Player Discussion Jesperi Kotkaniemi (Part 11)

[417]

With all due respect, I'd like to see the actual % (not below or above 50%).

Not sure I have the time or patience to post every faceoff stat for his 79 games played last year...

You can find the information here in his game logs

Jesperi Kotkaniemi | Montreal Canadiens | National Hockey League | Yahoo! Sports

Focus specifically on his faceoffs and icetime prior to February 11th and after February 11th.

And how does Thompson hurt Kotkaniemi's face off %? Cause he is getting less face offs?

Maybe not always less...but situationally, yes.

 

[DangerDave]

The correct course of action seems pretty clear to me at this point. Play KK and Suzuki at center and give them some minutes and use Thompson as an extra or winger.

Let's be real here, this team's window isn't open yet and by the time it does, Thompson will be gone. Live with the mistakes this year and work on fixing them. Next year we'll be much better off for it.

 

[Habs Halifax]

There has been no evidence to suggest that KK should sit on the PP in favor of Weal.

The only thing that makes sense in terms of what they are trying in games is what they see in practice.

 

[417]

At center? I think Kotkaniemi would be doing much better if he had elite level skating but that is not his game.

Skating: Average at best
Strength: Below Average
Skill and Vision: Well Above Average
Hockey IQ: Elite level IMO

He is surviving on his skill, vision, and hockey IQ while we wait for him to get physically stronger. Reality

Precisely...but he currently doesn't have a role on the team, which IMO, is the same as last year. His role and standing on the team shouldn't be the exact same as last year (and IMO, worse).

Every single forward on this roster has a role outside of his regular shift...everyone except Kotkaniemi.

That's just odd if you ask me.

Last year? OK...but this year??? It's like he's a rookie all over again.

Like how is it that Kotkaniemie was on the PP during game 1 of the 2018-19 season...

But he's nowhere to be found so far during the games of the 2019-20 season?

Did the Habs acquire a legit #1C i'm not aware of???

hell even Nick Suzuki has a role on the PP...and at NO POINT, has Suzuki ever looked as good as Kotkaniemi looked last year. Like...not even close.

I'm sorry, again, i'm not big on blaming **** on the coach...but come on man.

 

[Edgy]

I'm aware of his overall stats but what about month to month? The conversation is did he take leaps as the season went along or not?

Faceoffs month by Month.

I'm not doing Corsi too. But faceoffs show some progression from his initial start.

 

[DXStriker]

The correct course of action seems pretty clear to me at this point. Play KK and Suzuki at center and give them some minutes and use Thompson as an extra or winger.

Let's be real here, this team's window isn't open yet and by the time it does, Thompson will be gone. Live with the mistakes this year and work on fixing them. Next year we'll be much better off for it.

We say this every year with (Insert Prospect here) and the same thing happens 90 % of the time lol

it's a weird twilight zone void of hope being taken away one Youngster at a time

 

[Habs Halifax]

Faceoffs month by Month.

View attachment 265187

I'm not doing Corsi too. But faceoffs show some progression from his initial start.

Thanks! Did it take long to gather up?

From what I can see, it don't look like noticeable progression in terms of face-offs alone. Corsi would be also nice to see but I have no idea where you can get that and how long it will take. If anybody wants to spend the time, I'm sure your felling Habs fans would appreciate it!

 

[Edgy]

Thanks! Did it take long to gather up?

From what I can see, it don't look like noticeable progression in terms of face-offs alone. Corsi would be also nice to see but I have no idea where you can get that and how long it will take. If anybody wants to spend the time, I'm sure your felling Habs fans would appreciate it!

Download the CSV file, filter results and input in a separate table with formulas to calculate the percntage. Not long but not exactly readily available and I'm at work.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Can’t believe we’re going to turn a guy who had an 18-year-old season on the level of Barkov into another Eller.


I wish I was joking but i have very little faith in Julien. Playing him on wing was the final straw for me. There are NO glaring errors in his game. There is NO reason to NOT play him on the special teams and put your trust in him to AT LEAST play 16 minutes a game MINIMUM. Julien is a f***ing dinosaur, though.


I don’t think you can kill his career but I think you can severely stunt his growth by instilling the idea that he’ll be demoted for mistakes — which they have done — and it severely affecting his confidence and willingness to push himself to the next level because he knows if he makes one little mistake he’ll be glued to the bench.

 

[angusyoung]

His cardio would be better if Julien played him more than 12 minutes a game.

