Speculation: Johnny Hockey

[tictactoe]

Well if he hits the market, will be exciting

I agree

 

[Perennial]

Something kinda happened that put a damper on that, and Gaudreau's got 1.5 years yet for the market to recover.

Pietrangelo got a 7 year deal at 8.8 million per season...

Josh Anderson got a 7 year deal at 5.5 per season...

So, why did Hall end up taking a 1 year deal in Buffalo?

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

yeah and like I said.. if no injuries both will probably outsscore Gaudreau this season. makes szero sense to make the move from Flyers prospective. Unreasonable.


The New Jersey Devils have traded star Taylor Hall and Blake Speers to the Arizona Coyotes in exchange for a 2020 conditional first-round draft pick, a conditional 2021 third-rounder, along with forward prospects Nate Schnarr, Nick Merkley and defenceman Kevin Bahl.

You see Konecny or Patrick like players in this trade?

You think Konecny and Patrick probably outscore Gaudreau this year with no injuries? Konecny's not even outscoring him with more games played right now. What a homer take. I would be willing to bet Gaudreau gets the same or more points than both players combined.

As for the Hall trade, there is a massive difference between a 1.5 years of team control vs 2 months of team control. If you need an example look at what Blake Coleman cost vs what Erik Gustafsson cost at the least deadline

 

[mja]

Pietrangelo got a 7 year deal at 8.8 million per season...

Josh Anderson got a 7 year deal at 5.5 per season...

So, why did Hall end up taking a 1 year deal in Buffalo?

Because he bet on himself being able to land a bigger deal the following off-season?

I'm not even sure what point you are trying to drive at - is it that high scoring wingers aren't worth term? What about Hall's particular circumstances match up with Gaudreau's?

 

[Boondock]

I think Calgary is in "win now" mode. I can't see them being interested in trading JG unless they are forced. Calgary just went out and spent money on 2 free agents over 30 (Markstrom and Tanev), now they are going to start a rebuild by trading Gaudreau? I can't see the Flyers being interested in moving TK with his play and cap hit, so the pieces the Flames would be getting back would be "rebuild" type pieces (Frost, Patrick, picks). The next 2 seasons are sort of the window as players like Gio, Backlund, Lucic, Tanev and Markstrom are all over 30. Tkachuk will need a new deal in 2 seasons and his qualifier is $9million, Gaudreau will need a new deal $$$$ and core players such as Monahan and Lindholm will be 2 years closer to exiting their prime. Yes Calgary has a few young players in their system but I don't see that elite talent you need to drive a team. I think Calgary should keep JG and see what they can do, trading him for anything short of a landslide win would be a backwards step for the Flames and any cup dreams they might have.

 

[Tripod]

yawn...this again?

Giroux
JVR
Lindblom

Flyers don't need a LWer.

As for the Konecny+ stuff....TK is younger, cheaper and has produced as much as JG the last year+. TK has 69 pts the last 75 games and JG has 68 pts the last 78. Not going to happen.

 

[tictactoe]

You think Konecny and Patrick probably outscore Gaudreau this year with no injuries? Konecny's not even outscoring him with more games played right now. What a homer take. I would be willing to bet Gaudreau gets the same or more points than both players combined.

As for the Hall trade, there is a massive difference between a 1.5 years of team control vs 2 months of team control. If you need an example look at what Blake Coleman cost vs what Erik Gustafsson cost at the least deadline

Well Konecny did outscore Gaudreau last year... Flyers are not about to trade 60pts guy to get 80pts guy and add someone like Patrick in the mix.

By the way before jumping into conversation throwing "what a joke" statements you should take a few min and read the thread, you would see hat I did say that Gaudreau is a btetter player than Konecny. No one arguing this. lol.


Yes there is a difference between 1.5 Gaudreau vs ufa Hall it's not a perfect comparasin but it is close enough. Still I do not see Patrick or even Konecny like players in that trade, now even close.

 

[McJedi]

That shootout goal he potted last night was NOoooIiiiccccceeeee.

 

[Tripod]

You think Konecny and Patrick probably outscore Gaudreau this year with no injuries? Konecny's not even outscoring him with more games played right now. What a homer take. I would be willing to bet Gaudreau gets the same or more points than both players combined.

As for the Hall trade, there is a massive difference between a 1.5 years of team control vs 2 months of team control. If you need an example look at what Blake Coleman cost vs what Erik Gustafsson cost at the least deadline

Konecny outscored JG last year....

 

[Perennial]

Because he bet on himself being able to land a bigger deal the following off-season?

I'm not even sure what point you are trying to drive at - is it that high scoring wingers aren't worth term? What about Hall's particular circumstances match up with Gaudreau's?

I thought the point was obvious...

There's no guarantee that "Gaudreau's getting 7 or 8 years at 9+ a year wherever he ends up."

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Well Konecny did outscore Gaudreau last year... Flyers are not about to trade 60pts guy to get 80pts guy and add someone like Patrick in the mix.

By the way before jumping into conversation throwing "what a joke" statements you should take a few min and read the thread, you would see hat I did say that Gaudreau is a btetter player than Konecny. No one arguing this. lol.


