was atrocious defensively last year. If Skjei rebounds and plays like he did in his rookie season, then things are a little different.

But I don't know how you can say a defense that was TERRIBLE with McDonagh and Holden now doesn't have them and didn't do anything to upgrade isn't going to be a disaster.

seems like you are very obsessed with this topic and have your mind made up that we suck and our defense is beyond repair.

 

[Shootertooter]

I am just saying the defense won't be a disaster like you are trying to make it seem like.

I think it is still going to be bad. Regardless of the coach, we did little to improve the defense.
Freddy and McQuaid are not going to change much or matter much outside of the top 4.

 

[One Winged Angel]

seems like you are very obsessed with this topic and have your mind made up that we suck and our defense is beyond repair.

If trying to have a detailed discussion with someone is being obsessed, then everyone on this site is obsessed.

I've asked you questions which you haven't answered and I'll ask a few more. Even though you already know my stance, I want to hear what you think.

- Do you think Smith is bouncing back?
- Do you think Staal is a good defender?
- Do you think Claesson is anything more than a #6?
- Do you think McQuaid is a huge addition?
- Do you think having Skjei and Shattenkirk as the 2 Best defenders on the team is a problem?
- Do you think a lack of depth otherwise will hurt the unit as a whole?

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

If trying to have a detailed discussion with someone is being obsessed, then everyone on this site is obsessed.

I've asked you questions which you haven't answered and I'll ask a few more. Even though you already know my stance, I want to hear what you think.

- Do you think Smith is bouncing back? YES, he better be and he looks like he is.
- Do you think Staal is a good defender? He used to be long time ago, but I like what I saw from him in the few preseason games
- Do you think Claesson is anything more than a #6? NO
- Do you think McQuaid is a huge addition? NOT in terms of defense or offense, maybe in terms of toughness
- Do you think having Skjei and Shattenkirk as the 2 Best defenders on the team is a problem? Not sure yet, not even sure they are the best yet
- Do you think a lack of depth otherwise will hurt the unit as a whole? I don't think we lack depth, we only lack high end top players.

 

[Kupo]

Funny watching the 1 man army in this thread getting obliterated.

 

[The S5]

you think this is better than the Rangers' roster?:

LW	C	RW
Brock McGinn	Jordan Staal	Justin Williams
Valentin Zykov	Sebastian Aho	Teuvo Teräväinen
Michael Ferland	Martin Nečas	Andrei Svechnikov
Warren Foegele	Lucas Wallmark	Phillip Di Giuseppe

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Injured: Victor Rask

LD	RD
Jaccob Slavin	Brett Pesce
Calvin de Haan	Dougie Hamilton
Trevor van Riemsdyk	Justin Faulk

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Injured:

G
Scott Darling
Petr Mrázek

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Yes, and I don't think its very close. This coming from a Ranger fan.

 

[The S5]

Their D is pretty good, but ours is underrated. Our goaltending is way better, and likely coaching staff as well.

How is Spooner a question mark?

FWIW, our goaltending has been barely average over the last few seasons. Hank has had a month here or there where he has played well, but if it weren't for those stretches, his save % would be in the lower 1/3 rd of the league.
With that being said, he was still better than Darling last year.

Also, the Canes D is among the best in the NHL. The Rangers D, potentially, could be among the worst.

 

[TGWL]

Mostly agree, but McGinn is probably no longer a question mark. We know what we have with him, but the rest of your assessment on Carolina I agree with.

Unfortunately, I don't think our goalies are question marks, but in a bad way.

Yeah, that's true. I suppose I could have bolded McGinn and Spooner.

 

[Devilsrock17]

Hayes would be a great fit in Carolina but my only problem is he wants a lot of money and term and I'm not so sure he can be consistent. A few teams would love to have him and I know the Hurricanes should consider. My other teams are Chicago, Vancouver, Detroit, maybe New Jersey if Zacha can't hold the fort.

 

[tarheelhockey]

With those goalies you definitely need a great defense. And that defense of yours isn't overly physical either especially Slavin, TvR and Pesce. I like my defense to be physical, not all about point production or some hype.

Hang on a dang second.

Did you just say Slavin, TVR and Pesce are all about point production and hype?

 

[BBKers]

Fox, 2nd, 3rd for Hayes and an AHL D like OGara sounds right

 

[spockBokk]

Fox, 2nd, 3rd for Hayes and an AHL D like OGara sounds right

All that for 1 yr of Hayes? Heck no.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Fox, 2nd, 3rd for Hayes and an AHL D like OGara sounds right

too little return and we don't need Fox and Fox hasn't even played in AHL yet.

 

[Negan4Coach]

All that for 1 yr of Hayes? Heck no.

IDK much about this Hayes fellow, but why do we always assume any trade we get won't resign in Raleigh? The area seems to grow on people, plus the team is poised to make a jump back into relevancy.

