Jim Benning Discussion -- Part II

[arsmaster*]

Tired of the Schneider return arguments, goalie market is horrible Schneider had a better return than most goalies these days

A top 10 draft pick for a guy with ~60 career starts is pretty much the best return we've seen on a goalie with that small of a resume.

 

[Morenz]

Lol. I guess Tanev and Edler are doing nothing for us and Sbisa is making a huge contribution. Does anyone else find it hilarious that the posters like Diamonddog01, who attacked Gillis constantly, as well as any poster who dared defend the most successful gm we have ever had, now cry if anyone dares look at Bennings work.

I remember them constantly attacking posters, even driving them from this site. Telling them they had their head in the sand if they didn't believe Gillis was the worst gm in history, refusing to acknowledge any of the good Gillis accomplished.

Oh the irony that they now sit here constantly accusing others that the only reason they don't like Benning is because he is not Gillis. They are the one with their head in the sand. They defend even the stupid Benning decisions because of their bizarre hatred of Gillis. Their love of Benning has nothing to do with him and everything to do with defending their hatred of the old gm.

I appreciate what Gillis did for the Canucks in the earlier years, but wasn't upset he was let go. I was glad Benning was hired, but that doesn't stop me from worrying, as he has made some poor decisions since getting the job.

I feel like most of the posters getting attacked for having an opinion on Bennings work have the same attitude as me. They are not attacking Benning because of Gillis but because they care about the Canucks. I can't say the same for many of the Benning defenders. Rather than love of the Canucks their posts seem more about attacking the old gm.

So many of the good posters, who actually watch lots of games, seem to post less and less. I appreciate their contributions and hope they stay and not get driven away by those who only care about their hatred of the old gm.

 

[Stonz]

I'm not a Benning guy, I'm a "Give the new GM a chance" guy.

A lot of the criticism Benning has received is entirely because he's Benning and not Gillis.

For whatever reason, some posters have pre-determined that they're going to criticize everything Benning does. Look at the reaction to the Kassian trade rumours - people are already complaining about a trade that hasn't happened! Benning could turn Kassian into Crosby, and people would come on here and complain about Crosby's cap hit and concussion history.

Two sides to that coin. There are certain people here who will justify every Benning move simply because they hated Gillis. They feel some sort of duty to defend anything Benning does. Those in this group are plainly obvious.

Meanwhile, there's plenty of people here that can objectively assess each move on its own merits, without bias towards one GM or the other. Unfortunately, any criticism they may offer of Benning is immediately dismissed as being simply a "Gillis fanboy". It's awfully tiring.

 

[thepuckmonster]

Two sides to that coin. There are certain people here who will justify every Benning move simply because they hated Gillis. They feel some sort of duty to defend anything Benning does. Those in this group are plainly obvious.

Meanwhile, there's plenty of people here that can objectively assess each move on its own merits, without bias towards one GM or the other. Unfortunately, any criticism they may offer of Benning is immediately dismissed as being simply a "Gillis fanboy". It's awfully tiring.

There's also another group that still thinks Benning is incompetent, "looks stupid, "sounds stupid", and "has a stupid haircut". They've provided no real insight as to why they hate him beyond that "he's stupid".

And then there is some smaller groups in between. But mostly those three opinions are the most vocal.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

There's also another group that still thinks Benning is incompetent, "looks stupid, "sounds stupid", and "has a stupid haircut". They've provided no real insight as to why they hate him beyond that "he's stupid".

And then there is some smaller groups in between. But mostly those three opinions are the most vocal.

Agreed.
The most tiresome part is hearing how Sbisa is responsible for every loss.
The same people rag on him because they don't like the Kesler deal rather than objectively assessing his play. Is he a top 4 guy? No. Is he any worse than Stanton and Weber most nights? Objectively he's been at least as good.
Same with Miller. His numbers are as good as Lundqvist and better than Quick. I don't have an issue with people who think the deal is too long but realistically we weren't going with Lack as our starter. No GM would have done that.

 

[Diamonddog01]

Lol. I guess Tanev and Edler are doing nothing for us and Sbisa is making a huge contribution. Does anyone else find it hilarious that the posters like Diamonddog01, who attacked Gillis constantly, as well as any poster who dared defend the most successful gm we have ever had, now cry if anyone dares look at Bennings work.

I remember them constantly attacking posters, even driving them from this site. Telling them they had their head in the sand if they didn't believe Gillis was the worst gm in history, refusing to acknowledge any of the good Gillis accomplished.

Oh the irony that they now sit here constantly accusing others that the only reason they don't like Benning is because he is not Gillis. They are the one with their head in the sand. They defend even the stupid Benning decisions because of their bizarre hatred of Gillis. Their love of Benning has nothing to do with him and everything to do with defending their hatred of the old gm.

