Jonathan Bernier - Player Discussion 2016

airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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who cares about tv shows
He's under contract unless u can come up with a better option that requires no assets to get he should stay

Offseasons are there to prepare for the season. If you don't prepare you can't compete, that's what we saw from Bernier this season.

There are many UFA every year, guys you can get for free and are much cheaper than Bernier. We will talk about it after the season.
 

Kiwi

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Mar 5, 2016
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Well I would be looking to get him on the cheap if the expansion happens. He is not my first choice but he is in my top 4.
Iirc he had 50+ starts last year and was good but as you stated stats can mislead. Luckily Lou seems to have a good goalie eye so I will be comfortable with whoever he sees as our starter.[/QUtOTE]

Yeah I would agree with you on that lou is really good at picking the right guy
The Anaheim GM may not be quite as unrealistic as their fans one would hope my dream is sampsonov or Murray but that is probably unrealistic
 

airbus220

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I think it's just the one groin injury and if it is fully healed now it should be as strong as ever. Let's hope it is all good.

Sure every groin muscle will heal by time but they are not automatically strong. You need special training to make them strong which takes time and knowledge how to do it. That's really not easy and the reason why most goalies struggle with it. Bernier wasn't well prepared last October, hard to imagine that that should change.
 

saltming

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Well I would be looking to get him on the cheap if the expansion happens. He is not my first choice but he is in my top 4.
Iirc he had 50+ starts last year and was good but as you stated stats can mislead. Luckily Lou seems to have a good goalie eye so I will be comfortable with whoever he sees as our starter.[/QUtOTE]

Yeah I would agree with you on that lou is really good at picking the right guy
The Anaheim GM may not be quite as unrealistic as their fans one would hope my dream is sampsonov or Murray but that is probably unrealistic

I like Samsonov too. My dream is sorokin bit also probably unrealistic.
 

saltming

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Sure every groin muscle will heal by time but they are not automatically strong. You need special training to make them strong which takes time and knowledge how to do it. That's really not easy and the reason why most goalies struggle with it. Bernier wasn't well prepared last October, hard to imagine that that should change.

New management has changed a lot. Let's see what next year brings.
 

81Reasons

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Nov 21, 2013
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Berniers struggles this year had noting to do with a groin issue...it was a mental issue.

He has displayed those issues since he first arrived, albeit this year they happened with more frequency.
 

airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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2 of those are a platoon and easily = or > reimer. Vas is looking pretty good but still young and unproven.
Bishop is beyond reimer. Hands down.

Stats from War-On-Ice

save% 5on5
Reimer .9422
Bishop .9328
Andersen .9327
Vasi .9277
Gibson .9219

adjusted save% 5on5
Reimer .9412
Bishop .9330
Andersen .9310
Vasi .9251
Gibson .9149

high danger zone save%
Reimer .9024
Vasi .8687
Andersen .8660
Bishop .8533
Gibson .8054

Nobody of those 4 is even close to Reimer and their teams might be even better.
 

Kiwi

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Mar 5, 2016
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Stats from War-On-Ice

save% 5on5
Reimer .9422
Bishop .9328
Andersen .9327
Vasi .9277
Gibson .9219

adjusted save% 5on5
Reimer .9412
Bishop .9330
Andersen .9310
Vasi .9251
Gibson .9149

high danger zone save%
Reimer .9024
Vasi .8687
Andersen .8660
Bishop .8533
Gibson .8054

Nobody of those 4 is even close to Reimer and their teams might be even better.

Reimer is not a starter he is way to streaky when he is hot he is brilliant when he Is not he is a liability
Teams want constancy he is not that man if he was we would have got something for him at the tdl
 

airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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Reimer is not a starter he is way to streaky when he is hot he is brilliant when he Is not he is a liability
Teams want constancy he is not that man if he was we would have got something for him at the tdl

We got nothing because Babcock overused him and let him peak in November and then brought him back too early after injury. No wonder Reimer's performance went down. But he recovered from it now, 2 shutouts in his last 4 games and only 1 goal against in EV in those 4 games.

Babcock has no feeling for workload and how could he, he was a loser in his active career. Sport is all about timing, to do the right things at the right time.
 

