Player Discussion Jesse Puljujärvi 4th Overall 2016 Draft. Part IV

[Joey Moss]

just for fun: what would it take to get puljujarrvi to canucks?

#5oa + hutton?

Hutton isn't really a fit here and I don't think it's enough value wise anyways.

 

[GameChanger]

For me the flashes and consistency stands out, which make perfect sense. The problem this year is that two other 18 year olds tore it up. Remind me of the last time an 18 year old 3rd overall did that.

Anyhow I agree 100% that we did see flashes of greatness. That is why I think his future is bright with the oilers.

Don't leave for too long, I enjoy discussing with you since you never resort to %%%% arguments. Even if we don't see eye to eye it is good to speak with a poster who replies and think about what he/she is writing.

Thank you for your kind words! I could say the same back to you.

I didn't mean to leave this thread for ever, but thought I've done my share to defend Pulju for now. I was just amazed to see that suddenly several people said that he's never really performed at the NHL level. The stats I mentioned weren't always taken too seriously so I wanted to show that I'm not the only one who thought at some point he was playing very well especially for someone so young. It's just very easy to remember the last games where he played very little and wasn't at his best.

I think that if Jesse manages to raise his basic level to the highest he's had so far he will be a terrific asset already next year. Consistency is exactly what he needs to work on. Also as for the other two 18-year-olds, you are correct. However, one of them spoke pretty good English and played most of the season with some of the best players in NHL and was allowed to make a lot of mistakes, while the other one was almost a year older than Pulju and had played in NA almost all his life. That's why I think we just need some patience now.

 

[McFlyingV]

I think it would have to be an NHL player and a cap dump coming back with pulijaarvi.

Pulijaarvi + Pouliot for Sutter + 5th pick

Something like that

Really don't want much to do with Sutter at his AAV. Has to be one of the most overrated players in the league making almost 4.5M. I understand the intrigue in getting a #3C and trading Nuge, but when its only saving you 1.5M in cap space and you're giving up a potential 1st line winger with size who can shoot and skate then its really not worth it. I don't have a ton of confidence in the 5th OA pick in this draft becoming a top line player.

 

[Donuts]

I think it would have to be an NHL player and a cap dump coming back with pulijaarvi.

Puljujarrvi + Pouliot for Sutter + 5th pick

Something like that

i think i'd do that deal. canucks can take a cap dump at this point of their rebuild

 

[MessierII]

Really don't want much to do with Sutter at his AAV. Has to be one of the most overrated players in the league making almost 4.5M. I understand the intrigue in getting a #3C and trading Nuge, but when its only saving you 1.5M in cap space and you're giving up a potential 1st line winger with size who can shoot and skate then its really not worth it. I don't have a ton of confidence in the 5th OA pick in this draft becoming a top line player.

No i ageee I still wouldnt do it. Just offering a more realistic premise than the one the Canuck fan threw out.

 

[McFlyingV]

Thank you for your kind words! I could say the same back to you.

I didn't mean to leave this thread for ever, but thought I've done my share to defend Pulju for now. I was just amazed to see that suddenly several people said that he's never really performed at the NHL level. The stats I mentioned weren't always taken too seriously so I wanted to show that I'm not the only one who thought at some point he was playing very well especially for someone so young. It's just very easy to remember the last games where he played very little and wasn't at his best.

I think that if Jesse manages to raise his basic level to the highest he's had so far he will be a terrific asset already next year. Consistency is exactly what he needs to work on. Also as for the other two 18-year-olds, you are correct. However, one of them spoke good English and played most of the season with some of the best players in NHL and was allowed to make a lot of mistakes, while the other one was almost a year older than Pulju and had played in NA almost all his life. That's why I think we just need some patience now.

Yeah I definitely don't agree with people saying that he never showed anything at the NHL level. He was really starting to find his game before he took that knee to the thigh against the Islanders that kept him out for a game and he unfortunately never seemed to get back into the groove long enough to keep it going. That was coming off a fantastic game against the Rangers where he picked up an assist on that shot block 2 on 1 he created, and got robbed twice (once on a onetimer from the point, and another where he walked through the D on a partial breakaway, but Lundqvist made a nice glove save on both).

 

[McFlyingV]

No i ageee I still wouldnt do it. Just offering a more realistic premise than the one the Canuck fan threw out.

Thats fair. I understand the logic behind the idea, but I agree we need to keep Puljujarvi. Him developing into a good 1st liner is what could make or break this team being a long-time contender. That and whatever happens with Eberle and Nuge in terms of trades or potential development (I think there's still a chance Nuge could take the next step, while I'm fairly certain we've see the best Eberle has to offer).

 

[MessierII]

Thats fair. I understand the logic behind the idea, but I agree we need to keep Puljujarvi. Him developing into a good 1st liner is what could make or break this team being a long-time contender. That and whatever happens with Eberle and Nuge in terms of trades or potential development (I think there's still a chance Nuge could take the next step, while I'm fairly certain we've see the best Eberle has to offer).

Im pretty high on Jesse and I'm willing to be patient with him. His upside is too good not to be.

