Player Discussion Jeff Skinner - Part II

[littletonhockeycoach]

The thresholds we place on somebody's projected contract are likely already obsolete given that the cap continues to grow and that better players who signed at the top of the salary structure a few years ago have been outpaced by it. (I.e.; MacKinnon)

Yeah, mistakes are made. And the Sabres offers have been near disastrous in this category (KO, Moulson, Ville, etc.) but folks who say "they'd never pay that for player x" usually find out that somebody will and does. And that simply establishes a new threshold standard.

I'm less worried about the dollar amount being discussed for Skinner than I am the term. That's where boat anchors get attached get attached to franchises. (Evidence = Okposo's and Moulson's contracts.)

 

[26CornerBlitz]

Yeah, I don't see it happening. What incentive does Skinner have to sign before July 1?

An eighth year on a big money deal.

 

[Mike McDermott]

The thresholds we place on somebody's projected contract are likely already obsolete given that the cap continues to grow and that better players who signed at the top of the salary structure a few years ago have been outpaced by it. (I.e.; MacKinnon)

Yeah, mistakes are made. And the Sabres offers have been near disastrous in this category (KO, Moulson, Ville, etc.) but folks who say "they'd never pay that for player x" usually find out that somebody will and does. And that simply establishes a new threshold standard.

I'm less worried about the dollar amount being discussed for Skinner than I am the term. That's where boat anchors get attached get attached to franchises. (Evidence = Okposo's and Moulson's contracts.)

Well said. Unless it is an insane overpay which I don’t think there can be with Skinner, term is more important.

 

[slip]

I don’t know why I remain hopeful that both sides see the mutual benefit and get something done that is beneficial to both. I know that’s probably crazy talk coming from me, but my gut reaction remains that he’ll be signed and it won’t be completely terrible as a contract.

Edit: there are no metrics to back this up, no information from anyone, just a gut reaction.

Reality's response to Chain's gut:

 

[Montag DP]

An eighth year on a big money deal.

I meant barring a big overpayment. If Botterill is offering anything less than that, there is no reason for Skinner to accept it.

 

[Butt Ox]

If the Sabres were flush with talent that hounded the puck like Skinner does they could afford to let him go. Unfortunately this is not the case. They don't have many whom I would consider to be ferocious competitors. Skinner is a savage in the Ozone.

Not going to say losing Skinner would be comparable to DB48's departure but experientially we know goals in Sabreland are hard to come by. Give the man a payday in line with his peers - the other guys who score 40 goals.

 

[Baccus]

An eighth year on a big money deal.

He can hit July 1st, see what money is out there and come back to Buffalo and ask for the 8th year.

There's really no incentive for him not to do that unless for some reason his camp believes his market will be for less than the Sabres are already offering, in which case he'd be signed already.

 

[Tsyolin]

I've said it a million times and I'll say it again. I have no less faith that he'll sign than I did during ten game win streak.

 

[Tsyolin]

He can hit July 1st, see what money is out there and come back to Buffalo and ask for the 8th year.

There's really no incentive for him not to do that unless for some reason his camp believes his market will be for less than the Sabres are already offering, in which case he'd be signed already.

Pretty sure the 8th year option goes out the window the moment he hits the open market.

 

[MrMaster]

If the Sabres were flush with talent that hounded the puck like Skinner does they could afford to let him go. Unfortunately this is not the case. They don't have many whom I would consider to be ferocious competitors. Skinner is a savage in the Ozone.

Not going to say losing Skinner would be comparable to DB48's departure but experientially we know goals in Sabreland are hard to come by. Give the man a payday in line with his peers - the other guys who score 40 goals.

On a good team he could be a 50 goal scorer, and i think that's what his side is arguing, unfortunately.

 

[Baccus]

Pretty sure the 8th year option goes out the window the moment he hits the open market.

Stamkos signed for 8 after talking to everybody. It may have to be completed before July 1st, but there's the several days of 'legal tampering' or whatever. Calling Dotcom...

 

[GellMann]

Yep, Jeff's going to pull a Stamkos.

 

[dotcommunism]

Stamkos signed for 8 after talking to everybody. It may have to be completed before July 1st, but there's the several days of 'legal tampering' or whatever. Calling Dotcom...

