Player Discussion Jesse Puljujarvi Part 9: 98 NO MORE! JERSEY NUMBER NERDS REJOICE!

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PulYou

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Feb 16, 2018
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I think we are off track here again.
Puljujärvis problem was or is not his skating speed but the speed he thinks the game and over all positioning etc., like how he was just bad finding opening at power play.

Last reports from Oulu said to me Puljujärvi still has these problems in Liiga level so I am not getting my hopes to high about NHL.

I oray he can play just solid 2-way and build on that. Be humble and do what his told to.

For someone living in Oulu or in Finland doesn’t make them qualified as scouting expert. Just saying. It is a fallacy, a false attribution - appealing to an irrelevant, unqualified, unidentified, biased or fabricated source in support of an argument.
 

tellermine

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For someone living in Oulu or in Finland doesn’t make them qualified as scouting expert. Just saying. It is a fallacy, a false attribution - appealing to an irrelevant, unqualified, unidentified, biased or fabricated source in support of an argument.

Ok. They are Kärpät fans so they do follow team closely.
Mutch more than I do.
But hey this is internet hockey forum. Place for keyboard warriors and fanboys. :)

If it makes you feel better I dont really care how you do feel about that argument as I trust these people mutch more than you who I dont know at all.

We will see soon and I hope Puljujärvi delivers.
 

PulYou

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Ok. They are Kärpät fans so they do follow team closely.
Mutch more than I do.
But hey this is internet hockey forum. Place for keyboard warriors and fanboys. :)

If it makes you feel better I dont really care how you do feel about that argument as I trust these people mutch more than you who I dont know at all.

We will see soon and I hope Puljujärvi delivers.

Well I was just pointing out Your locigal fallacy. And this would be mine: a close relative of mine is ”a hockey insider” and he has coached some of the players currently playing in the NHL. Because I don’t want to ”spill the beans” here I never refer to him when stating my opinions. I would like though, but referring to an anonymous authority would just be a logical fallacy.

And I have been reading the Kärpät side of Jatkoaika Forum. There are fans writing their opinions and the opinions are fluid, they change with the tide. Yesterday Aaltonen scored four points and he was a rainmaker. But before - hundreds of opinions bashing his game.

And Yes the close relative of mine thinks there is a player there in Pulju and he on the other hand is not sold on Kotkaniemi. <—And this was a logical fallacy.

And drawing conclusions based on eleven games... A big logical fallacy... Come on...
 
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tellermine

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Well I was just pointing out Your locigal fallacy. And this would be mine: a close relative of mine is ”a hockey insider” and he has coached some of the players currently playing in the NHL. Because I don’t want to ”spill the beans” here I never refer to him when stating my opinions. I would like though, but referring to an anonymous authority would just be a logical fallacy.

And I have been reading the Kärpät side of Jatkoaika Forum. There are fans writing their opinions and the opinions are fluid, they change with the tide. Yesterday Aaltonen scored four points and he was a rainmaker. But before - hundreds of opinions bashing his game.

And Yes the close relative of mine thinks there is a player there in Pulju and he on the other hand is not sold on Kotkaniemi. <—And this was a logical fallacy.

And drawing conclusions based on eleven games... A big logical fallacy... Come on...

No. They are opinions.
Dont know to mutch about Jatkoaika, though I think 2 of my pala from Oulu are from there, but not all are talking about 11 games.

But. Lets see what Puljujärvi delivers.
As said earlier. If he takes place as Ok 3rd. liner it is damn well for Oilers.
 

PulYou

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Puljujarvi would work good with a guy that slows the game down and feeds him open opportunities and rushes. I still think McDavid is all wrong for him. Someone like Aho or Draisailt are just better fits with him.

I think You may be right. And we already know he excelled playing with Aho. And there was this one game with Draisaitl when Pulju was chosen as the first star of the game. Although there were some good games with McDavid too. Maybe it was because at the time McDavid was playing sick? Was he accidentally slowing the game down because of it? I couldn’t tell.

He also seems to fit well with another linemate who heavily forechecks too, like Khaira, last season with Lammikko and maybe Laine too. They are tilting the ice and the play is more often in the offensive zone than in the defensive zone.
 