Yes there is a difference between 1.5 Gaudreau vs ufa Hall it's not a perfect comparasin but it is close enough. Still I do not see Patrick or even Konecny like players in that trade, now even close.

If Philly is acquiring Gaudreau, Patrick or Frost (probably Patrick) is 100% involved, unless TK is involved. A closer valuation of a potential Gaudreau trade this year is Duchene to Ottawa.

 

[mja]

I thought the point was obvious...

There's no guarantee that "Gaudreau's getting 7 or 8 years at 9+ a year wherever he ends up."

Fine, it's HIGHLY LIKELY that Gaudreau's getting 7 or 8 years at 9+ a year. Happy now?

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Konecny outscored JG last year....

So a career high vs a career low? 2 years ago Gaudreau literally had more than double Konecny's points.

 

[tictactoe]

If Philly is acquiring Gaudreau, Patrick or Frost (probably Patrick) is 100% involved, unless TK is involved. A closer valuation of a potential Gaudreau trade this year is Duchene to Ottawa.

Boss... Duchene to Ottawa was 3 way deal that also involved Colorado and Nashville. How can you even compare it. lol... I thnk you shoudl try to stay away from conversation.

 

[Double Dion]

Fine, it's HIGHLY LIKELY that Gaudreau's getting 7 or 8 years at 9+ a year. Happy now?

I think that's the number he would have gotten pre covid. I think the market has changed now though. Barzal got 7, Dubois 5, Hall 1 year at 8. I think if you gave Johnny term you could get him at 7.5M.

 

[mja]

I think that's the number he would have gotten pre covid. I think the market has changed now though. Barzal got 7, Dubois 5, Hall 1 year at 8. I think if you gave Johnny term you could get him at 7.5M.

RFA, RFA, betting on himself being able to get a bigger deal. Gaudreau still has 2 seasons for the market to recover before inking a deal.

 

[DJJones]

If we trade him this summer I'd be surprised if Philly has the best offer.

He's not Iginla, we aren't going to trade him out of generosity

 

[Double Dion]

RFA, RFA, betting on himself being able to get a bigger deal. Gaudreau still has 2 seasons for the market to recover before inking a deal.

Yes RFA does make a difference, but so does age. Johnny will be 28 when he signs his next deal. You could be right on 2 seasons for the market to recover, but I don't think the market recovers until the cap goes up, and I don't think that will happen for 5 years.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Boss... Duchene to Ottawa was 3 way deal that also involved Colorado and Nashville. How can you even compare it.

Pretty easily, it being a 3 way deal has nothing to do with what Duchene returned. Ottawa literally only got Duchene and Nashville literally only got Turris.

 

[Perennial]

Fine, it's HIGHLY LIKELY that Gaudreau's getting 7 or 8 years at 9+ a year. Happy now?

I don't even agree with that...

Pietrangelo only got 8.8 million, and I think most would take him over Gaudreau...

If Johnny has his heart set on playing in Philly, I would think he'll give them a hometown discount, meaning he'll be below 9 million a season

 

[mja]

So a career high vs a career low? 2 years ago Gaudreau literally had more than double Konecny's points.

You mean then 21 year old Konecny? C'mon my man. No one's debating who's the better player--it's clearly Gaudreau, but you know trade value is based on more than that. Konecny is signed for 5 seasons at 5.5 million. Trading him for an older player nearing the cusp of UFA and in line to get a big contract with any number of potential suitors is problematic at best.

 

[Double Dion]

You mean then 21 year old Konecny? C'mon my man. No one's debating who's the better player--it's clearly Gaudreau, but you know trade value is based on more than that. Konecny is signed for 5 seasons at 5.5 million. Trading him for an older player nearing the cusp of UFA and in line to get a big contract with any number of potential suitors is problematic at best.

I'd agree with your premise. I do think Konecny has more value than Gaudreau, but it's not miles more. It's certainly not as big a gap as the gap between JVR or Voracek and Gaudreau.

 

[mja]

I don't even agree with that...

Pietrangelo only got 8.8 million, and I think most would take him over Gaudreau...

If Johnny has his heart set on playing in Philly, I would think he'll give them a hometown discount, meaning he'll be below 9 million a season

Look, as a Flyers fan, I'd be completely down with Gaudreau inking something like 7 mill for 6 years, I just have no faith in that actually happening whatsoever.

 

[Bigkarl]

If JVR is taken in the ED, I’d say it would possibly be something the flyers would kick the tires on, as JVR’s departure creates a spot in the top 9 and frees up the cap space. At that point, you’re looking at 1 year rental prices.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

You mean then 21 year old Konecny? C'mon my man. No one's debating who's the better player--it's clearly Gaudreau, but you know trade value is based on more than that. Konecny is signed for 5 seasons at 5.5 million. Trading him for an older player nearing the cusp of UFA and in line to get a big contract with any number of potential suitors is problematic at best.

When did I argue trade value? I don't expect Philly to offer Konecny. My original quote was about that homer above claiming Konecny and Patrick will probably outscore Gaudreau this year, which in itself is a fundamentally horrible take. There won't be a trade but if there was it would likely be around Patrick++