Kiwi

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We got nothing because Babcock overused him and let him peak in November and then brought him back too early after injury. No wonder Reimer's performance went down. But he recovered from it now, 2 shutouts in his last 4 games and only 1 goal against in EV in those 4 games.

Babcock has no feeling for workload and how could he, he was a loser in his active career. Sport is all about timing, to do the right things at the right time.

So Reimer not being very good is Babcocks fault now is it
He is playing the worst teams behind a very good team he should be looking good
He is not a top starter that is fact
 

cookie

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So Reimer not being very good is Babcocks fault now is it
He is playing the worst teams behind a very good team he should be looking good
He is not a top starter that is fact

Yes because top starters are found everywhere in the NHL market.

Top starters like Osgood and Crawford have won the cup. Lesser goalies have had more success, heavily due to the teams they were on. So this whole top starter crap is nonsense in its very substance. We had a good thing going on with Reimer and we traded him. The hope now is ride on Bernier, sparks or Stalock (lol), or find another solution externally.
 

airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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So Reimer not being very good is Babcocks fault now is it
He is playing the worst teams behind a very good team he should be looking good
He is not a top starter that is fact

Before Reimer's injury he played much more than Lundqvist and even Lundqvist's performance went down with less workload.

Sure Babcock's fault, a donkey could do better.
 

Kiwi

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Yes because top starters are found everywhere in the NHL market.

Top starters like Osgood and Crawford have won the cup. Lesser goalies have had more success, heavily due to the teams they were on. So this whole top starter crap is nonsense in its very substance. We had a good thing going on with Reimer and we traded him. The hope now is ride on Bernier, sparks or Stalock (lol), or find another solution externally.

Neither Reimer or Bernier are the answer and that is defiantly a fact
Reimer is a good person but everybody seams to have seriously overestimated what he is and that is a good backup
Bernier is definatly no better but please let's be realistic about both of them
 

cookie

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Neither Reimer or Bernier are the answer and that is defiantly a fact
Reimer is a good person but everybody seams to have seriously overestimated what he is and that is a good backup
Bernier is definatly no better but please let's be realistic about both of them

Fact based purely on conjecture. People were saying the same thing you've said about Chris Osgood, M.A. Fleury, and Corey Crawford. The fact is that a good enough goalie gets you far enough. Reimer played that part and his stats are fact, not conjecture. He had to go because it was a numbers game here in Toronto and possibly because his contract demands were too high. The goal is to have a team that consistently competes. In my mind, Reimer showed enough to warrant a starter's job.

But this is a thread about Bernier. The hope is that he comes back better than before in the mental side of things for next season. There's also been groin issues, historically speaking, as well as the intrinsic size problem. With that being said, Bernier has performed quite well in spurts and the thinking is that a technically sound goalie puts up consistent performances. Playing well consistently is the name of the game for starters.
 
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airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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Yes because top starters are found everywhere in the NHL market.

Top starters like Osgood and Crawford have won the cup. Lesser goalies have had more success, heavily due to the teams they were on. So this whole top starter crap is nonsense in its very substance. We had a good thing going on with Reimer and we traded him. The hope now is ride on Bernier, sparks or Stalock (lol), or find another solution externally.

That makes Babcock's comment look even more foolish to say before the season that Bernier will play 60 games. There is no human who can play 60 games very good. Every goalie will go down if he has to play every 2nd day, every, Lundqvist, Scheider, Holtby, there's no exeption, it's only a matter of time. Even Babcock did it.
 

cookie

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That makes Babcock's comment look even more foolish to say before the season that Bernier will play 60 games. There is no human who can play 60 games very good. Every goalie will go down if he has to play every 2nd day, every, Lundqvist, Scheider, Holtby, there's no exeption, it's only a matter of time. Even Babcock did it.

And I think that was one of the things that the Detroit board jumped on him for. I think the only guy who could pull off 60 games over and over was Brodeur. What's overlooked is that the proliferation of the butterfly and the contortions these guys go through on a regular basis put a MUCH higher strain on the body than playing stand-up. Holtby and Schneider are rare cases and there's even talks about holtby slowing down. I honestly think injuries happen much more now than they did before.
 

TMLegend

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May 27, 2012
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Really bugs me when it's the same posters who bring up and discuss Reimer in every thread related to goaltending, especially now that he's gone.

