Signing(s): Kevin Durant to the Warriors

[Voight]

Based on pure talent and athleticism, yes Griffin is better and it's not close

Draymond though seems to be a much smarter basketball player; he's constantly scanning the floor looking for the best scoring opportunity available

As for him not being as good without Golden State, that's probably true of everyone on that team, so I don't see it as a knock against him

IMO he'd be a bit better elsewhere. He didn't become an all-star just because he plays with the Splash Bros, he just needed longer to develop (4 college seasons, 2-3 NBA seasons) and was a classic diamond in the rough. He would certainly get more touches on any other team.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Based on pure talent and athleticism, yes Griffin is better and it's not close

Draymond though seems to be a much smarter basketball player; he's constantly scanning the floor looking for the best scoring opportunity available

As for him not being as good without Golden State, that's probably true of everyone on that team, so I don't see it as a knock against him

I question if you really want him being the #1 option/guy on a contending team, and if he can create his own shot/offense away from the warriors ball movement. Also, if his Ast. #'s are inflated playing with the splash Bros.

But without a doubt, he is the elite of the elite when it comes to defense and I'll go as far to say that he is arguably the Warriors 'most important player', not 'best player' though.

 

[Virtanen18]

Based on pure talent and athleticism, yes Griffin is better and it's not close

Draymond though seems to be a much smarter basketball player; he's constantly scanning the floor looking for the best scoring opportunity available

As for him not being as good without Golden State, that's probably true of everyone on that team, so I don't see it as a knock against him

Draymond may be a bit smarter (though he did get himself suspended for game 5 of the NBA finals) and better defensively, but Griffin is just a whole 'nother animal offensively. Green's numbers don't even come close to Griffin's over 5-6 seasons. If I were the new GM of a team in a fantasy draft, I'm taking Griffin over Green any day and twice on Sunday. Almost an unstoppable force when on his game.

 

[Voight]

Draymond may be a bit smarter (though he did get himself suspended for game 5 of the NBA finals) and better defensively, but Griffin is just a whole 'nother animal offensively. Green's numbers don't even come close to Griffin's over 5-6 seasons. If I were the new GM of a team in a fantasy draft, I'm taking Griffin over Green any day and twice on Sunday. Almost an unstoppable force when on his game.

To be fair he's only been a starter for two seasons and has gotten better going from 2015-2016

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Griffin is also a top focal point on the Clips while Green is a secondary option.

 

[Six Assets]

Top 5 all-time for a reason.

 

[GKJ]

It's not like Kobe didn't entertain leaving the Lakers.

 

[Halladay]

Top 5 all-time for a reason.

top 5 shooting guards maybe, no chance in hell of any position.

 

[Six Assets]

top 5 shooting guards maybe, no chance in hell of any position.

He's only behind Jordan, Kareem, Magic, and Bird.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

It's not like Kobe didn't entertain leaving the Lakers.

I would bet that he never seriously considered it, he just bullied the Lakers into giving him what he wanted/improving the team.

 

[Halladay]

He's only behind Jordan, Kareem, Magic, and Bird.

LeBron, Duncan, and Wilt too. Garnett was a better player also. Can make the same case for Wade.

 

[Virtanen18]

Kobe gets so overrated.

 

[Morozov]

I would bet that he never seriously considered it, he just bullied the Lakers into giving him what he wanted/improving the team.

He considered it enough to give them a list of teams he was willing to be traded to and put Chicago at the top of the list.

It's not like he just said improve the team or trade me and then they went and got a bunch of pieces for him. The Lakers had a deal with Detroit but Kobe blocked it because he didn't want to go to Detroit. They had talks with Chicago but couldn't come to an agreement because they wanted Deng and Chicago didn't want to move him. The Lakers went to Cleveland asking about trading him for LeBron but obviously they didn't want to do that and Kobe said he would have blocked that one as well.

So the shop was very much on, it had a legitimate chance of happening had they been able to make a deal happen.

 

[Voight]

Kobe gets so overrated.

Can't wait to hear this one.

 

[Six Assets]

LeBron, Duncan, and Wilt too. Garnett was a better player also. Can make the same case for Wade.

Garnett? Wade? Really?

Duncan was great but didn't have the Mamba clutch gene and ability to make that last shot like Kobe did.

And Lebron formed superteams to win his rings. He dipped CLE and won 2 in MIA after promising 8. Then when he realizes that Bosh and Wade are finished, he dips and heads back home to form a superteam with mini-Kobe (Kyrie). He then demands that their #1 pick in the draft be traded for another superstar (at the time Love was a superstar).

Better than Kobe?

 

[Morozov]

Garnett? Wade? Really?

Duncan was great but didn't have the Mamba clutch gene and ability to make that last shot like Kobe did.

