Player Discussion K'Andre Miller

[TopShelfSnipes]

That's the other problem. If something works for 5 minutes, it takes the Rangers 5 years to realize it's not anymore.

Unless it actually works. Then it takes the Rangers 5 years to try it again.

 

[I Eat Crow]

It's not that odd. He and Trouba don't really make sense as partners. It's another case of the Rangers thinking something works just because it exists.

Like Kreider and Zibanejad...

Miller-Fox
Gus-Trouba
Lindgren-Schneider

Makes so much more sense. Schneider has showed me offensive upside the last two weeks I had no idea he had.

 

[bbny]

The historical complaints that exist with Miller and defensive coverage are still present in spades. He's 24 years old in his 4th season. How long do we give before we say he's unlikely to improve in a significant manner? It's the difference between being a decent but expendable 2nd pairing guy w/ brain farts ala Brady Skjei, versus developing into a 1st pairing guy for the next 7-8 years. The Rangers cut bait with Skjei in his 4th season at 25 y.o. and I don't think anyone regrets it despite him being an annual 40 pt guy in Carolina.

 

[McRanger92]

The historical complaints that exist with Miller and defensive coverage are still present in spades. He's 24 years old in his 4th season. How long do we give before we say he's unlikely to improve in a significant manner? It's the difference between being a decent but expendable 2nd pairing guy w/ brain farts ala Brady Skjei, versus developing into a 1st pairing guy for the next 7-8 years. The Rangers cut bait with Skjei in his 4th season at 25 y.o. and I don't think anyone regrets it despite him being an annual 40 pt guy in Carolina.

Skjei is really a spot on comparison. He looked like a he could develop into a better version of McDonagh early on but it just never happened. Miller is on a similar path it seems

 

[Reijo29]

Miller has a lot of potential

 

[ArPanet]

Setting up to be another Ranger who becomes a stud on another team.

 

[bbny]

Skjei is really a spot on comparison. He looked like a he could develop into a better version of McDonagh early on but it just never happened. Miller is on a similar path it seems

McDonagh had a tremendous first step. Great burst and recovery. Even at his peak I never thought Skjei had McDonagh's burst or recovery speed, which is something that Miller has more of, but I do remember thinking during Skjei's early years that he might be a 60-70 point first pairing defenseman. It was also at a time when we had so much trouble finding offense on the blue line. That outlook faded significantly in the year or so before they traded him. I viewed Miller in the same light, but over about the last year it's started to look more like Skjei. Not sure there's a lot more to give. Maybe a little, but not a lot.

 

[zlev]

The historical complaints that exist with Miller and defensive coverage are still present in spades. He's 24 years old in his 4th season. How long do we give before we say he's unlikely to improve in a significant manner? It's the difference between being a decent but expendable 2nd pairing guy w/ brain farts ala Brady Skjei, versus developing into a 1st pairing guy for the next 7-8 years. The Rangers cut bait with Skjei in his 4th season at 25 y.o. and I don't think anyone regrets it despite him being an annual 40 pt guy in Carolina.

we should regret it. we could've kept/signed Skjei and never traded for/signed Trouba and we'd have a much better player plus $2.5mil in cap space. Skjei should be a cautionary tale if anything seeing as he's improved a ton since we got rid of him.

Miller needs a different D partner

 

[bbny]

we should regret it. we could've kept/signed Skjei and never traded for/signed Trouba and we'd have a much better player plus $2.5mil in cap space.

Miller needs a different D partner

I can see why you'd correlate these two things, but overpaying Trouba doesn't mean trading Skjei was wrong. I agree with you though. If given the option between the two paths, I'd have rather kept Skjei and his contract, than to overpay to acquire and keep Trouba.

 

[zlev]

I can see why you'd correlate these two things, but overpaying Trouba doesn't mean trading Skjei was wrong. I agree with you though. If given the option between the two paths, I'd have rather kept Skjei and his contract, than to overpay to acquire and keep Trouba.

right, we had both of them at the same time, but we only got rid of Skjei because at the time we had to sign both he and Kreider and we couldn't fit both of them under the cap. without Trouba on the payroll we could have.

