Player Discussion Jesperi Kotkaniemi (Part X)

[DangerDave]

So, it looks like Cody Glass will be starting the season flanked by Stone and Pacioretty.

Crazy, crazy I say!

How does a brand new franchise have better scouting than us lol.

 

[Mrb1p]

How does a brand new franchise have better scouting than us lol.

A better everything than us, lol.

 

[ECWHSWI]

A better everything than us, lol.

SC final the 1st year of existence, pretty much added a full top 6 line the second year... no 8 year bullshit.

 

[Mrb1p]

SC final the 1st year of existence, pretty much added a full top 6 line the second year... no 8 year bull****.

And making profits like crazy too, I bet.

 

[cphabs]

Seems like it's not only in Montréal they don't play their 18/19 yrs old on the 1st line. Weird! How can it be!

FTFY

Bit of a generalization.

 

[CheldishGamibno]

A player age should have absolutely no weight on his value to a team. If management judges a kid is good enough, hes good enough.

I'm just saying it is very rare to see a 18/19 year old playing on the first line in the NHL. I'm not talking about stars like McDavid/Crosby/Matthews but about players on KK's talent spectrum.

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

I see KK becoming another Saku in a few years, a second pairing C when he reaches his prime.

The team still desperately needs a top C. Domi exceeded expectations last year. It remains to be seen if he can repeat. As for Danault, they are still repeating the same old dumb mistakes as they did with DD. Because of Danault's heritage, they promote him to the first line.

 

[sandviper]

How does a brand new franchise have better scouting than us lol.

Built a Stanley Cup Finalist in one weekend.

 

[Hins77]

What i didnt like with his selection, it was When Timmins said he was younger than Brady Tkachuk. Yeah right, but does New jersey took Byram instead of Jack Hugues because he is younger? No. At the end, 10 month is nothing. tkachuk was just already a Bull and we knew his potential and he will probably reach it. KK can turn in another Radek Bonk

 

[Gally11]

Everyone turned on KK so fast lol holy relax. Did everyone just suddenly forget how brilliant is game can be.

 

[ArtPeur]

Everyone turned on KK so fast lol holy relax. Did everyone just suddenly forget how brilliant is game can be.

Like Drouin?

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

Everyone turned on KK so fast lol holy relax. Did everyone just suddenly forget how brilliant is game can be.

Its really not that surprising.
There were people on this board who turned on KK after some development camp scrimmages last year...

 

[Kriss E]

I see KK becoming another Saku in a few years, a second pairing C when he reaches his prime.

The team still desperately needs a top C. Domi exceeded expectations last year. It remains to be seen if he can repeat. As for Danault, they are still repeating the same old dumb mistakes as they did with DD. Because of Danault's heritage, they promote him to the first line.

Koivu was on his way to becoming a legit star center until he blew his knee. Such a shame.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

What i didnt like with his selection, it was When Timmins said he was younger than Brady Tkachuk. Yeah right, but does New jersey took Byram instead of Jack Hugues because he is younger? No. At the end, 10 month is nothing. tkachuk was just already a Bull and we knew his potential and he will probably reach it. KK can turn in another Radek Bonk

This is why I was never high on KK. While young and talented, he just didn’t have 3rd overall talent to me. Everyone wanted the next Elias Pettersson, but Pettersson has an electric skill set and is just a dynamic and explosive player. KKs got skills, but I just didn’t see this sky high potential that made him worth gambling on over sure fire studs.

 

[Andrei79]

What i didnt like with his selection, it was When Timmins said he was younger than Brady Tkachuk. Yeah right, but does New jersey took Byram instead of Jack Hugues because he is younger? No. At the end, 10 month is nothing. tkachuk was just already a Bull and we knew his potential and he will probably reach it. KK can turn in another Radek Bonk

Byram and Hughes are a month apart. Tkachuk is almost a full year older, which is significant at that age. I mean, what are you even talking about ?

 

[jedimyrmidon]

What i didnt like with his selection, it was When Timmins said he was younger than Brady Tkachuk. Yeah right, but does New jersey took Byram instead of Jack Hugues because he is younger? No. At the end, 10 month is nothing. tkachuk was just already a Bull and we knew his potential and he will probably reach it. KK can turn in another Radek Bonk

10 months (almost 1 year) is huge at that point in a player's development... It's why there are very different expectations between a player's draft-1 and draft year. Or why draft-1 players are not compared directly with draft eligible players unless they are truly exceptional.

 

[waffledave]

10 months (almost 1 year) is huge at that point in a player's development... It's why there are very different expectations between a player's draft-1 and draft year. Or why draft-1 players are not compared directly with draft eligible players unless they are truly exceptional.

Man this guy drafts.