A player who actually becomes an unrestricted free agent (that is, is still unsigned as of July 1) no longer has the option of signing an eight year deal. Stamkos signed during the legal "tampering" period during which he was still under contract with Tampa Bay. Skinner can talk to other teams and get a general idea of what they would offer him (although they can't negotiate or make firm offers), then come back to Buffalo and still sign an eight year deal, as long as it is still June.

 

[tsujimoto74]

I don’t know why I remain hopeful that both sides see the mutual benefit and get something done that is beneficial to both. I know that’s probably crazy talk coming from me, but my gut reaction remains that he’ll be signed and it won’t be completely terrible as a contract.

Edit: there are no metrics to back this up, no information from anyone, just a gut reaction.

Me too. He waived to come here when we were coming off a 31st place finish. While I'm sure he would've been more eager to sign if we'd kept up the early season pace and made the playoffs, I don't see why missing should be a deal-breaker for him. Even with that, I think the streak showed him how exciting Buffalo/its fans can be to play in/for when the team is good. Buffalo's close to home for him (and the only NHL franchise that's closer doesn't even have the cap space to keep their current players, much less make a big UFA splash). He seems to mesh well with the team on and off the ice. We're the only team that can give him an 8th year, which is a huge deal in terms of the total value of the contract.

I thought a deal would've been done a while ago, so the way this is dragging out makes me nervous, but I'm still fairly optimistic.

 

[joshjull]

 

[Husko]

I want to sign him. I’m ready for the big stupid contract. But if we do, Botts better have a plan to start winning now. Just like with EVERY ufa winger contract, you’re paying for the beginning, the end is going to hurt. It opens up a window for us that we have to compete in.

 

[Buffaloed]

They're stuck on whether to use a comma or a semicolon in the 3rd paragraph of the clause on page 22.

 

[Tatre]

They're stuck on whether to use a comma or a semicolon in the 3rd paragraph of the clause on page 22.

At that point, just use a period...

Let him see what's out there; I'm curious what teams would offer as well.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

I bet they’re stuck at 8 vs 8.5 aav at this point.

I don’t think Skinner is even at the table if term is the issue. It’s the biggest thing the Sabres can offer.

 

[Panthaz89]

I want to sign him. I’m ready for the big stupid contract. But if we do, Botts better have a plan to start winning now. Just like with EVERY ufa winger contract, you’re paying for the beginning, the end is going to hurt. It opens up a window for us that we have to compete in.

If there isn't then there is something wrong with him...we have the pieces in place...build up the depth of the team and make impact signings now...stop signing bad vets and taking in bad contracts.

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

If there isn't then there is something wrong with him...we have the pieces in place...build up the depth of the team and make impact signings now...stop signing bad vets and taking in bad contracts.

What bad contracts did Botts bring in? Pominville? That was solely to get Ennis' off the books. Which was a great move considering Poms deal is done and he scored 32 goals the past 2 years compared to the 40 points Ennis scored in that time frame. Hunwick? That is a whopping 2.25 AAV which allowed us to trade for the forward who was our 4th highest scoring forward for only a 4th round pick instead of a 3rd. Hutton deal is small $. Can't mention Scandella since when the deal went down every single person here was ecstatic we acquired him. Unfortunately he fell off drastically. Sobotka has one year left and thanks to Berglund walking away we cleared nearly 10% of the cap long term.

All the big $ contracts still on the roster
in Bogo and Okposo were Murray acquisitions. The one thing we can thank Botts for is cap flexibility. Lest we forget that the last year Murray was at the helm we literally had no cap room and spent to the max to finish bottom 6...again.

When Skinner sees his team he played 8 years for make the ECF the very season they moved him is going to eat at him majorly. He is gone. Barring overpayment he does not want to be on a perpetual loser.

This franchise went from the 4th highest winning % in NHL history to being a decade long laughingstock. This needs to f***ing end.

 

[sabremike]

Sheary was our 4th highest scoring forward because we only had 3 credible NHL quality forwards on our entire roster. The guy is complete toilet water, and while getting him wasn't a bad idea in theory the stupid overpayment for a guy the Pens HAD to get rid of absolutely was.

 

[Jim Bob]

So much truth there.

 

[Buffaloed]

Skinner lost his leverage with the signing of Arttu Ruotsalainen. Botterill just shaved over a million off his offer. Skinner is paying a heavy price for not signing sooner.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Skinner lost his leverage with the signing of Arttu Ruotsalainen. Botterill just shaved over a million off his offer. Skinner is paying a heavy price for not signing sooner.

Gotta pay for that many vowels somehow.