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TopShelfGloveSide

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I think You may be right. And we already know he excelled playing with Aho. And there was this one game with Draisaitl when Pulju was chosen as the first star of the game. Although there were some good games with McDavid too. Maybe it was because at the time McDavid was playing sick? Was he accidentally slowing the game down because of it? I couldn’t tell.

He also seems to fit well with another linemate who heavily forechecks too, like Khaira, last season with Lammikko and maybe Laine too. They are tilting the ice and the play is more often in the offensive zone than in the defensive zone.
Lol put him on a line with JJ.. there’s a path to success.
 

Whyme

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Lol put him on a line with JJ.. there’s a path to success.

It sounds funny now, but in the last preseason Khaira, Strome and Pulju formed a very good line. McLellan broke the line for the first game and Pulju was dropped to the 4th line for the 2nd game and since that things kept going mainly downhill. For all three actually.

E: As written above yes they also had some good games with Nuge. At the time Khaira wasn't as bad, but he did have his shortcomings already then.
 

Whyme

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I'll try to be at least as impartial as I can and open the situation the way I see it. It's a very long post so I understand if nobody reads this, but I try to make this the last post from myself until Pulju gets back and I hope to open some issues with my words.

This season Pulju's performance has varied enough to feed all kinds of opinions. The expectations after last season and the preseason were ridiculous. After signing the contract he often looked like he could be leaving more to the ice. Kind of pushing and skating, flashing several times in a game, but having those weak moments and in some games taking weakish penalties, and as the fans of Kärpät are used to success and the team didn't start as well as usually it was again Pulju who started to get crtitique from some fans. It was kind of funny as he kept creating more chances than anyone else in almost every game and there were players that actually sucked in the team. But that's what happens when people expect one guy to turn the ship alone and when they felt he could, but he just wouldn't.

After the total break due to covid in the team Pulju had some weaker games, but he usually kept attacking relentlessly, organising chances and creating ones. What was different was that he had some clearly worse shifts, he wasn't finishing chances and most importantly, his linemates were constantly wasting chances he kept creating. There were signs of him being maybe out of shape, which is very unusual with him so maybe the virus or at least the long training break had some effect.

Now the negative stuff: I hoped to see more on the PP. It was partly due to the terrible PP the team had, but Pulju was a part of that. I still think he'll be a good PP player in the Oilers, he has all the tools and he was pretty good last year and looked good in the national team, but Kärpät got very little PP time and the PP often sucked so I didn't see enough from Pulju to demand him a place on the 1st unit in the Oilers.

Another negative thing is those 90% shifts, which brought him just enough lows to grab attention of some fans. He can't afford to have those in the Oilers and I'm sure he knows that. It'll be crucial that his game looks like it did last year, he's leaving it all to the ice in every shift.

Then to good things: His highs were incredibly high. From what I saw on even strength his highs were clearly above other NHL players like Kotkaniemi and Suomela. His speed and maybe also acceleration is phenominal. He gives quick and accurate passes. He forechecks extremely well. His shot is tough but unfortunately could still be more accurate. Last spring he played great hockey and shined in the national team against very tough opponents.

As I wrote earlier Kotkaniemi had a hard time on even strength, I didn't see much of his last games so maybe those were better, but if that's the case it isn't seen in his stats. He scored only 2 ES points and neither of those had much to do with directly creating a great scoring chance. Suomela, who's scored at a 0.3 ppg rate in the NHL in his limited games during the last two seasons also scored only 2 ES points (one primary, one 2nd assist). I believe the reason for all these is the NHL contract in the pocket.

Last season Pulju's corsi was the best of the league and this season it's been even a bit higher. He's pushing the game to the offensive zone all the time. That's were I believe he's world class. He actually did that pretty well in the Oilers at first, but towards the end he was losing that among many other things. He's currently quite far from the league leaders in scoring, so many understandably use that as a way to see him as a disappointment. However, he's still on pace for terrific 28 goals per full season.

I dare to say some of his highs are something you don't see often in the FEL even like this season with several NHL players or lockout seasons. The big question is if the mediocre or even weak shifts are signs he isn't quite as ready as it looked after last season or if the NHL contract plays a big part behind them.

I'm not saying what is the right way to see it, but I believe as firmly as ever that he'll become a very important player for the Oilers. For sure there's been some issues (like his frustration when the others kept failing to score and wasting his own chances) that remind me of potential problems, but then I think about the developement I've seen with my own eyes, paint the picture of him flying past others and think about how much more mature he seems and yes - I feel positive about his return.
 