I appreciate what Gillis did for the Canucks in the earlier years, but wasn't upset he was let go. I was glad Benning was hired, but that doesn't stop me from worrying, as he has made some poor decisions since getting the job.

I feel like most of the posters getting attacked for having an opinion on Bennings work have the same attitude as me. They are not attacking Benning because of Gillis but because they care about the Canucks. I can't say the same for many of the Benning defenders. Rather than love of the Canucks their posts seem more about attacking the old gm.

So many of the good posters, who actually watch lots of games, seem to post less and less. I appreciate their contributions and hope they stay and not get driven away by those who only care about their hatred of the old gm.

Such exaggeration and hyperbole. Speaks volumes regarding your argument.

Many of us have grudgingly commented on the good Gillis did, and have questioned things such as the Miller signing (which looks better as time goes on). I guess if you want to view appreciating the work Benning has done thus far and being positive/optimistc about the team as something to do with Gillis that's up to you. I can assure that this is not the case where I'm concerned.

 

[Ryp37]

If the market is that bad for goalies then we should have hung onto him.
The obvious move was to trade Luongo.
Instead we lost both.

Yeah the obvious move was the hardest one to make clearly

 

[Alan Jackson]

Two sides to that coin. There are certain people here who will justify every Benning move simply because they hated Gillis. They feel some sort of duty to defend anything Benning does. Those in this group are plainly obvious.

Meanwhile, there's plenty of people here that can objectively assess each move on its own merits, without bias towards one GM or the other. Unfortunately, any criticism they may offer of Benning is immediately dismissed as being simply a "Gillis fanboy". It's awfully tiring.

Benning has been on the job for less than a year. We don't know how many of these moves are going to turn out yet. I'm not "defending anything Benning does", I'm just saying we need to wait a few more months before we declare that Benning is a clown who needs help dressing himself.

Gillis has a body of work we can judge him on. Benning does not.

I mean, Christ, the team has played pretty well. Why are some people so insistent on *****ing and moaning?

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Yeah the obvious move was the hardest one to make clearly

Sometimes the hardest move is the right move. We had an elite young goalie who loved it here and an older goalie who didn't want to be here.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Benning has been on the job for less than a year. We don't know how many of these moves are going to turn out yet. I'm not "defending anything Benning does", I'm just saying we need to wait a few more months before we declare that Benning is a clown who needs help dressing himself.

Gillis has a body of work we can judge him on. Benning does not.

I mean, Christ, the team has played pretty well. Why are some people so insistent on *****ing and moaning?

But you still haven't answered the question of has Benning got it tougher than Gillis had in his first year? 3 words for you "Snake Oil Sailsman". Has Benning been called anything remotely as horrible? Prairie GM?

I wasn't even a fan of Gillis. In fact, I didn't like the way he operated on many levels. But I won't give Benning a free pass just like I didn't give one to ol' Gil.

 

[Ryp37]

Agreed.
The most tiresome part is hearing how Sbisa is responsible for every loss.
The same people rag on him because they don't like the Kesler deal rather than objectively assessing his play. Is he a top 4 guy? No. Is he any worse than Stanton and Weber most nights? Objectively he's been at least as good.
Same with Miller. His numbers are as good as Lundqvist and better than Quick. I don't have an issue with people who think the deal is too long but realistically we weren't going with Lack as our starter. No GM would have done that.

People rag on Sbisa because he has literally cost the team games with his play while being told by the GM hes a future top 4 ,but he throws a big hit and does okay against a bottom feeder so those people need to stop complaining apparently

 

[Ryp37]

Sometimes the hardest move is the right move. We had an elite young goalie who loved it here and an older goalie who didn't want to be here.

an older goalie who wanted to go to one team that didnt want him

why do people skip that part

 

[Alan Jackson]

But you still haven't answered the question of has Benning got it tougher than Gillis had in his first year? 3 words for you "Snake Oil Sailsman". Has Benning been called anything remotely as horrible? Prairie GM?

My memory is that people were fairly supportive of Gillis early on. I certainly was.

People have inferred that Benning is simple, stupid, an idiot who talks funny and has a bad haircut. Some posters were calling for his head yesterday over a trade that HASN'T HAPPENED YET.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

People rag on Sbisa because he has literally cost the team games with his play while being told by the GM hes a future top 4 ,but he throws a big hit and does okay against a bottom feeder so those people need to stop complaining apparently

Every single one of our defencemen have cost us games. Weber and Stanton as many as Sbisa. And I've seen people rag on Sbisa after games where he isn't on the ice for any goals against. The idea that one of our bottom pairing defencemen is costing most of our losses is ludicrous.
As for him being a potential top 4 defencemen, why would Sbisa be targeted for something Benning said?

 

[Stonz]

Such exaggeration and hyperbole. Speaks volumes regarding your argument.