And Lebron formed superteams to win his rings. He dipped CLE and won 2 in MIA after promising 8. Then when he realizes that Bosh and Wade are finished, he dips and heads back home to form a superteam with mini-Kobe (Kyrie). He then demands that their #1 pick in the draft be traded for another superstar (at the time Love was a superstar).

Better than Kobe?

Yeah when you jack up so many shots in crunch time, some of them will drop. The highlight reels never feature all the misses.

Kobe had awesome teams put around him so he didn't need to bail like LeBron did. As soon as that wasn't the case, Kobe says trade me or get me better pieces again. Kobe was fortunate to be with (at the time) one of the best organisations in the league in a mass market where people grow up dreaming to be. LeBron was saddled with rubbish. The team he dragged to the finals may be the worst finals team in history.

You think if LeBron was coming up with one of the most dominant forces in NBA history to run with that he would leave Cleveland? he didn't have the luxury Kobe had, he had to go elsewhere to get that kind of support. Let's not pretend like Kobe stuck it out in LA on his own, and let's not pretend that when things weren't so rosy he didn't start wanting out and flexing his power.

Who was the guy who had the league MVP on his team again? who was the guy who had a three time finals MVP on his team again?

Who is the guy with more MVP's and more finals MVP's? oh maybe that's because LeBron was always the best player on his "superteam' while Kobe's teams were so strong that he had a guy who won back to back to back NBA finals MVP's next to him, whose dominance eclipsed his own.

And when Kobe no longer had that guy, the guy who was the most important part of the Lakers getting those three rings, he had to piss and moan to get someone else instead or say he was out the door.

LeBron's "superteam" had Wade nearly shoot them out of a ring. LeBron's "superteam" had Love who many questioned if they were better with him not even on the court. LeBron's latest "superteam" had LeBron lead the NBA finals in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, steals. Nobody has ever done that. Ever. Leading his team back from being down 3-1 which has never been done against a team that just broke the regular season win record. Makes a triple double in game seven to just to top it off. Kobe is not touching what LeBron showed he is capable of.

 

[Six Assets]

Yeah when you jack up so many shots in crunch time, some of them will drop. The highlight reels never feature all the misses.

Kobe had awesome teams put around him so he didn't need to bail like LeBron did. As soon as that wasn't the case, Kobe says trade me or get me better pieces again. Kobe was fortunate to be with (at the time) one of the best organisations in the league in a mass market where people grow up dreaming to be. LeBron was saddled with rubbish. The team he dragged to the finals may be the worst finals team in history.

You think if LeBron was coming up with one of the most dominant forces in NBA history to run with that he would leave Cleveland? he didn't have the luxury Kobe had, he had to go elsewhere to get that kind of support. Let's not pretend like Kobe stuck it out in LA on his own, and let's not pretend that when things weren't so rosy he didn't start wanting out and flexing his power.

Who was the guy who had the league MVP on his team again? who was the guy who had a three time finals MVP on his team again?

Who is the guy with more MVP's and more finals MVP's? oh maybe that's because LeBron was always the best player on his "superteam' while Kobe's teams were so strong that he had a guy who won back to back to back NBA finals MVP's next to him, whose dominance eclipsed his own.

And when Kobe no longer had that guy, the guy who was the most important part of the Lakers getting those three rings, he had to piss and moan to get someone else instead or say he was out the door.

Shaq was better than young Kobe at the time. Kobe didn't let his ego get in the way of winning. Kobe also never melted down like Lebron did back in 2011.

Also, Kobe didn't leave his hometown to team up with superstars then arrogantly promise his new team 8 championships. Then, leave after 4 years when the going got tough

Kobe may have asked for a trade once, but that isn't nearly as cowardly as team-hopping to form superteams, twice.

 

[Morozov]

Shaq was better than young Kobe at the time. Kobe didn't let his ego get in the way of winning. Kobe also never melted down like Lebron did back in 2011.

Also, Kobe didn't leave his hometown to team up with superstars then arrogantly promise his new team 8 championships. Then, leave after 4 years when the going got tough

Kobe may have asked for a trade once, but that isn't nearly as cowardly as team-hopping to form superteams, twice.

Yeah so Kobe had a guy better than him, who won back to back to back finals MVP's, and you want to try call LeBron out for having a superteam lol.

Yeah, Kobe would never let his ego get in the way of winning, or of anything

Kobe didn't get drafted to a hometown team that gave him absolutely zero support. Jeez still holding on to "The Decision", time to move on kiddo. He left when he was a free agent, as he was entitled to do? meanwhile Kobe stomped his feet and said give me what I want or trade me.

Somehow, leaving as a free agent is worse than trying to get a team to trade you when you are under contract. Righto.