It also bugs me that Reimer is the only starting goaltender in the league to have never even play half of his teams games in a season, let alone play the traditional 55+ in a season like all the rest do, if healthy of course. There's always an excuse though nonetheless. There's enough there to start a wheel of excuses.

Reimer will probably get a chance to be a de facto #1 next season, and we'll see what he's got. I'd bet money on it being Calgary actually. My opinion isn't a high one on him, as he's about as hot and cold as they come and quite fragile at that. But we'll all see what he is going forward.
 

saltming

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Stats from War-On-Ice

save% 5on5
Reimer .9422
Bishop .9328
Andersen .9327
Vasi .9277
Gibson .9219

adjusted save% 5on5
Reimer .9412
Bishop .9330
Andersen .9310
Vasi .9251
Gibson .9149

high danger zone save%
Reimer .9024
Vasi .8687
Andersen .8660
Bishop .8533
Gibson .8054

Nobody of those 4 is even close to Reimer and their teams might be even better.

It's impressive yes, but easier to do when not doing a starters workload.
Even andersen had 50+ starts last year.
 

saltming

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Yes because top starters are found everywhere in the NHL market.

Top starters like Osgood and Crawford have won the cup. Lesser goalies have had more success, heavily due to the teams they were on. So this whole top starter crap is nonsense in its very substance. We had a good thing going on with Reimer and we traded him. The hope now is ride on Bernier, sparks or Stalock (lol), or find another solution externally.

It's spelled bibeau not stalock.
 

saltming

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We got nothing because Babcock overused him and let him peak in November and then brought him back too early after injury. No wonder Reimer's performance went down. But he recovered from it now, 2 shutouts in his last 4 games and only 1 goal against in EV in those 4 games.

Babcock has no feeling for workload and how could he, he was a loser in his active career. Sport is all about timing, to do the right things at the right time.

Such a bad coach. What were we thinking hiring him. He has no give-a-sh@! Metre, no system, no winning pedigree, no nothing. Fire the bum already!
 

Kiwi

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Reimer is not even in the same league as Crawford or Osgood lets get real here
They are proven playoff Stanley cup winners Reimer hasn't won anything and can't seem to stay fit the entire season realism please
 

airbus220

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Feb 19, 2012
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Was it bad coaching or Bernier's game taking a midseason vacation?

I think Bernier wasn't well prepared for the season, there was a little hint in his preseason stats. As a coach you never know how conditioned your goalie is at the start of a season, so you should always be very careful with the workload, you will lose nothing, the season is so very long. That's the main task for a coach, but Babcock started Bernier in the first 2 games when there was no reason to do so because of the schedule and Reimers preseason stats were so good. Babcock failed in the 2nd game and as I said Bernier was bad prepared. Babcock is also not patient enough, he let Bernier get ice cold but then was surprised when Bernier had a bad game. Question is will they both learn from it, I doubt that. Bernier is lazy and Babcock doesn't know the basics, a loser in his active career.
There is also this question, Babcock didn't start Howard b2b, why change this philosophy here.
 

saltming

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Before Reimer's injury he played much more than Lundqvist and even Lundqvist's performance went down with less workload.

Sure Babcock's fault, a donkey could do better.

Hank does like 60+ starts a year!!! He plays almost 2 reimer seasons in 1 reimer season.
That is a very important point.
 

saltming

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Fact based purely on conjecture. People were saying the same thing you've said about Chris Osgood, M.A. Fleury, and Corey Crawford. The fact is that a good enough goalie gets you far enough. Reimer played that part and his stats are fact, not conjecture. He had to go because it was a numbers game here in Toronto and possibly because his contract demands were too high. The goal is to have a team that consistently competes. In my mind, Reimer showed enough to warrant a starter's job.

But this is a thread about Bernier. The hope is that he comes back better than before in the mental side of things for next season. There's also been groin issues, historically speaking, as well as the intrinsic size problem. With that being said, Bernier has performed quite well in spurts and the thinking is that a technically sound goalie puts up consistent performances. Playing well consistently is the name of the game for starters.
Re reimer: games played is a stat and a very important one for goalies. Why overlook it?

Re bernier: his recent play is why I'm thinking it was maybe the remnant of his groin injury, lack of confidence that it wouldn't become rein injured, as to that he was so off. He has been extremely mobile the last few games.
 

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