TopShelfGloveSide

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It sounds funny now, but in the last preseason Khaira, Strome and Pulju formed a very good line. McLellan broke the line for the first game and Pulju was dropped to the 4th line for the 2nd game and since that things kept going mainly downhill. For all three actually.

E: As written above yes they also had some good games with Nuge. At the time Khaira wasn't as bad, but he did have his shortcomings already then.
Well right now JJ is barely an NHL player, I hope JP is given a shot with players that have a lot more skill.
 

Aerchon

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He is signed for 2 more years on a great contract. His last two seasons are promising and his greatest negative is also his greatest positive at the moment.

The FEL is not the NHL. He has shown a decent level of success in the nhl prior to injury. One would assume he "should" be better than he was and he was already a decent 3rd liner in many ways. Much like some players play better at the nhl level versus ahl there is a chance that Puljujarvi will have more success with structure and talent around him.

We are just going to have to wait and see how good his development transfers to the nhl but it's hard to imagine he will be worse than previous or worse than his salary. He probably only needs to score 10 even strength goals to out perform his contract. Something he has already done in the nhl i believe.
 

GOilers88

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Has JP played his off wing at all? Any chance Yamo could if he can't?

The above post saying JP might fit better with someone like Drai who slows the game down maybe has some merit and I wonder if maybe trying a JP/Drai/Yamo line might be an option?
 

TopShelfGloveSide

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Has JP played his off wing at all? Any chance Yamo could if he can't?

The above post saying JP might fit better with someone like Drai who slows the game down maybe has some merit and I wonder if maybe trying a JP/Drai/Yamo line might be an option?
No thanks. IMO JP needs to prove something before I pencil him in the lineup with the reigning top dog of the NHL.
 
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GOilers88

#DustersWinCups
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No thanks. IMO JP needs to prove something before I pencil him in the lineup with the reigning top dog of the NHL.
Fair enough, but I'm talking like pre season/whatever camp they get. I definitely don't think he should be gifted anything, but I imagine there will be some experimenting with all the new bodies early on.
 

Zaddy

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Puljujarvi would work good with a guy that slows the game down and feeds him open opportunities and rushes. I still think McDavid is all wrong for him. Someone like Aho or Draisailt are just better fits with him.

I don't know. Pulju isn't great at playing a slow game. He seems to think he's a skill guy who makes plays off the rush. That's how he was successful at the WJC. But that style does not work for him in the NHL because he's simply not skilled enough, nor does he have enough finishing ability. I've said it ad nauseam but he really needs to incorporate a grinding style to his game. It's the only way he can be a useful NHLer and have a long career. The guy is 6'4, 200 lbs with wide shoulders. He's huge. If only he started using that size to his advantage...
 

tellermine

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I don't know. Pulju isn't great at playing a slow game. He seems to think he's a skill guy who makes plays off the rush. That's how he was successful at the WJC. But that style does not work for him in the NHL because he's simply not skilled enough, nor does he have enough finishing ability. I've said it ad nauseam but he really needs to incorporate a grinding style to his game. It's the only way he can be a useful NHLer and have a long career. The guy is 6'4, 200 lbs with wide shoulders. He's huge. If only he started using that size to his advantage...

Amen.
If Puljujärvi can get himself really usi g his body and power he just might develop to a good third line or second.
It is Interesting to see what he does in NHL in boards and front if the net.
 
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Drivesaitl

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I think You may be right. And we already know he excelled playing with Aho. And there was this one game with Draisaitl when Pulju was chosen as the first star of the game. Although there were some good games with McDavid too. Maybe it was because at the time McDavid was playing sick? Was he accidentally slowing the game down because of it? I couldn’t tell.

He also seems to fit well with another linemate who heavily forechecks too, like Khaira, last season with Lammikko and maybe Laine too. They are tilting the ice and the play is more often in the offensive zone than in the defensive zone.

And there was this one time at band camp...;)

Its not really much to say that there looked to be a connection in one game. Most of the time there wasn't. Drai plays a cerebral game. He's benefitted when guys can read off of him for instance Nuge being astute enough to play well with him.
 

Drivesaitl

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It sounds funny now, but in the last preseason Khaira, Strome and Pulju formed a very good line. McLellan broke the line for the first game and Pulju was dropped to the 4th line for the 2nd game and since that things kept going mainly downhill. For all three actually.