 

[Hins77]

Byram and Hughes are a month apart. Tkachuk is almost a full year older, which is significant at that age. I mean, what are you even talking about ?

Well, Hischier was 5/6 month older than Nolan Patrick and new jersey took him first. So, i know that a year a this age can be huge. But, what is the problem to already know what a guy like Brady Tkachuk can bring? We took the guy in KK who is more about projection, but a curve can goes down too, and not just going up. So, imo. We had a sure bet in Tkachuk and and we took the second one, a project in KK. And imo, if KK become a good 2nd centerman we will be lucky

 

[Andrei79]

Well, Hischier was 5/6 month older than Nolan Patrick and new jersey took him first. So, i know that a year a this age can be huge. But, what is the problem to already know what a guy like Brady Tkachuk can bring? We took the guy in KK who is more about projection, but a curve can goes down too, and not just going up. So, imo. We had a sure bet in Tkachuk and and we took the second one, a project in KK. And imo, if KK become a good 2nd centerman we will be lucky

You're not making much sense here. Hischier, for one, was 6 months younger. No offense, but that was easily verifiably information, like about 5-6 clicks away.

And there's nothing showing Kotka didn't keep progressing. He had one of the best U18 seasons in Liiga history. Then, he beat expectations by making the NHL at 18 while already being a good 3rd line center. Which is why its strange for someone to say the team will be lucky if he becomes a good 2C. How does his trajectory up to now make you think that ?

 

[Hins77]

You're not making much sense here. Hischier, for one, was 6 months younger. No offense, but that was easily verifiably information, like about 5-6 clicks away.

And there's nothing showing Kotka didn't keep progressing. He had one of the best U18 seasons in Liiga history. Then, he beat expectations by making the NHL at 18 while already being a good 3rd line center. Which is why its strange for someone to say the team will be lucky if he becomes a good 2C. How does his trajectory up to now make you think that ?

I thought Hischier was older. But i don’t care. I made a litte research after it. Auston Matthews is older than Dubois and Laine by a year and hes been picked first. And i don’t think today Toronto would take any of those player instead of Matthews. What is my point. Tkachuk would be something that Montreal doesnt have and we didnt pick him. Thats it

 

[Andrei79]

I thought Hischier was older. But i don’t care. I made a litte research after it. Auston Matthews is older than Dubois and Laine by a year and hes been picked first. And i don’t think today Toronto would take any of those player instead of Matthews. What is my point. Tkachuk would be something that Montreal doesnt have and we didnt pick him. Thats it

I know you don't care, you've been making that pretty evident.

I would have wanted Matthews over Laine as well. I mean why not ? He was a big center who broke all kinds of records at 17 and dominated against men at 18. Is this who you're comparing Tkachuk to ? A player who was seen as a potential generational player ? Come on.

Bringing up Dubois actually contradicts whatever point you were trying to make here. Columbus went with the big center who seemed less of a finished product than Puljujarvi, who was consensus number 3 all year.

 

[Andrei79]

This is why I was never high on KK. While young and talented, he just didn’t have 3rd overall talent to me. Everyone wanted the next Elias Pettersson, but Pettersson has an electric skill set and is just a dynamic and explosive player. KKs got skills, but I just didn’t see this sky high potential that made him worth gambling on over sure fire studs.

You said a lot of things though. You said you were low on bim based on his WJC. You said you wanted Zadina. Somehow, picking Zadina made even more sense with the Galchenyuk and the impending Pacioretty trade. Now, Zadina still looked like crap in preseason and is going down. And somehow, I dont expect KK to play in the AHL next year.

My opinion is that it might be wise to wait until the season actually starts and he plays a few meaningful games. What do you think ?

 

[Andrei79]

Its really not that surprising.
There were people on this board who turned on KK after some development camp scrimmages last year...

Just look at the Suzuki thread from the rookie camp to the main camp, like two weeks apart, for some more of this kind of insanity.

 

[Andrei79]

How does a brand new franchise have better scouting than us lol.

Brand new franchise actually poached their head scout from us.

 

[Hins77]

I know you don't care, you've been making that pretty evident.

I would have wanted Matthews over Laine as well. I mean why not ? He was a big center who broke all kinds of records at 17 and dominated against men at 18. Is this who you're comparing Tkachuk too ? A player who was seen as a potential generational player ? Come on.

Bringing up Dubois actually contradicts whatever point you were trying to make here. Columbus went with the big center who seemed less of a finished product than Puljujarvi, who was consensus number 3 all year.

I didnt compare Matthews with Tkachuk. They werent in the same draft. I just have no problem to take a guy older than a guy younger. Kotkaniemi will be good. But i just don’t see him like an Elite player