Kobe didn't need to team hop to form superteams, he got them provided for him. When he didn't have a strong team, he wanted out. LeBron never tried to get out of what he was contracted to do. LeBron never left, or attempted to, until he was free to do so.

Your agenda with Kobe is pretty clear, the fact you think he is top 5 all time is absolutely hilarious. It's quite obvious you are unreasonable in your view of him.

 

[Addison Rae]

He's only behind Jordan, Kareem, Magic, and Bird.

LeBron James?? You can't seriously rate Kobe and Bird over LeBron.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Kobe should only have 4, anyway.

 

[Voight]

You think if LeBron was coming up with one of the most dominant forces in NBA history to run with that he would leave Cleveland? he didn't have the luxury Kobe had, he had to go elsewhere to get that kind of support. Let's not pretend like Kobe stuck it out in LA on his own, and let's not pretend that when things weren't so rosy he didn't start wanting out and flexing his power.

Who was the guy who had the league MVP on his team again? who was the guy who had a three time finals MVP on his team again?

Who is the guy with more MVP's and more finals MVP's? oh maybe that's because LeBron was always the best player on his "superteam' while Kobe's teams were so strong that he had a guy who won back to back to back NBA finals MVP's next to him, whose dominance eclipsed his own.

And when Kobe no longer had that guy, the guy who was the most important part of the Lakers getting those three rings, he had to piss and moan to get someone else instead or say he was out the door.

LeBron's "superteam" had Wade nearly shoot them out of a ring. LeBron's "superteam" had Love who many questioned if they were better with him not even on the court. LeBron's latest "superteam" had LeBron lead the NBA finals in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, steals. Nobody has ever done that. Ever. Leading his team back from being down 3-1 which has never been done against a team that just broke the regular season win record. Makes a triple double in game seven to just to top it off. Kobe is not touching what LeBron showed he is capable of.

I guess you lived under a rock from 2008-2010. Kobe would have won 3 straight with just Gasol next to him if not for 2008, when he faced a super team.

 

[Morozov]

I guess you lived under a rock from 2008-2010. Kobe would have won 3 straight with just Gasol next to him if not for 2008, when he faced a super team.

Sorry I'm not going to go ahead and give Kobe credit for a title he didn't actually win

Nor am I going to get caught up on "superteams" in a discussion about Kobe who rode shotgun with a guy who won back to back to back finals MVP's next to him.

Also he didn't have "just Gasol", Odom was a great player at that point. They had a monster center in Bynum who looked like he could blossom into the next big deal. They had a great group of roleplayers.

 

[Voight]

Also he didn't have "just Gasol", Odom was a great player at that point. They had a monster center in Bynum who looked like he could blossom into the next big deal. They had a great group of roleplayers.

You can't use playing with Shaq as a negative and then downplay what he did for "His Lakers" from 2008-2010. Bynum actually didn't play a lot during those years due to injuries and yea Odom was avery good 6th man but you are overrating their bench. In any case, aside from Dirk in 2011 he probably had the weakest supporting cast to win post-Shaq.

 

[Morozov]

You can't use playing with Shaq as a negative and then downplay what he did for "His Lakers" from 2008-2010. Bynum actually didn't play a lot during those years due to injuries and yea Odom was avery good 6th man but you are overrating their bench. In any case, aside from Dirk in 2011 he probably had the weakest supporting cast to win post-Shaq.

I'm not downplaying what he did for "his Lakers" at all. I'm not going to give him credit for a title he didn't win like you wish to, I'm also not going to say he "just" had Gasol.

Let's not pretend that Bynum wasn't on the court often, he was on the court more often than not.

I'm also going to openly acknowledge that when it was "his Lakers" he asked to be traded or for "his Lakers" to get better pieces around him. A luxury that LeBron didn't have. Somehow, leaving as a free agent is a worse thing to do than to ask to be traded from a team you are contracted to.

Fact is when it was "his Lakers" he had how many MVP's? and how many playoff MVP's? less than LeBron? OK.

 

[Halladay]

Shaq was better than young Kobe at the time. Kobe didn't let his ego get in the way of winning. Kobe also never melted down like Lebron did back in 2011.

Also, Kobe didn't leave his hometown to team up with superstars then arrogantly promise his new team 8 championships. Then, leave after 4 years when the going got tough

Kobe may have asked for a trade once, but that isn't nearly as cowardly as team-hopping to form superteams, twice.

KG is a better player all time than Kobe.. What makes Kobe better than Russell or Wilt. You cant honestly think Kobe is better than LeBron . Kobe was so fed up with the Lakers there is video of him flipping out in parking lot for not getting him pieces. But yeah, the black Mamba was so clutch he was 6-24 in his game 7 finals appearance. He also bricked his team out of the 2004 finals against Detroit. but yeah, better than LeBron and Duncan .