 

[brakeyawself]

How did KAm go from hottest thing on the ice last May, to this.........

 

[brakeyawself]

Miller has more potential than any other defenseman in the NHL in my opinion and has a path to reach that potential in the next three or four years. He has tools that should be illegal. That all said, he makes some real bad decisions like pinching at real inopportune times and letting up massive odd man rushes, he gets his pocket picked when holding the puck for too long, he makes cross ice passes instead of dumping it deep when really needed. But I feel like Lavi is a great coach to help him with that bad decision making and can help him to reach that potential that he has. Honestly, more excited about his potential than any of the young Norris contenders like Hughes, Fox, Makar, and Josi. If Miller hits his potential he is literally a new era Pronger at the top of his domination when he dictated games for 30 minutes on the ice everyday.

 

[tlk]

How did KAm go from hottest thing on the ice last May, to this.........

Maybe by not doing less dumb things while not doing more smart things either.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

The historical complaints that exist with Miller and defensive coverage are still present in spades. He's 24 years old in his 4th season. How long do we give before we say he's unlikely to improve in a significant manner? It's the difference between being a decent but expendable 2nd pairing guy w/ brain farts ala Brady Skjei, versus developing into a 1st pairing guy for the next 7-8 years. The Rangers cut bait with Skjei in his 4th season at 25 y.o. and I don't think anyone regrets it despite him being an annual 40 pt guy in Carolina.

This might be an unpopular take, and I am by no means comparing the two players here, but in terms of trajectory, K'Andre Miller reminds me A LOT of Michael Del Zotto at the same age. Sather moved on from Del Zotto around this time in exchange for Kevin Klein.

Now, I am not a "History repeats itself" person but it would be almost poetic if the same thing happens to Miller in the coming days. Not that I expect it just yet, but Miller's leash is getting shorter, I feel. It's a shame because he is so talented. He just can't put it together consistently just yet.

 

[17futurecap]

How about pairing him with a good dman? I heard we have one of the best dmen in the NHL. Instead, we are playing Fox and Miller with two oafs.

 

[turcotte8]

Miller runs all over the place. Trouba runs all over the place.

Put them together and that spells disaster.

Miller needs a steady sound positional partner. I'd rather try and trade for one of those than trade Miller.

Trouba needs to go.

 

[tlk]

Miller runs all over the place. Trouba runs all over the place.

Put them together and that spells disaster.

Miller needs a steady sound positional partner. I'd rather try and trade for one of those than trade Miller.

Trouba needs to go.

And who's gonna provide us with what Trouba can bring in the play offs? Miller?

Spoiler

 

[turcotte8]

And who's gonna provide us with what Trouba can bring in the play offs? Miller?

Spoiler

what does Trouba provide? bad defense, no offense, turn overs, bad pinches, 1 big hit every 10 games?

 

[McRanger92]

what does Trouba provide? bad defense, no offense, turn overs, bad pinches, 1 big hit every 10 games?

Miller does all of that but with zero hits tbh. Just calling it like it is. They both have sucked all year.

 

[tlk]

what does Trouba provide? bad defense, no offense, turn overs, bad pinches, 1 big hit every 10 games?

Was going to answer with the similar retort as above tbh.

1 big hit every 10 games in the playoffs could make or break your game. What even remotely decisive Miller can bring? Even in theory? Speed? He has been skated around in the DZ this season. Defensive plays because of his reach? Watch back MacKinnon's goal against us and what Miller did trying to stop him.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Miller does all of that but with zero hits tbh. Just calling it like it is. They both have sucked all year.

Nah.

Miller has had tough moments but has been mostly good. Trouba had a good of January month but has been horrible otherwise.

Having to play with Lindgren and Trouba are tall tasks. Lavi should do Miller and Fox a favor and just play the 2 of them together while limiting the f*** out of what the doo doo duo see 5v5.

Was going to answer with the similar retort as above tbh.

1 big hit every 10 games in the playoffs could make or break your game. What even remotely decisive Miller can bring? Even in theory? Speed? He has been skated around in the DZ this season. Defensive plays because of his reach? Watch back MacKinnon's goal against us and what Miller did trying to stop him.