 

[Cane mutiny]

IDK much about this Hayes fellow, but why do we always assume any trade we get won't resign in Raleigh? The area seems to grow on people, plus the team is poised to make a jump back into relevancy.

He may very well resign, but that's a lot to lose with no guarantee. Not worth one year, unless it's something like Fox and a 3rd , and add the 2nd if he resigns. Even that's too much for me.

 

[Canes]

IDK much about this Hayes fellow, but why do we always assume any trade we get won't resign in Raleigh? The area seems to grow on people, plus the team is poised to make a jump back into relevancy.

Well Hayes already spurned the team that drafted him to go where he wanted. Normally I'm not as pessimistic about players re-signing in Raleigh as some of our fans but Hayes would give us reason to be pessimistic this time.

 

[Kupo]

Well Hayes already spurned the team that drafted him to go where he wanted. Normally I'm not as pessimistic about players re-signing in Raleigh as some of our fans but Hayes would give us reason to be pessimistic this time.

If Waddell has interest in Hayes, he’ll explore it after January 1st so he can talk an extension. If both parties can’t agree on an extension then Waddell isn’t making a trade.

 

[Canes]

If Waddell has interest in Hayes, he’ll explore it after January 1st so he can talk an extension. If both parties can’t agree on an extension then Waddell isn’t making a trade.

Thing is we would probably want Hayes before then since Rask is out now. Might not need him as badly by then. Hayes probably doesn't negotiate right away barring an overpayment offer.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

The best the Canes could do at the moment is more of an E. Staal-like return of say Buffalo's 2nd, their own 2nd and one of the litany of B-prospects in the system. Carolina could get those assets back by dealing Hayes at the deadline, if things don't go well.

Gorton likely wants a 1st and may be able to get just that closer to the deadline. I don't see a deal here, unfortunately. Hayes would be a good fit for Carolina stylistically, positionally and financially.

 

[bernmeister]

Presumably we’re not just going to watch Hayes walk away after trading to acquire him. The idea would be to trade for him in order to sign him to his next contract.

I agree that trading a D works better for us, but beggars can’t be choosers and we are begging for Cs. Hayes is one of the few on the market who is likely to be moved. He’s good for 20 goals, which is the upper end of what we’d be likely to get from Foegele or Zykov, and he plays a position we need badly. To me it isn’t worth having a worse team and missing the playoffs because we were looking for a perfect trade of guys of this caliber.

It's not written in stone, but
I see Hayes is another Chapman return to the Yankees scenario, all the more so cause I have a feeling Hayes really wants to stay a Ranger, and Chapman was leaning to return, but was looking for top $ payoff.

This means Hayes goes as a rental, w/NY sweetening by eating half if it ups the return. There is enough speculation heads up that like Shattenkirk to Caps a couple of years ago, he was gonna test the market, with a specific preferred destination in mind. And he does us a big favor if he lets us rent him out so we are further asset enriched when he returns.

That means unless Canes want to pay to gamble, he's not a fit.

Buchnevich for Fox, McKeown, and a conditional 1st in 2022 ONLY if Fox does not sign with Rangers by then, which we do expect will be the case.

Canes are still thin at pivot, but Buchnevich helps replace Skinner production. Versatile at either W. last year elc, rfa rights to club. Canes can afford the spare RD.

 

[Kupo]

It's not written in stone, but
I see Hayes is another Chapman return to the Yankees scenario, all the more so cause I have a feeling Hayes really wants to stay a Ranger, and Chapman was leaning to return, but was looking for top $ payoff.

This means Hayes goes as a rental, w/NY sweetening by eating half if it ups the return. There is enough speculation heads up that like Shattenkirk to Caps a couple of years ago, he was gonna test the market, with a specific preferred destination in mind. And he does us a big favor if he lets us rent him out so we are further asset enriched when he returns.

That means unless Canes want to pay to gamble, he's not a fit.

Buchnevich for Fox, McKeown, and a conditional 1st in 2022 ONLY if Fox does not sign with Rangers by then, which we do expect will be the case.

Canes are still thin at pivot, but Buchnevich helps replace Skinner production. Versatile at either W. last year elc, rfa rights to club. Canes can afford the spare RD.

Bern...

Wtf did I just read...?

 

[WhoTagz]

Hayes and staal , they get to unload a center and LHD for spots for a rookie

Maybe a first and b prospect or a prospect and a 3rd?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Hayes and staal , they get to unload a center and LHD for spots for a rookie

Maybe a first and b prospect or a prospect and a 3rd?

Staal has negative value to Carolina. Last thing we need is a defenseman, particularly a $5.7M dollar one with a NMC. He’d be our #8

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Staal has negative value to Carolina. Last thing we need is a defenseman, particularly a $5.7M dollar one with a NMC. He’d be our #8

Last Season Staal was tied for the 1st place on the Rangers with +11. He actually was very good defensively, and if this pre-season is any indication he is going to have a very good season and I think his offensive numbers will also get a lot better.