E: As written above yes they also had some good games with Nuge. At the time Khaira wasn't as bad, but he did have his shortcomings already then.

This is the problem with a large part of comments on this thread. That there is a continental divide. Some posters familiar with Pulju in Europe, most posters familiar with whats going on here.

Khaira is an awful player and the most likely to get voted off the island by fans. The only useful purpose he serves is PK and you can train a lot of players to do that one facet. If he was a strong or even intermediate EV player, fine, but Khaira does nothing EV, and his game has dropped right out of the sky since Strome was here.

Lets just say the premise that Khaira would, or is, helping any NHL player or linemate at this tenure is unlikely. Thats the most polite way I can put it. ;)

Strome isn't here, McLellan isn't here, and Khaira shouldn't be.

Small blessings of it being late 2020.
 
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Aerchon

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And there was this one time at band camp...;)

Its not really much to say that there looked to be a connection in one game. Most of the time there wasn't. Drai plays a cerebral game. He's benefitted when guys can read off of him for instance Nuge being astute enough to play well with him.

I agree with this. Nuge and Yama both read well off each other as well and do well in tight with little time. Draisaitl I believe can play and succeed with anyone but he works better with quick hands and quick thinker.

McDavid does as well but to a much lessee extent. It is very common for McDavid to dips you doodle and pass it to a spot no one is even close to because he is just too fast and no one can read him. Enter Puljujarvi. A player that seeks open ice. Pushes hard through the neutral zone. McDavid can and does work with players like Puljujarvi very well. The Maroons, the Chaisson, the Kassian. Guys that push hard to get to somewhere, which imo Puljujarvi does as well.

I think McDavid Puljujarvi could be something great but it will require Puljujarvi to really buckle down and improve his game around the net. Battling for position etc...
 
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Drivesaitl

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I agree with this. Nuge and Yama both read well off each other as well and do well in tight with little time. Draisaitl I believe can play and succeed with anyone but he works better with quick hands and quick thinker.

McDavid does as well but to a much lessee extent. It is very common for McDavid to dips you doodle and pass it to a spot no one is even close to because he is just too fast and no one can read him. Enter Puljujarvi. A player that seeks open ice. Pushes hard through the neutral zone. McDavid can and does work with players like Puljujarvi very well. The Maroons, the Chaisson, the Kassian. Guys that push hard to get to somewhere, which imo Puljujarvi does as well.

I think McDavid Puljujarvi could be something great but it will require Puljujarvi to really buckle down and improve his game around the net. Battling for position etc...

Yep, big guy like Pulju has to use the body much more and use it to get in position. Would have him watching Phil Esposito or Ryan Smyth tapes all day. Pulju is reasonably good at chaos plays, getting bounces and rebounds around the net, and at this level he seems more suited to that then trying to score Guy Lafleur goals off the wing, which don't happen often in todays NHL. Pulju may get open, or think he's open on NHL ice, but the passing lanes to get him the puck are often covered here. The same spots, positions he takes in Europe don't necessarily work here as ice is small and coverage much better at a much higher level of hockey in the NHL.

To that end I'm not sure how helpful the extended foray into Europe play will be. I think we again see growing pains when he comes back to NHL and realizes how hard it is here again.
 
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Behind Enemy Lines

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I think there is an NHL third liner until proven otherwise. The Oil have committed to a secure position with consistent line mates and security of a two year contract to 'discover' what they (and Puljujarvi) have. The issue remains for me:

i. Does Puljujarvi have sufficient hockey IQ to process and react the game at its highest, NHL level?
ii. Does Pujujarvi have the internal 'pilot light' aka determination, grit and resilience to battle through adversity that exists at the game's highest, NHL level?

If the answer is yes to both, we might see a prospective higher end NHL player. If no, then, the future is bottom six.

On the latter, it does make my spider senses go off a wee bit as Puljujarvi cooled off so dramatically after signing the NHL contract. Is there a willing to settle/pull the chute mentality possibly? Is he saving himself from potential injury? We're spoiled as Oiler fans who see how McDavid and Draisaitl approach their training and play. There is never a let up and always pushing themselves to more. I'm not doubting Puljujarvi but he's definitely been off after blazing so bright the last year and a half in the home league.
 
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