If he can't handle 12 now because he's dead,play him more? Sounds like he needs to skate more in practice to develop more stamina and strength.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

Kotkaniemi has played an average of 13:42 over his career, since Julien has been our coach here is a list of average TOI for the following scrubs:

Thompson - 13:14
Logan Shaw - 12:25
Dwight King - 12:14
Steve Ott - 11:56
Andreas Martinsen - 11:54
Byron Froese - 11:35
Michael Chaput - 11:13
Kenny Agostino - 11:11
Nic Deslauriers - 10:53

So basically our best C prospect in the last two decades is playing slightly more than a bunch of plugs have/did under Julien.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Kotkaniemi has played an average of 13:42 over his career, since Julien has been our coach here is a list of average TOI for the following scrubs:

Thompson - 13:14
Logan Shaw - 12:25
Dwight King - 12:14
Steve Ott - 11:56
Andreas Martinsen - 11:54
Byron Froese - 11:35
Michael Chaput - 11:13
Kenny Agostino - 11:11
Nic Deslauriers - 10:53

So basically our best C prospect in the last two decades is playing slightly more than a bunch of plugs have/did under Julien.

I rather see compatibles to players at similar age points and potential as a young player. It holes more value than naming off random names who vary in ages.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I'm new at reading this... What does it tell you? As far as I can tell in a 5 min glance, it does not show a huge difference and a noticeable progression? If not true, where is the noticeable progression that stands out to you?

Almost all of his goals were scored later into the season, and the shot differential grew as time went on (you should take the integral of the 3rd graph). It's sorta what you were talking about.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Almost all of his goals were scored later into the season, and the shot differential grew as time went on (you should take the integral of the 3rd graph). It's sorta what you were talking about.

I did try to understand that part... Do you consider this noticeable progression? I don't know, that's why I'm asking. I'm going back to look at it again

 

[salbutera]

The correct course of action seems pretty clear to me at this point. Play KK and Suzuki at center and give them some minutes and use Thompson as an extra or winger.

Let's be real here, this team's window isn't open yet and by the time it does, Thompson will be gone. Live with the mistakes this year and work on fixing them. Next year we'll be much better off for it.

IMO an ownership consortium that has a fairly high debt/equity ratio will not just say “live with the mistakes we’ll be ok when the window opens up...next season will be better”

 

[NotProkofievian]

I did try to understand that part... Do you consider this noticeable progression? I don't know, that's why I'm asking. I'm going back to look at it again

You take your time.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You take your time.

I am a slow learner but on purpose

 

[Tighthead]

IMO an ownership consortium that has a fairly high debt/equity ratio will not just say “live with the mistakes we’ll be ok when the window opens up...next season will be better”

Do we know that to be the case? Franchise value has more than doubled since acquisition.

 

[salbutera]

Do we know that to be the case? Franchise value has more than doubled since acquisition.

“Valuation” per Forbes does not equate to what someone will actually cough up. NYR have close to zero debt, MLSE @ 7%, Habs have significantly more @ 15% tied with Caps for 16th in the league.

If the Rangers or Leafs go on the market demand will blow away the Forbes valuation, not sure there are buyers out there willing to cough up $1.3B for the Mlt marketplace

Montreal Canadiens on the Forbes The Business of Hockey List

 

[Tighthead]

“Valuation” per Forbes does not equate to what someone will actually cough up. NYR have close to zero debt, MLSE @ 7%, Habs have significantly more @ 15% tied with Caps for 16th in the league.

If the Rangers or Leafs go on the market demand will blow away the Forbes valuation, not sure there are buyers out there willing to cough up $1.3B for the Mlt marketplace.

Montreal Canadiens on the Forbes The Business of Hockey List

Valuations are really based on revenue though - I agree Rangers and TML would get more of a premium.

15 per cent really isn't that signigicant - right in the middle of the league.

 

[salbutera]

Valuations are really based on revenue though - I agree Rangers and TML would get more of a premium.

15 per cent really isn't that signigicant - right in the middle of the league.

True - it would be one thing if it was a singular billionaire owner vs a consortium of rich but not really wealthy beings...

 

[Tighthead]

True - it would be one thing if it was a singular billionaire owner vs a consortium of rich but not really wealthy beings...

Do we know much about the breakdown of the ownership group? Is Molson alone a majority or just with his brothers?

 

[salbutera]

Do we know much about the breakdown of the ownership group?

Molson brothers, Andlauer (former Hamilton AHL owner), Bell is there and a bunch of others (incl Woodbridge, the QFL Solidarity Fund, Luc Bertrand and the National Bank Financial Group) but don’t know the % breakdown. I do know neither Geoff/Andrew/Justin Molson or Michael Andlauer aren’t billionaires

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

At this point I'm all for sending him to Laval. Get him the f*** out of Julien's hands and play him as the first line center for the Rocket until we have a proper developmental coach in MTL.

 

[Tighthead]

Molson, Andalauer (former Hamilton AHL owner), Bell is there and a bunch of others but don’t know the % breakdown. I do know Geoff Molson and Michael Andalauer aren’t billionaires

I looked it up and saw the same. I suspect the investment has paid off handsomely.

Would be interested to know if minority owners got non-voting shares, although it may not matter depending on the breakdown. I suspect Molson brothes have RFR over the others, and possibly even option windows at FMV.