I mean if your core argument is going to be "LOOK WHAT HAPPENED WITH MACKINNON!" then you might as well not even have one.

1. MacK is f***ing elite and does shit to everyone
2. Did you miss the part where Goodrow's slug ass get burned?
3. The play resulted in a 1v1 with Schneider (who actually played him pretty well.)
4. It was a shot that Quick should have stopped.


Miller allows the lowest rate of quality chances of ALL of our D. That is fact.

Don't let your bias cloud the truth.

 

[McRanger92]

Nah.

Miller has had tough moments but has been mostly good. Trouba had a good of January month but has been horrible otherwise.

Having to play with Lindgren and Trouba are tall tasks. Lavi should do Miller and Fox a favor and just play the 2 of them together while limiting the f*** out of what the doo doo duo see 5v5.




I mean if your core argument is going to be "LOOK WHAT HAPPENED WITH MACKINNON!" then you might as well not even have one.

1. MacK is f***ing elite and does shit to everyone
2. Did you miss the part where Goodrow's slug ass get burned?
3. The play resulted in a 1v1 with Schneider (who actually played him pretty well.)
4. It was a shot that Quick should have stopped.


Miller allows the lowest rate of quality chances of ALL of our D. That is fact.

Don't let your bias cloud the truth.

Not here for the "yeah but Trouba!" crutch regarding Miller. Ive been a vocal advocate of Miller in the past but he hasnt progressed a bit since last year and if anything has gotten worse. The problem with him is that we all gush about the upside, but we never see it outside of one off games. He looks like Brady Skjei to me. Which isnt bad but its disappointing. Im very willing to eat my words if he plays with some purpose down the stretch and in the playoffs.

 

[tlk]

MacK is f***ing elite and does shit to everyone

Exactly. And trying to rob him of the puck Miller made a complete ass of himself, 100% played into his hands. Rather than just group and hit him. McK hadn't had much space to go. Also bc Goodraw was covering from the centre.
And oh I wished this was the sole argument.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Not here for the "yeah but Trouba!" crutch regarding Miller. Ive been a vocal advocate of Miller in the past but he hasnt progressed a bit since last year and if anything has gotten worse. The problem with him is that we all gush about the upside, but we never see it outside of one off games. He looks like Brady Skjei to me. Which isnt bad but its disappointing. Im very willing to eat my words if he plays with some purpose down the stretch and in the playoffs.

You can not be here for it but it makes an impact.

When rush chances are basically guaranteed because your partner can't gap up (Trouba) it's going to have an impact.

Wheres this proof that he's gotten worse? Seriously if you're going to make statements like that you need to show your work. I'm not going to trust your anecdotal evidence because guess what? I watch the games too.

I will never understand why there are certain players who a handful of posters cannot WAIT to jump over when a mistake is made but it's crickets for other players who will make dozens of mistakes on a nightly basis (Hello Lindgren!)

 

[McRanger92]

You can not be here for it but it makes an impact.

When rush chances are basically guaranteed because your partner can't gap up (Trouba) it's going to have an impact.

Wheres this proof that he's gotten worse? Seriously if you're going to make statements like that you need to show your work. I'm not going to trust your anecdotal evidence because guess what? I watch the games too.

I will never understand why there are certain players who a handful of posters cannot WAIT to jump over when a mistake is made but it's crickets for other players who will make dozens of mistakes on a nightly basis (Hello Lindgren!)

I think the whole defense stinks outside of Fox and Schneider so don't lump me in with the people giving Trouba and Lindgren a pass. Miller making a ton of loud mistakes is anecdotal but I can honestly excuse that because they get tough matchups and in today's NHL odd man rushes are hard to completely avoid. My issue is the complete lack of physicality from a big guy and his inability to pass/refusal to skate the puck out of his own zone. K'Andre also agrees with me that he has sucked this year because he has said it himself on more than one occasion. 7 assists and 0 goals in 2 months is quite bad for a player of his caliber and role. Maybe he hasnt regressed (he has production wise) but he hasn't gotten any better and that's disappointing in and of itself.