 

[Consultant]

Kid is worn out after a long long year away from home.
He played a lot of hockey and had a lot of new experiences.
The tool kit is still there and it is still very impressive. He is worn out. Let him go home after the Worlds, relax for a bit, eat some home cooking then spend the summer perfecting that much needed RH one timer.
He turns 19 on Sunday, he is so young, the idea of giving up on him is nothing short of ridiculous. By 21 he will be a top 6, 1st PP NHL'er.

 

[Hockeyisl1fe]

Aho-Filppula-Aaltonen Miro
Savinainen-Pihlström-Rantanen
AaltonenJM-Kemppainen-Pyörälä
Osala-Lajunen-Hännikäinen

Puljujärvi as an extra forward... that team is just absymal. Check out our elite 2nd line center's production this season from eliteprospects... yes, he is a winger in his KHL team.

 

[GameChanger]

Yeah I definitely don't agree with people saying that he never showed anything at the NHL level. He was really starting to find his game before he took that knee to the thigh against the Islanders that kept him out for a game and he unfortunately never seemed to get back into the groove long enough to keep it going. That was coming off a fantastic game against the Rangers where he picked up an assist on that shot block 2 on 1 he created, and got robbed twice (once on a onetimer from the point, and another where he walked through the D on a partial breakaway, but Lundqvist made a nice glove save on both).

Yes I understand that people have different opinions. I also realize that it's natural for human mind to start concentrating on the last games one has seen. And I also realize that me not watching the last, obviously more difficult games affects the way I see Pulju. I just don't think there is denying that for quite a few games it was almost a concensus that Jesse was playing at a very good level. The evidence is still found on the net and unlike some others I do think the good /60 min stats are not just luck.

You are right in that Pulju possibly had the best games before the injury. After that he had a couple of mediocre ones, but then had some pretty good ones again. At the start of the season he also hit the posts several times, so maybe with some luck that could've given him a better start to the season. Anyway, it'll be intersting to see how he'll do after the summer. Sorry for repeating myself, now I'm done.

 

[McFlyingV]

Yes I understand that people have different opinions. I also realize that it's natural for human mind to start concentrating on the last games one has seen. And I also realize that me not watching the last, obviously more difficult games affects the way I see Pulju. I just don't think there is denying that for quite a few games it was almost a concensus that Jesse was playing at a very good level. The evidence is still found on the net and unlike some others I do think the good /60 min stats are not just luck.

You are right in that Pulju possibly had the best games before the injury. After that he had a couple of mediocre ones, but then had some pretty good ones again. At the start of the season he also hit the posts several times, so maybe with some luck that could've given him a better start to the season. Anyway, it'll be intersting to see how he'll do after the summer. Sorry for repeating myself, now I'm done.

Agreed on all accounts, and he was buzzing in that 3 minutes of the Islanders game before he got injured. He had ups and downs from that point on, but I'm still very high on Jesse. Kid showed his elite talent in back to back U20 WJC's and the U18's last year. As he gets stronger and used to having less time and space at the NHL level I think he'll become a good to elite 1st line winger. Once he fills out his combination of puck protection, speed, wicked wrister and one-timer, and playmaking is going to be awesome to watch.

I still drool at the thought of a Pulju-Lucic-Draisaitl-McDavid-Klefbom power play. Then again I think there's also the potential that you could play Puljujarvi on the 2nd unit as the PPQB because he's a threat to shoot or zip a pass through the seam from the left half wall which would better compliment our LHD that play the PP. He was really fun to watch on the Finn's PP in the U18's and U20's.

 

[Soli]

Snap hasty decision: Recall him, rather have him experiencing playoff atmosphere then eating baguettes in the press box.

Calmer take: he's still more likely to play then he is with the Oilers.

 

[Roof Daddy]

Snap hasty decision: Recall him, rather have him experiencing playoff atmosphere then eating baguettes in the press box.

Calmer take: he's still more likely to play then he is with the Oilers.

I'd bring him back over to the Oil. He couldn't play any worse than Eberle. If Slepy is sticking on the 2nd line (and he deserves to), I think Puljujarvi is a much more effective 4th liner than Ebs. That floater needs to sit.

 

[Jumptheshark]

If Pizza boy does not play in paris I will be pissed

 

[Lempo]

Snap hasty decision: Recall him, rather have him experiencing playoff atmosphere then eating baguettes in the press box.

Calmer take: he's still more likely to play then he is with the Oilers.

The thing to remember is that he's a prospect for the Team Finland too, and riding the fame from the escapades a year back. His making to the team with the AHL pedigree is a very special consideration to begin with, and the idea is to drive him into the game and then have him be useful for years and years to come. There's no chance he won't play.

In the last tournament the 13th forward going in was one Sebastian Aho, who jumped from third to first line in the progression when the supposed top guys weren't delivering from the get-go. If I had to guess there will be top guy deliverance issues this time too. He's not a scratch, he's, to use the Finnish baseball terminology, a 'hitter joker', the guy who steps in to take the spot mid-game.

 

[syz]

I would be surprised if he had the gas in the tank to step into a second round playoff game and contribute anyways, even if Eberle is setting the bar low.