Many of us have grudgingly commented on the good Gillis did, and have questioned things such as the Miller signing (which looks better as time goes on). I guess if you want to view appreciating the work Benning has done thus far and being positive/optimistc about the team as something to do with Gillis that's up to you. I can assure that this is not the case where I'm concerned.

No, it's really not exaggeration or hyperbole. You may have convinced yourself, but it's plainly evident to anyone with a shred of rational thinking or objectivity.

Your posting history supports his assertions.

 

[Ryp37]

Every single one of our defencemen have cost us games. Weber and Stanton as many as Sbisa. And I've seen people rag on Sbisa after games where he isn't on the ice for any goals against. The idea that one of our bottom pairing defencemen is costing most of our losses is ludicrous.
As for him being a potential top 4 defencemen, why would Sbisa be targeted for something Benning said?

We must be watching different games then

 

[IntangiBo]

If the market is that bad for goalies then we should have hung onto him.
The obvious move was to trade Luongo.
Instead we lost both.

I think this is a Benning thread and I think we all know there some circumstances that made trading Lu difficult.

The return for Cory however was what should be expected. Perhaps a bit more, but not out of line. Of course Benning would have gotten less.

 

[arsmaster*]

Agreed.
The most tiresome part is hearing how Sbisa is responsible for every loss.
The same people rag on him because they don't like the Kesler deal rather than objectively assessing his play. Is he a top 4 guy? No. Is he any worse than Stanton and Weber most nights? Objectively he's been at least as good.
Same with Miller. His numbers are as good as Lundqvist and better than Quick. I don't have an issue with people who think the deal is too long but realistically we weren't going with Lack as our starter. No GM would have done that.

I don't know why we'd be discussing the stupid comments, I don't believe I've ever commented on his voice or his haircut, I ignore those posts.

I generally try and engage people in discussions on why I feel the way I do.

----

With regards to Sbisa, the amount of money you make and the GM publicly stating he was targeted and not the dump he appears to be is where people express their feelings. He has looked on par with Weber and Stanton I guess, the issue, those guys make 5 times less salary and 4 times less the cap hit.

It has everything to do with acquiring him in the 1st place.

-----

Miller is 34, we were told we were retooling. Many thought we'd be looking to get younger considering we were beaten over the head with the idea that Santorelli and Garrison were TOO old to be part of a re-tool. It's just thinks that kind of go against what we were told on others.

I understand the Miller signing. Still don't like $$$ or the term, but I get it.

 

[IntangiBo]

We must be watching different games then

There are people that watch games looking for Sbisa specifically. It's quite clear he has become the scapegoat.

 

[IntangiBo]

People rag on Sbisa because he has literally cost the team games with his play while being told by the GM hes a future top 4 ,but he throws a big hit and does okay against a bottom feeder so those people need to stop complaining apparently

Luca hadn't even played a game and he was already sprouting horns.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

We must be watching different games then

Probably. A lot of games I don't really focus that much on the bottom defencemen.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

My memory is that people were fairly supportive of Gillis early on. I certainly was.

People have inferred that Benning is simple, stupid, an idiot who talks funny and has a bad haircut. Some posters were calling for his head yesterday over a trade that HASN'T HAPPENED YET.

Yea, most people on this forum are from Vancouver, a cosmopolitan city where a lot about Benning clashes. It doesn't make it bad. I have a brother in law from Saskatchewan, love the guy- doesn't stop me from making fun of him a bit about it. Thats the pompousness that comes from being from Vancouver.

And besides, are you saying Benning deserves no criticism in regards to Kassian? the guy went on the radio and blasted Kassian while he was still injured. Are you saying thats above criticism?

 

[Blob Mckenzie*]

It's hilarious. Florida literally got nothing out of either the Booth trade or the Ballard trade and they were both solid deals at the time they were made, they didn't work out, I think everyone can agree to that, but the idea we somehow got fleeced is pretty laughable.

You could rationalize both those trades at the time they went down quite easily, and I can bet most people on this forum applauded both.

Booth was one of the most common names to come up in the armchair thread for about 3 years preceding that deal. Nobody will admit to that now though.

Other than completely wasting cap space they were wonderful trades.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Yea, most people on this forum are from Vancouver, a cosmopolitan city where a lot about Benning clashes. It doesn't make it bad. I have a brother in law from Saskatchewan, love the guy- doesn't stop me from making fun of him a bit about it. Thats the pompousness that comes from being from Vancouver.

You'll be eating those words when the Benning haircut starts to catch on.
I've already seen quite a few young guys copying our GM's do!

 

[arsmaster*]

Probably. A lot of games I don't really focus that much on the bottom defencemen.

Two players we've seen play well in the past (Hamhuis and Bieksa) have looked downright terrible next to Sbisa.

Bieksa is a tire fire in his own right this year IMO, but Hamhuis looked awful next to him this year.