 

[PeakMcOil]

I would be surprised if he had the gas in the tank to step into a second round playoff game and contribute anyways, even if Eberle is setting the bar low.

He's a young guy, potentially playing in his first playoff game. I think he'd have a ton of jump. I'd be worried about his defensive play in the playoffs, but it would be hard to play worse than Eberle at this point.

I really thought Eberle would step up his game, and he was actually ok even without scoring in the first round, but God he's been bad.

 

[Narow]

Wow just wow...

I have now witnessed how to completely destroy a promising teenagers confidence in less than a year. Great

 

[Hockeyisl1fe]

Wow just wow...

I have now witnessed how to completely destroy a promising teenagers confidence in less than a year. Great

It started already in 2014-15 season by Marjamäki. Playing great in 2nd division and occasionally called up for Kärpät to be healthy scratched.... reminder that he was first and foremost an offensive player in juniors and Marjamäki wanted him to become a 2way player. He had no ****ing clue how to develop him. Also I don't think it was a good idea to stay in Kärpät, where Marjamäki had his strict system with no offensive creativity allowed. I'm more and more concerned whether he'll ever be a high producing player. Just a shame if that happens, since he produced better than Laine in juniors and Mestis.

 

[GameChanger]

It started already in 2014-15 season by Marjamäki. Playing great in 2nd division and occasionally called up for Kärpät to be healthy scratched.... reminder that he was first and foremost an offensive player in juniors and Marjamäki wanted him to become a 2way player. He had no ****ing clue how to develop him. Also I don't think it was a good idea to stay in Kärpät, where Marjamäki had his strict system with no offensive creativity allowed. I'm more and more concerned whether he'll ever be a high producing player. Just a shame if that happens, since he produced better than Laine in juniors and Mestis.

You have a point but I don't think the situation was quite that bad. When Pulju was 16 he actually started the FEL very well. I think it was a clear mistake for Marjamäki to drop him to the 2nd league. At that time Kärpät had the best and the fullest roster in the league, so that affected the decision.

A year later he came back and had to learn the strict defensive role and you may be right in saying that it wasn't best for Pulju's development. However, he did polish his defensive game during that period and we saw some of that effect during this year. Pulju also had a very strong spring, even having a better PPG than Laine in the regular season and slightly in the playoffs too. So I don't think he'd lost it completely by that. Also the performance at U20 and U18 was excellent and there was absolutely no sign of him having trouble with the offensive game.

It also looked he was starting to get it this year, but he was suddenly dropped out of the lineup and I think that's where some harm was done. There's a lot of ifs and buts, but I believe it's not too late to get the offensive potential out yet. If he'd played in the first line he'd probably been a 50-point player (or even more) and no-one would be worried. Or if Laine had been kept in the lower lines there's a good chance people would be thinking he's a bust. It's just different career paths and very different teams so I'm being patient, but I do expect Oilers to have a different approach next year or otherwise I hope they sell Pulju to another team with more room in the roster.

 

[BB88]

Snap hasty decision: Recall him, rather have him experiencing playoff atmosphere then eating baguettes in the press box.

Calmer take: he's still more likely to play then he is with the Oilers.

I just hate this pathetic mess.

Not a single forward did anything in the EHT tourney and Pulju gets the extra forward role. Not once did the team have controlled offensive pressure outside of pp.
We have a 4th line winger as a #2C, J.Aaltonen who's done absolutely nothing in the lineup over Pulju.

Instead of giving Pulju the chance to build his confidence against weaker teams Marjamaki is determined to destroy it. What a pathetic mess.
This team was a joke week ago but it just keeps getting worse.

 

[Hockeyisl1fe]

I just hate this pathetic mess.

Not a single forward did anything in the EHT tourney and Pulju gets the extra forward role. Not once did the team have controlled offensive pressure outside of pp.
We have a 4th line winger as a #2C, J.Aaltonen who's done absolutely nothing in the lineup over Pulju.

Instead of giving Pulju the chance to build his confidence against weaker teams Marjamaki is determined to destroy it. What a pathetic mess.
This team was a joke week ago but it just keeps getting worse.

Yeah... I would have been fine with the decision to scratch him if he hadn't got his game going vs the likes of Belarus and Germany. Now... if he gets his chance, it's against tougher competition. What the **** is Marjamäki thinking??? Sack him already, I'm quite done with this bs.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

He's Eberle's replacement AFAIK.

 

[ChicagoBullsFan]

Yeah... I would have been fine with the decision to scratch him if he hadn't got his game going vs the likes of Belarus and Germany. Now... if he gets his chance, it's against tougher competition. What the **** is Marjamäki thinking??? Sack him already, I'm quite done with this bs.

Germany isn't Finland's group in Paris it's France.
We don't know what Marjamäki is thinking and does he have even brains.

But i can agree that those lineups are ****ed up so badly as ever possible.
Who's getting cut on the roster if Lehterä joins Finland's team St Louis is down 3-1 versus Nashville.
Getting Lehterä in the team would be good because then Finland has 2nd line center ( Lehterä).

But getting Lehterä 2nd line Center means that either of Sallinen and Puljujärvi gets cut.